The turning point in the Astros season

[Austin70]

Any thoughts? In my opinion it was game 2 of the four game series in Chicago. When Barrett was jawing at Roy, he just looked at him, smiled and went on shutting them down. The team never backed down after the scrubs hit him and scored 15 runs and won the next two, and had a new attitude.

[Austin70]

mods please move thread, wrong forum.

[RocketMan Tex]

I agree with you 100% Austin. That was definitely the turning point of the season.

[ima_drummer2k]

Berkman's HR in game 3 against the Giants.

I fell asleep thinking the season was over. Woke up the next morning SHOCKED at what had happened.

[fya]

That game in Montreal where the stros came back in extra innings to win it.

[bobrek]

Originally posted by Austin70
Any thoughts? In my opinion it was game 2 of the four game series in Chicago. When Barrett was jawing at Roy, he just looked at him, smiled and went on shutting them down. The team never backed down after the scrubs hit him and scored 15 runs and won the next two, and had a new attitude.

I believe it was the precursor to this when Oswalt hit Barret in the back. Without that incident, he subsequent event would not have happened.

[Groogrux]

Of course, that's also the same game where Rice alum Lance Berkman "stood up" for his teammate by telling the media after the game that if he was Barrett, he'd be pissed off too if he thought he was hit intentionally.

I honestly thought that was it. I foresaw clubhouse turmoil after that idiotic statement. So happy Roy O. was the bigger man and pitched his ass of the rest of the year.

[gwayneco]

I think I should get the credit, because they started playing well just when I stopped watching the games or otherwise paying attention to them ;). Actually, I guess it probably was the Barrett incident.

[Trader_Jorge]

Originally posted by Rocketman95
Of course, that's also the same game where Rice alum Lance Berkman "stood up" for his teammate by telling the media after the game that if he was Barrett, he'd be pissed off too if he thought he was hit intentionally.

I honestly thought that was it. I foresaw clubhouse turmoil after that idiotic statement. So happy Roy O. was the bigger man and pitched his ass of the rest of the year.

Berkman's comment was in no way a slight of Oswalt. His statement is accurate. Any player would feel pissed off if they were intentionally hit by a pitch. Lance is one of the best clubhouse guys around. He's funny and articulate. The Astros have a nice nucleus of well educated guys, including Ensberg, Everett and Lidge. They are great ambassadors of the team.

Lance has been the team MVP at the plate. His statistics are incredible, especially his OBP.

Quit trying to start something.

[DaDakota]

Firing that loser Jimy and bringing in Garner.

DD

[Groogrux]

Originally posted by Trader_Jorge
Berkman's comment was in no way a slight of Oswalt. His statement is accurate. Any player would feel pissed off if they were intentionally hit by a pitch. Lance is one of the best clubhouse guys around. He's funny and articulate.

You never, ever not take up for your guy in the media. The correct response to the question that was asked of him (which was, paraphrasing, "What did you think of Barrett's reaction when Oswalt came up to bat?") would have been, "Who is the world is Michael Barrett to try and start something with one of the best pitchers in the NL". I guarantee you Roy O. wasn't too pleased with what he heard from both Berkman and Bagwell.

The Astros have a nice nucleus of well educated guys, including Ensberg, Everett and Lidge. They are great ambassadors of the team.

I agree with this.

Lance has been the team MVP at the plate. His statistics are incredible, especially his OBP.

I agree with this.

Quit trying to start something.

Get over yourself.

[Trader_Jorge]

The problem is, that wasn't the question. Lance answered the question, not what you thought was the question. Why are you so critical of Lance? He is one of the Astros best players, if not their best player. Why try to make something out of an old comment? The media seems to disagree with your assessment, although they can't read Oswalt's mind like you can.

[Groogrux]

Originally posted by Trader_Jorge
The problem is, that wasn't the question. Lance answered the question, not what you thought was the question. Why are you so critical of Lance? He is one of the Astros best players, if not their best player. Why try to make something out of an old comment? The media seems to disagree with your assessment, although they can't read Oswalt's mind like you can.

I'm just saying how I feel about the comment. He was given a perfect opportunity to take up for Roy O. and pump up the clubhouse, but he blew it right there, IMO. It has nothing to do with Lance. He's been my favorite player since his days at Rice. That comment, along with Bagwell's from a few days before really pissed me off as an Astros' fan, especially since I love both of those guys. Bottom line, I was just professing my surprise that they did turn it around after that whole incident and the two players' reactions to it.

Of course, it all sounds silly now that they've made their historical run, but that's still how I feel about that particular situation.

[redgoose]

I'll go with the Barrett incident as well.

But i also think Berkman's homerun in SF got us back on track after we were losing momentum. I think that helped us win the 7 games in a row after that. Especially since if we'd of lost 1 of those games we might not even be in the playoffs.

[gwayneco]

If Lance is so freakin' smart, why does he run the bases like a 4 year old?

[LongTimeFan]

Originally posted by gwayneco
If Lance is so freakin' smart, why does he run the bases like a 4 year old?

Because we were still up 2-1, and had Lidge coming in that got the 1-2-3

[isoman2kx]

Originally posted by Rocketman95
I'm just saying how I feel about the comment. He was given a perfect opportunity to take up for Roy O. and pump up the clubhouse, but he blew it right there, IMO. It has nothing to do with Lance. He's been my favorite player since his days at Rice. That comment, along with Bagwell's from a few days before really pissed me off as an Astros' fan, especially since I love both of those guys. Bottom line, I was just professing my surprise that they did turn it around after that whole incident and the two players' reactions to it.

Of course, it all sounds silly now that they've made their historical run, but that's still how I feel about that particular situation.

not to keep the thread focused on this one incident..... but I definitely agree.

with the "winning cures all ails" motto , I've forgotten the incident for the most part.

However, it still doesn't excuse Bagwell and Berkman playing the role of complete dicks in the clubhouse.

In that situation, they both should have been behind their ace ONE HUNDRED PERCENT, but they then criticize Roy O at a point in the season was ludacris. In that series, criticism (instead of backing) of your star pitcher was not the sort of thing the team needed to light that postive fire under them to get back on the right track...


eh...... not many hard feelings over it now...... but just sharing my point of view on that particular incident as well.

[Alimoe84]

Does anybody else realize that we haven't lost at home since that Barrett incident? I'm gonna go out on a limb and say thats what changed our season. :)

[BigM]

i love berkman and i love bagwell, great players, outstanding guys(seemingly, i don't know them) but they definitely didn't stand up for their teammate. basically they turned their back on him in the media and it's simple as that. it makes no difference whether it was the honest answer it's just a sh!tty thing to do for team chemistry, particularly when oswalt is one of the main guys carrying the team.
i didn't remember that incident until this thread and i'm sure they've all gotten over it as well but at the time i also thought it was the end of the season.

i guess there could be two turning points, taking the series from the cubs and then that berkman homerun against the giants saving the season the second time.

[Win]

Originally posted by BigM
i love berkman and i love bagwell, great players, outstanding guys(seemingly, i don't know them) but they definitely didn't stand up for their teammate. basically they turned their back on him in the media and it's simple as that. it makes no difference whether it was the honest answer it's just a sh!tty thing to do for team chemistry, particularly when oswalt is one of the main guys carrying the team.
i didn't remember that incident until this thread and i'm sure they've all gotten over it as well but at the time i also thought it was the end of the season.

i guess there could be two turning points, taking the series from the cubs and then that berkman homerun against the giants saving the season the second time.

"Bad for team chemistry"???? You gotta be kidding me. It WAS the catalyst that brought the Astros full circle. Gotta give Scrap credit for knowing how to nurture the team, however. Dude has done a really sweet job.

[BigM]

Originally posted by Win
"Bad for team chemistry"???? You gotta be kidding me. It WAS the catalyst that brought the Astros full circle. Gotta give Scrap credit for knowing how to nurture the team, however. Dude has done a really sweet job.

i'm not talking about the game itself or the confrontation between oswalt or barret. sure that could be the catalyst that started this run. i'm talking about berkman and bagwell turning their back on oswalt in the media. this was before we went on our tear and before anyone in their wildest dreams thought we would make the playoffs. certainly at the time, 2 star players not exactly taking sides with one of their star pitchers isn't exactly a boost for team chemistry.

anyways it makes no difference now.

[Stack24]

Lets just be happy and not worry about when it started, how it started, and all that crap....lets just say we are here and we are going to make some noise...not LOCK THIS UP or everyone just get happy :D

[Buck Turgidson]

Originally posted by gwayneco
If Lance is so freakin' smart, why does he run the bases like a 4 year old?
I've seen 4 year olds with better instincts. Lance definitely has a certain "space cadet" quality to him at times.

[MadMax]

wow...so many turning points, i think. i'm not sure i could point to one, alone...

but the Cubs screwed up royally by pissing of the 'stros. they did the same thing with the Cards earlier in the season. stupid, stuipd, stupid.

and the berkman homer against the giants was huge, too.

what a fun 45 games. just incredible.

[NJRocket]

Originally posted by ima_drummer2k
Berkman's HR in game 3 against the Giants.

I fell asleep thinking the season was over. Woke up the next morning SHOCKED at what had happened.

BINGO

[Austin70]

Originally posted by ima_drummer2k
Berkman's HR in game 3 against the Giants.

I fell asleep thinking the season was over. Woke up the next morning SHOCKED at what had happened.

I feel asleep also, if not for that homerun, we we have had that 1 game playoff, but things had already turned by then.

[DaDakota]

Originally posted by Austin70
I feel asleep also, if not for that homerun, we we have had that 1 game playoff, but things had already turned by then.

No, the Giants would have finished one game up on us.

DD

[MadMax]

Originally posted by DaDakota
No, the Giants would have finished one game up on us.

DD

how??? there's a one game difference in the win and loss column, today. we would lose one...they win one...they gain a game...they're tied.

[Oski2005]

I believe it was when I started watching the games again.

[codell]

Originally posted by MadMax
how??? there's a one game difference in the win and loss column, today. we would lose one...they win one...they gain a game...they're tied.

We finished the season 92-70, with the Giants finishing 1 game back at 91-71.

If the Giants had won that game, in theory, they would have finished 92-70 with us finishing 91-71............ 1 game behind.

[MadMax]

Originally posted by codell
We finished the season 92-70, with the Giants finishing 1 game back at 91-71.

If the Giants had won that game, in theory, they would have finished 92-70 with us finishing 91-71............ 1 game behind.

Exhibit A for why MadMax is a lawyer and not a doctor.

"It was my understanding there would be no math." --
Chevy Chase portraying Gerald Ford on SNL

[cwebbster]

Not sure which team we were playing, but it has to be when Roger got that little bloop to the pitchers mound, and he ran toward the first base line, and railroaded the base runner. That was amazing!

[Uprising]

No doubt about it, the turn around happened thanks to the Scrubs. The "fight" between Oswalt and Bareet? (the smuck catcher) seemed to put a fire into the Astros. It really woke them up, and suddenly they all seemed really intense and emotional over the game.

Here we go baby! 3 more hours! :D

[gunn]

I didn't see it mentioned, but I think the turning point of the season came in the series in Montreal versus the Expos. I believe they lost two of three but the bats really started coming alive and the team showed fight in that series for the first time since the begining of the season. Kent was robbed of a homerun and from that point on the team as a whole really started to gather hits and collect solid at bats.

[leroy420]

Originally posted by Oski2005
I believe it was when I started watching the games again.

Just the opposite for me. It started when I quit watching games after losing 2/3 to Montreal. I had also changed my wallpaper from Beltran robbing that HR against Texas to the Texans logo. I was full on into football season at that point.