Oilers: From one extreme to the to other...

[DavidS]

Oilers: From one extreme to the to other...let's not repeat the past!

Our offense during the Campbell years were just that, "Campbell years." In hindsight, its quite easy to see why a running ONLY offense didn't work. Sure, we had some success. Because Earl was so dog-gone dominating at the RB position. But when you have a "hammer," everything is NOT a nail. We were mesmerized by Earls running to the extreme we never utilized the WR or TE talent to complement him. Sure, we used them. But the game plan was still predominantly: Give the ball to Earl. Remember that thing called "team?" I have to believe that even if we did bring in other WR/TE talent, we'd still run the ball most of the time (untapped). Now how predictable is that? During the playoffs, we'd always meet a team that WAS able to stop the run. And that's where the 78 - 80 Oilers attacked ended.

The from 87 to 94 the Oilers went to the other end of the spectrum. The Run-and-Shoot was the opposite of the Run-ONLY offense. So, we went from one extreme to the other. With the Moon era, we passed too much!

During the Oiler history, we always ended up going up against playoff teams (Pittsburgh, Cleveland, Denver, Buffalo, Kansas City) that exploited our current weakness. So, if you build a team that is running dominated, or passing dominated. That in itself, it a "weakness" that is easily exploited by our opponents.

Here was the game plan during the "Campbell" years: Run the ball.
Here was the opponents game plan to defend the Oilers: Defend the run.

Easy...(to predict)...

Here was the game plan during the "Moon" years: Pass the ball.
Here was the opponents game plan to defend the Oilers: Defend the pass.

Easy...(to predict)...

The key issue here is: predictability. And if you are predictable, you are essentially handing your game book to your opponents.

The best record the Oilers have ever had was 12-4 in 93-94. The rest of the "decent" seasons were respectable (9-7, 11-5, 7-9, 10-6, 8-8), but when compared to the rest of the league, merely average.

I would hate it if we did the same thing with the Texans we did with the Oilers of the 70/80/90's!

I sooooo glad we found a very good RB in D. Davis to help Carr and Andre out. But must remember not to get mesmerized or pacified by a "good thing." Use him as "weapon," but not at the expense of the rest of the team; WR, TE, FB, QB...etc...

Next on the list we need to find a very good TE that can help us out on the play-action or short routes. Is Billy Miller that guy? Not sure...

Billy is mentioned in both of these articles...

Not everyone can get a Shannon Sharpe, but we can try... :)

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=overthehumpplayingthetem&prov=tsn&type=lgns

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=howthecoveraffectsyou&prov=tsn&type=lgns

[Jared Novak]

Next on the list we need to find a very good TE that can help us out on the play-action or short routes. Is Billy Miller that guy? Not sure...

If it were not for the obvious weaknesses of the Texans' defense this year the team would be in prime position to get that premier TE in next year's draft... Kellen Winslow Jr. out of Miami.

[A-Train]

Of course, Pastorini was quite possibly the worst QB in the entire history of mankind. The Oilers had to give it to Earl because Pastorini was that bad. The Snake came in for a year, but he was way past his prime to be effective. They also won one moer playoff game in three years than the "Run 'N Shoot yourself in the foot when you get to the red-zone" offense did.

It's called playing to your strengths. Right now, the Texans have no strengths. Their strength used to be their defense, but they only seem to play two quarters a game these days. A lot of myopic fans like to believe that Carr is the best thing since BBQ Baked Lays, but the truth is that he's just not a very good QB right now. He's been protected pretty well this year, but his rating is still in the toilet and he has more interceptions than TDs. He also has a tendency to zone in on one receiver, a mistake typical of young quarterbacks. Johnson is good, but a wide receiver is only as good as the guy throwing it to him. The passing game this year, as compared to last year, is about the same. The running game is about 10X better than last year, so why not start running the ball more and see how it develops?

[DavidS]

Originally posted by Jared Novak
If it were not for the obvious weaknesses of the Texans' defense this year the team would be in prime position to get that premier TE in next year's draft... Kellen Winslow Jr. out of Miami.


Hmmm, Kellen Winslow, Jr. is listed on the Texan War Room board here:
http://www.houstonprofootball.com/draft/prospects/winslowk.html

...along with four other prospects.

What's with the name "Ben?" Heh..

Jeff Dugan
Ben Troupe
Ben Utecht
Ben Watson

[DavidS]

Originally posted by A-Train
"Run 'N Shoot yourself in the foot when you get to the red-zone" offense did.


LOL!!! :D

That used to drive me crazy!

We'd drive 90 yards in the air; Moon to Givins, Moon to Jeffieres, Moon to Slaughter, Moon to Duncan....

Then, we'd get stuck on the 10 yard line with no room to throw. Enter Al Decreco!

3 points. Ha!

[Ric]

Originally posted by A-Train
The passing game this year, as compared to last year, is about the same.
you're kidding, right?

[DavidS]

Originally posted by A-Train
The passing game this year, as compared to last year, is about the same.


I can't see the games (in Maryland), so I can't tell. But that would be a good stat to look up...

I'd figured that Carr's confidence and timing has improved and the addition of Johnston as a "goto guy" has also helped greatly.

Mccaffery, and Bradford seem to do it as a tandem last year. Andre Johnson can do it alone this year. He's a true All-Pro player.

[DavidS]

Originally posted by DavidS

Mccaffery, and Bradford seem to do it as a tandem last year. Andre Johnson can do it alone this year. He's a true All-Pro player.

Jabar Gaffney, not Mccaffery. Doh!

[mrpaige]

Originally posted by DavidS
I can't see the games (in Maryland), so I can't tell. But that would be a good stat to look up...

Well his completion percentage is up over last year. His yards per attempt are up over last year. His rating is up. He's on pace for more TD passes, but he's also way up in interceptions (which is really what's holding his rating down so low. If not for the INTs, he'd be 10th in the League, QB rating-wise. But he is throwing a lot of interceptions, so that costs him 17 or so points in QB rating).

I don't think you can honestly say that the passing game hasn't gotten at least a little better. Heck, even if you just give credit to the O-Line for keeping Carr from getting sacked (on pace for something like 27 sacks this year vs. 76 last season).

The offense has certainly not been good enough. It's had moments of very good play followed by a lot of moments of poor play. It's inconsistent, but it's still better than it was last season.

For the record, the running game is better than last year, up to 113 ypg vs. 85 ypg last season.

The Texans offense ended its first season in 32nd place. They currently sit in 15th place. Personally, I think they've improved. Having the 31st ranked defense after finishing the 2002 season with the 16th ranked defense is hurting.

[Summer Song Giver]

I think everyone needs to get over it, the Texans showed up for only one half of football , that is why we lost. We should be so lucky to have the players we have now plus a back we could feed like Earl. The playcalling was ultr-conservative in the second half but that appears to be the mantra so far, we are not good enough yet to put teams away.

Signed,
Still patient and loving the direction this team is heading

[DavidS]

Originally posted by Summer Song Giver
We should be so lucky to have the players we have now plus a back we could feed like Earl.


Hell yeah! To have Carr, Johnson, Bradford, and Campbell! Wow! Talk about a team to build on!

By the way, I'm happy to have D. Davis. He's seems like he has a good head on his shoulders. Did you hear this interviews?

He takes nothing for granted, and always sees room for improvement on his game.

Great attitude! :cool:

[sweetie]

As I was coming home I was thinking of starting a thread about Winslow and now here it is so Ill chime in here. We need him even if Miller is good and heres how,why:

My ideal offense would be this:

wr- Johnson

te-miller
ol
ol
ol
ol
ol
te-Winslow

wr- gaffney

carr
davis

Thats 11 guys. The defense would have to zone deep to protect from Andre and Gaffneys speed. But then we can KILL them with the short yardage passing to Winslow/Miller. If the linebackers try to stop our 2 TE"S then carr can pass deep. Plus this gives 7 guys up front to protect carr,and make a hole for davis. Its the PERFECT plan. I sure hope we draft winslow. Im the only texan fan hoping we lose so that we can pick high enough.(darn bengals)

Defense is another matter. But I think you have to go with the best playmaker instead of filling a specific position in defense that can be filled later years with a lower first round pick.(most defensive players are picked later than 8th.)

[sweetie]

plus this would give dre a friend. Dre is soooo quiet Im almost thinking he is unhappy. Bring another cane in and he will stay here forever.

[tierre_brown]

Originally posted by sweetie
As I was coming home I was thinking of starting a thread about Winslow and now here it is so Ill chime in here. We need him even if Miller is good and heres how,why:

My ideal offense would be this:

wr- Johnson

te-miller
ol
ol
ol
ol
ol
te-Winslow

wr- gaffney

carr
davis

Thats 11 guys. The defense would have to zone deep to protect from Andre and Gaffneys speed. But then we can KILL them with the short yardage passing to Winslow/Miller. If the linebackers try to stop our 2 TE"S then carr can pass deep. Plus this gives 7 guys up front to protect carr,and make a hole for davis. Its the PERFECT plan. I sure hope we draft winslow. Im the only texan fan hoping we lose so that we can pick high enough.(darn bengals)

Defense is another matter. But I think you have to go with the best playmaker instead of filling a specific position in defense that can be filled later years with a lower first round pick.(most defensive players are picked later than 8th.)

Isn't that why we got Joppru AND Holloway, so they could lineup on the opposite side of Miller? I wouldn't mind having Winslow, but he hasn't shown that he is the best player available in this draft, plus the fact we have many many different areas to address.

As for the play-calling, I don't know why we're calling everything so close to the vest. We're not supposed to be as good as our record shows; everyone had us pegged for another 4, 5 win season. So why not go there and play the wild-card, spoiler role? Air it out a few times, call some trick plays, etc. Calling everything strictly by the book is ok, but I think we need to surprise the league a LOT more.

[DavidS]

Originally posted by sweetie
Im the only texan fan hoping we lose so that we can pick high enough.(darn bengals)





Shhhhhh....me too. :)

We need more picks. But it's nice to get a win here or there to gauge our progress.

By the way, I'm surpised you picked Gaffney over Bradford?

It it age related/potential related?

[DavidS]

Originally posted by tierre_brown
Isn't that why we got Joppru AND Holloway

Joppru was supposed to be our blocking-short routre TE.

But he's injured (groin).

[ima_drummer2k]

Man, I don't think we need to pick any offensive players in the draft next year. We need DB's, D linemen, and linebackers. Other than that, our defense is set for years.

I'd be happy if we used every single pick on defense next year. Maybe a couple of O linemen and a RB via free agency, but we have no depth on defense right now.

[Ric]

Originally posted by sweetie
Im the only texan fan hoping we lose so that we can pick high enough.(darn bengals)
you're not a fan.

[MadMax]

Originally posted by ima_drummer2k
Man, I don't think we need to pick any offensive players in the draft next year. We need DB's, D linemen, and linebackers. Other than that, our defense is set for years.

I'd be happy if we used every single pick on defense next year. Maybe a couple of O linemen and a RB via free agency, but we have no depth on defense right now.

i'd like to echo everything you just said.

[DavidS]

Originally posted by Ric
you're not a fan.


And you will never understand the art of war.

[Ric]

Originally posted by DavidS
And you will never understand the art of war.
you're right. let's lose, so that our players become accustom to it, draft players who are every bit as likely to fail as they are succeed and then watch our fan base erode because the average sports fan has the attention span of a gnat on speed.

it's the same plan the cardinals have been using for about 25 years now... seems like a winner.

[DavidS]

Originally posted by Ric

it's the same plan the cardinals have been using for about 25 years now... seems like a winner.

Huh???

Rooting for the sake a rooting, and then pat yourself on the back for being a "true fan." That's what I have issue with. Your accusation!

We need draft picks, period.

The key is to build a strong foundation of players. It's a means to an ever changing ends. Now, if we keep having 4-12 seasons, then we have a problem.

Here's what you want: A lot of 1st round draft picks, but at the same time a 9-7 season. That's called "Have your cake and eat it..."

I don't want to be just "good (and root, like a nice little fan)" I want to be dominating!

We must suffer now, to be great later.

[giddyup]

I see the Titans making a move for Travis Henry when (and if) McGahee rounds into shape. Eddie George is just not quick enough to exploit defenses. Maybe he should become the fullback?

[DavidS]

Originally posted by giddyup
I see the Titans making a move for Travis Henry when (and if) McGahee rounds into shape. Eddie George is just not quick enough to exploit defenses. Maybe he should become the fullback?


Yeah, I never liked George as the RB. He's improved, but his upright running style isn't idea for an every-down back.

It will be interesting how McGahee turns out.

I'm glad we have DD. I hope he keeps up the good work. He could be diamond in the rough. I mean, the guy was a 4th rounder! :eek:

[mrpaige]

Originally posted by DavidS
Huh???

Rooting for the sake a rooting, and then pat yourself on the back for being a "true fan." That's what I have issue with. Your accusation!

We need draft picks, period.

The key is to build a strong foundation of players. It's a means to an ever changing ends. Now, if we keep having 4-12 seasons, then we have a problem.

You still get draft picks even when you win. They just come later in the draft, but plenty of teams have built solid foundations while drafting lower. Arizona and Cincinnati consistently draft high and can't win to save their lives.

And at what point do the 4-12 seasons become enough? Two? Three? Five?

Here's what you want: A lot of 1st round draft picks, but at the same time a 9-7 season. That's called "Have your cake and eat it..."

You get first round picks even when you win.

We must suffer now, to be great later.

I don't know. It sure seems like those teams that consistently have high draft picks never get any better.

And look at a team like the Titans. Other than getting McNair in the 1995 draft after their 2-14 season, the Oilers/Titans have always won at least 7 games. Yet they are as dominating a team as there is out there right now.

That's not a team that was built through having high draft picks.

Playing worse than your team is just isn't a good strategy. Getting consistently better would seem a better way to go even if it means moving down in the crapshoot that is the NFL Draft.

[Rockets2K]

Originally posted by A-Train
Of course, Pastorini was quite possibly the worst QB in the entire history of mankind.

two names for you.

Gifford Neilson
Oliver Luck

carry on ;)

[DavidS]

Originally posted by mrpaige

Playing worse than your team is just isn't a good strategy. Getting consistently better would seem a better way to go even if it means moving down in the crapshoot that is the NFL Draft. [/B]

Getting consistently better is done with a lot of factors. I never said lose on purpose. You automatically get hard work from players competing for jobs. But as a fan, it doesn't worry me that don't win this game, or that game. It's too soon to freak out for a loss here or there. That's my point. There's always the draft to build from, since, we are, building a new team.

There's balance. Getting consistently better is made up of a lot of factors. I have to say, that no matter how much "getting consistently better" would have occurred in Dallas, they would never had won the titles they did without Aikman, Smith and Irvin.

And to me, building up your "star" base is more important that getting a bunch of "good" players in mid-level drafts while being still competitive.

Being just "competitive" reminds me of the Bud Adams days. Scary!

[mrpaige]

Originally posted by DavidS
There's balance. Getting consistently better is made up of a lot of factors. I have to say, that no matter how much "getting consistently better" would have occurred in Dallas, they would never had won the titles they did without Aikman, Smith and Irvin.

Of course, Smith wasn't a high 1st rounder (17th overall), and neither was Irvin, really. You could argue that the Texans already have their Aikman in David Carr (both #1s overall) and their Irvin in Johnson, though Johnson was a higher pick (#3 overall vs. #11 overall). The Texans could be pretty good this year and still end up with the 17th overall pick and have the ability to draft just as high as the Cowboys took Smith.

And the chances are that the Texans won't be drafting that low anyway. The team that earned the 17th pick last year went 9-7 in the regular season. It's unlikely the Texans will do that well this season.

The point is, you don't have to tank games to get better.

And having a losing attitude can be a problem for a team. String too many losing seasons together, and the players seem to forget how to win.

[mrpaige]

Originally posted by DavidS
Getting consistently better is done with a lot of factors. I never said lose on purpose. You automatically get hard work from players competing for jobs. But as a fan, it doesn't worry me that don't win this game, or that game. It's too soon to freak out for a loss here or there. That's my point. There's always the draft to build from, since, we are, building a new team.

I agree with this sentiment, but that's not what you said before when you seemed to echo the talk about hoping for losses in order to get higher draft picks.

[DavidS]

Originally posted by mrpaige
I agree with this sentiment, but that's not what you said before when you seemed to echo the talk about hoping for losses in order to get higher draft picks.

Put it this way, I doesn't bother me that much. Not yet. Because I know we NEED more help! See?

That's when science of scouting is a tricky thing (1st though 30th picks).

You have to give props to the Texan staff for putting together the best players possible. But it is their job to see the intangibles of players. We are shielded from the war room.

The one thing I remember that Jimmy Johnson said once was that he would trade two high 2nd rounders, for four or five 4th or 5th rounders. He would use those lower picks as "stuffing." :) Or blue collar workers. Those guys are great to have when you've ALREAD built the "stars" of the team up. And maybe, just maybe you'll get a few diamonds in the rough.

So, getting better should happen gradually. But once you get to a certain level (competitive), you better have your "stars" picked already. If not. We'll be almost most good enough to win a title. But never good enough.

Right now, are "stars" have yet to be decided. So, far we have: Carr, Johnson and maybe DD? Not sure. I hope.

[DavidS]

By the way, I'm also hoping for a BAD-AS*, monster-like, offensive-Linemen THROWING, defensive tackle/end!

A Bruce Smith, Warren Sapp, or Reggie White!

We need one of those...purrdy please?

:D

[IROC it]

Originally posted by Rockets2K
two names for you.

Gifford Neilson
Oliver Luck

carry on ;)

Ummm, add Brent Pease to that list.

[VesceySux]

Originally posted by ima_drummer2k
Man, I don't think we need to pick any offensive players in the draft next year. We need DB's, D linemen, and linebackers. Other than that, our defense is set for years.

I'd be happy if we used every single pick on defense next year. Maybe a couple of O linemen and a RB via free agency, but we have no depth on defense right now.

Best post in this thread. K2 Winslow is a luxury. Defensive help is a necessity. Draft for defense (and O-line) and fill in offensive holes via free agency.

[A-Train]

Nope, Pastorini was worse than Luck or Nielsen. For one, both Luck and Nielson each had a season with more TDs than INTs, something Pastorini can never claim. More importantly, though, Nielsen and Luck both did their majority of sucking when the Oilers also sucked. Pastorini sucked even when the Oilers were good.

[nyrocket]

DavidS, seeing as you don't actually watch the games (unbelievable!) since you don't have the wherewithal either to get NFL Sunday Ticket or get off your ass and go to a sports bar somewhere that's showing the Texans, you are absolutely unqualified to make any assertions whatever regarding the team's play.

And you geniuses do know that the Texans drafted a TE in the second round this year, right?

[DavidS]

Originally posted by nyrocket
DavidS, seeing as you don't actually watch the games (unbelievable!) since you don't have the wherewithal either to get NFL Sunday Ticket or get off your ass and go to a sports bar somewhere that's showing the Texans, you are absolutely unqualified to make any assertions whatever regarding the team's play.

And you geniuses do know that the Texans drafted a TE in the second round this year, right?

....move along sparky!

:rolleyes:

[Austin70]

Originally posted by Rockets2K
two names for you.

Gifford Neilson
Oliver Luck

carry on ;)
Nope, think of Commaner Cody as the starter, what did he do?