Astros MVP??

[Bobblehead]

My Astros MVP would be between Hidalgo, Ensberg, Wagner, Oswalt and Bagwelll!

1. Hidalgo had a major comeback at the plate and he is the best right fielder in baseball. He should win a golden glove. His offense helped offset Berkman's offensive slide.

2. Bagwell started very strong the first few weeks, then fell off a cliff. He went a month without an RBI it seemed, but still ended up with over 35 homers and close to 100 RBI's.

3. Ensberg was never a liability in the field and was a gem at the plate. Without his power and stick, where would the Astros be today? A happy suprise, considering Bagwell slumped early while Ensberg was hot. If Jimy starts this guy more, he could hit close to 40 and have over 120 RBIs.

4. Oswalt was fabulous...when he played. With an era under 3.00 and 10 wins in 21 starts, imagine what he would have been like if he were healthy. I look forward to a healthy Oswalt next season!

5. Wagner: Saves...saves...saves!!! With the exception of last week, this guy was as dominant a saver as Gagne and Smoltz.

My vote: Wagner (When the Astros needed to nail down a win, he put the hammer down!)

[bobrek]

I'd go with Hidalgo. With the exception of August, his average was .293 or higher every month. Unless there is a huge gap in performance, an everyday player should get the nod over a pitcher.

[Surfguy]

Hidalgo all the way.

Bagwell seemed too inconsistent. Never knew when he would show up. He had a long home run drought.

Ensberg would have been my vote had he kept his torrid first half pace but he fizzled in the 2nd half.

[JBIIRockets]

I give it to Wagner. Doggy would have gotten it, but his 4 for 27 effort in these last six games killed that.

[BigM]

i give it to wagner. our bullpen carried this team the whole year and billy had an amazing season.

after that i'll go with hidalgo for great defense and the most consistent hitter.

[Uprising]

Originally posted by JBIIRockets
I give it to Wagner. Doggy would have gotten it, but his 4 for 27 effort in these last six games killed that.

Ditto....Hidalgo was amazing in september until the last couple of series. Then he fell apart, his defense was still there, but his bat was nothing but air.

Wagner was awesome all season, he did cost a win a few games back, but he came back and was strong again.

The bullpen over all has been fantastic.

[Poloshirtbandit]

Just looking at stats, I'd say Ensberg, but most of the games I went to, he didn't play and I didn't get to see him play often.

I'm going to say Wagner for reasons already mentioned.

[egn]

Screw the damn Astros and Drayton McClane. Who cares who the MVP is of yet again, another mediocre team. I think the fans in Houston should boycott the Astros games untill DM provides a product that is worth going to see. Fact of the matter is the Astros don't field a team worthy of winning the WS or for that matter even going to the WS. It seems as if the Astros are just trying to win the Central.

Things are definatly bad when you have a 38 year old washed up catcher with NO ARM, absolutly NO RANGE, NO DEFENSIVE SKILLS, and rapidly DIMINISHING OFFENSIVE SKILLS, locked down for 3 MORE YEARS, all the while playing center field in the BIGGEST CENTER FIELD IN BASEBALL!!!!!!!! I would say with the rise of the Cubs in the central, the Astros window for the playoffs has been SLAMMED SHUT!!!!!

[kmbwa]

Originally posted by Surfguy


Ensberg would have been my vote had he kept his torrid first half pace but he fizzled in the 2nd half.

I wouldn't call it fizzled. Mismanagement, stupidity, obvious inability to see talent by not playing the guy everyday...fire Jimy with one M. We treated Ensberg like a 40 year old washed up player......oh that's right, we play those kind everyday!

[Major]

I wouldn't call it fizzled. Mismanagement, stupidity, obvious inability to see talent by not playing the guy everyday...

It was when he started playing everyday in July/August that he started to suck. When he went back to the platoon arrangement in late August / September, he got better again.

[bobrek]

Originally posted by egn
Screw the damn Astros and Drayton McClane. Who cares who the MVP is of yet again, another mediocre team. I think the fans in Houston should boycott the Astros games untill DM provides a product that is worth going to see. Fact of the matter is the Astros don't field a team worthy of winning the WS or for that matter even going to the WS. It seems as if the Astros are just trying to win the Central.

Things are definatly bad when you have a 38 year old washed up catcher with NO ARM, absolutly NO RANGE, NO DEFENSIVE SKILLS, and rapidly DIMINISHING OFFENSIVE SKILLS, locked down for 3 MORE YEARS, all the while playing center field in the BIGGEST CENTER FIELD IN BASEBALL!!!!!!!! I would say with the rise of the Cubs in the central, the Astros window for the playoffs has been SLAMMED SHUT!!!!!

Uhhh, Biggio is only guaranteed through next season.

While he does have a mediocre arm and mediocre range, he does have some defensive skills.

[PhiSlammaJamma]

Statisically you could actually make a strong case that Berkman was our best offensive player all year.

[MadMax]

Originally posted by egn
Screw the damn Astros and Drayton McClane. Who cares who the MVP is of yet again, another mediocre team. I think the fans in Houston should boycott the Astros games untill DM provides a product that is worth going to see. Fact of the matter is the Astros don't field a team worthy of winning the WS or for that matter even going to the WS. It seems as if the Astros are just trying to win the Central.

Things are definatly bad when you have a 38 year old washed up catcher with NO ARM, absolutly NO RANGE, NO DEFENSIVE SKILLS, and rapidly DIMINISHING OFFENSIVE SKILLS, locked down for 3 MORE YEARS, all the while playing center field in the BIGGEST CENTER FIELD IN BASEBALL!!!!!!!! I would say with the rise of the Cubs in the central, the Astros window for the playoffs has been SLAMMED SHUT!!!!!

man...it's a good thing you don't live in KC, Cincy, Milwaukee, Baltimore, Pittsburgh, the south side of Chicago, Montreal, Tampa, or Dallas!

[rrj_gamz]

Dalgy is the hands down MVP...enough said...

[rezdawg]

MVP isnt the comeback player of the year award or who was most consistent. Its looking straight at the production.

The best player on our team was Bagwell, hands down.

Bagwell:
.278 BA
39 HR
100 RBI
109 Runs
88 BB
11 SB
317 TB

Hidalgo:
.309 BA
28 HR
88 RBI
91 Runs
58 BB
9 SB
294 TB

Other than average, its not even close. Bagwell is the MVP. Now, comeback player of the year is another story...

As far as having Wagner as the MVP, I find that absurd. Would we have been that much worse off having Dotel as the closer? Maybe we'd lose a few more games. Taking Hidalgo or Bagwell's bat out of the lineup would be much more destructive to the team. There is a reason why 99% of MLB MVP's are batters, not pitchers.

[franchise?..NOT]

Oswalt. With all the stud bats we have it still came down to "O" being the stopper in September. Otherwise we are out of it a few weeks ago. Bags, Doggie, Berkman, Kent..... none had the kind of streak offensively individually to make a difference like that. Second would be Wagner.

[bobrek]

Originally posted by rezdawg
MVP isnt the comeback player of the year award or who was most consistent. Its looking straight at the production.

The best player on our team was Bagwell, hands down.

Bagwell:
.278 BA
39 HR
100 RBI
109 Runs
88 BB
11 SB
317 TB

Hidalgo:
.309 BA
28 HR
88 RBI
91 Runs
58 BB
9 SB
294 TB

Other than average, its not even close. Bagwell is the MVP. Now, comeback player of the year is another story...

...

Some stats you managed to leave out of a Bagwell vs. Hidalgo debate (many baseball execs consider these 3 stats the most important individual stats because they are not dependant upon your teammates like RBI and Runs scored are):

On Base Percentage:

Bagwell - .373
Hidalgo - .385

Slugging Pct:

Bagwell - .524
Hidalgo - .572

OPS:

Bagwell - .897
Hidalgo - .957

Defense -

Bagwell's glove is still good, but his arm is horrible. Hidalgo saved a number of runs with his arm and the threat of his arm.

If you want to go a bit further into the stats, Bagwell hit into 25 DPs vs. 10 for Hidalgo, thus accounting for an additional 15 out.

How can you say "hands down"?

Also, keep in mind that Bagwell's totals came in 702 plate appearances vs. 585 for Hidalgo due to the 2-3 weeks Hidalgo missed with his tonsilitis problem. In addition, most of Bagwell's at bats were with Kent or Berkman behind him while Hidalgo's came with Ausmus, Zaun or Everett. Who do you think saw better pitches most of the time?

[tierre_brown]

Originally posted by bobrek
Some stats you managed to leave out of a Bagwell vs. Hidalgo debate (many baseball execs consider these 3 stats the most important individual stats because they are not dependant upon your teammates like RBI and Runs scored are):

On Base Percentage:

Bagwell - .373
Hidalgo - .385

Slugging Pct:

Bagwell - .524
Hidalgo - .572

OPS:

Bagwell - .897
Hidalgo - .957

Defense -

Bagwell's glove is still good, but his arm is horrible. Hidalgo saved a number of runs with his arm and the threat of his arm.

If you want to go a bit further into the stats, Bagwell hit into 25 DPs vs. 10 for Hidalgo, thus accounting for an additional 15 out.

How can you say "hands down"?

Also, keep in mind that Bagwell's totals came in 702 plate appearances vs. 585 for Hidalgo due to the 2-3 weeks Hidalgo missed with his tonsilitis problem. In addition, most of Bagwell's at bats were with Kent or Berkman behind him while Hidalgo's came with Ausmus, Zaun or Everett. Who do you think saw better pitches most of the time?

Well, I think Dalgy, with Wags a close second, was MVP, but saying that Bagwell's arm sucked was mainly because he played with a shoulder problem for most of the season, if i'm not mistaken. I think Bags was the most consistent player, but most valuable...eh....

[A-Train]

Imagine if Bagwell hadn't sucked ass for two solid months...

[bobrek]

Originally posted by tierre_brown
Well, I think Dalgy, with Wags a close second, was MVP, but saying that Bagwell's arm sucked was mainly because he played with a shoulder problem for most of the season, if i'm not mistaken. I think Bags was the most consistent player, but most valuable...eh....

I know he has played with a bad shoulder for 2 years now. I admire him for gutting it out and he is still a good player and one of the best first basemen in the league and one of the best glovemen in the league, but none of that changes the fact that his throwing is horrible.

I also disagree that Bagwell was consistent. He had 10 HRs in April and July, 9 in September, 7 in August, but only 1 :eek: in May and 3 in June. His average peaked at .314 in April, the .250s in May and June, .287 in July, .271 in August and about .275 in September. His RBI totals by month were 19, 6 :eek:, 13, 25, 17, 16, 20. His OBP also bounced all over the place from month to month - .390, .328, .342, .432, .405 and ~.340.

[RKMAN]

THE MVP GOES TO <B>DRAYTON MCCLANE</b> FOR SCREWING THE FANS, HIS TEAM, AND OUR CITY. I HATE THIS TEAM'S MANAGEMENT AND WILL DO SO UNTIL THE TEAM IS BOUGHT BY SOMEONE WHO GIVES A DAMN! <i>Go 'Stros</i> nonetheless.

[egn]

Originally posted by bobrek
Uhhh, Biggio is only guaranteed through next season.


I believe Biggio was already under contract through next season......but he signed a 2 year contract extension. I'm pretty sure that Drayton McClane was out at his ranch working out the kinks.

[bobrek]

Originally posted by egn
I believe Biggio was already under contract through next season......but he signed a 2 year contract extension. I'm pretty sure that Drayton McClane was out at his ranch working out the kinks.

Nope, you are mistaken. Biggio's contract ran through 2003 and he signed a two year extension to accomodate his move to CF. The team has an option for 2005.

"Craig Biggio - signed a 3-year contract after the 1999 season for $21 million dollars plus a $7 million signing bonus distributed unevenly from 2000 to 2004. Signed an extension after the 2003 [note: this should say 2002] season, paying Biggio $3 million in 2004 plus $1.5 million in incentives. The team has an option for $3 million in 2005 plus $1.5 million. If the option for 2005 is not exercised, Biggio receives a $1 million buyout."

from astrosdaily.com

[PhiSlammaJamma]

Lance Berkman

OBP .412
SLG .509
OPS .922

Defense - 3 errors and 10 assists

Last 7 days
BA .391
OBP .500
SLG .652
OPS 1.152

[Angle02]

Originally posted by egn
Screw the damn Astros and Drayton McClane. Who cares who the MVP is of yet again, another mediocre team. I think the fans in Houston should boycott the Astros games untill DM provides a product that is worth going to see. Fact of the matter is the Astros don't field a team worthy of winning the WS or for that matter even going to the WS. It seems as if the Astros are just trying to win the Central.

Things are definatly bad when you have a 38 year old washed up catcher with NO ARM, absolutly NO RANGE, NO DEFENSIVE SKILLS, and rapidly DIMINISHING OFFENSIVE SKILLS, locked down for 3 MORE YEARS, all the while playing center field in the BIGGEST CENTER FIELD IN BASEBALL!!!!!!!! I would say with the rise of the Cubs in the central, the Astros window for the playoffs has been SLAMMED SHUT!!!!!

What a pathetic post. I "almost" feel sorry for people like egn.