ClutchFans - Astros @ Reds, 7/17-7/20

bobrek

07-17-2003, 09:06 PM

Just as I was about to complain that the Astros weakest part of their roster is right handed pop off the bench, Bruntlett doubles.

(I still think that is the weakest part of their team).

And I absolutely HATE the sacrifice bunt after a double (unless it's the pitcher or a terrible hitter)

bobrek

07-17-2003, 09:10 PM

RM95

Are you watching the game? How did Bruntlett get picked off 3rd?

Groogrux

07-17-2003, 09:14 PM

Originally posted by bobrek
RM95

Are you watching the game? How did Bruntlett get picked off 3rd?

I'm listening and didn't really hear the play. I believe LaRue got him after the pitch though.

codell

07-17-2003, 09:17 PM

Brunlett was leading too far off the bag, snap throw, out.

Apparently, Brunt got back in before the tag but couldnt keep his hand on the bag.

bobrek

07-17-2003, 09:18 PM

It is very frustrating to have the 9th position in the order lead off with a double (especially prior to the 8th inning) and have the top of the order coming up and give up an out to move a guy one base. Even if Blum hit a SF to score the runner you now have 1 run in and 2 outs. Let Biggio swing away and the more than likely the worst that will happen is a runner on 2nd and 1 out.

Groogrux

07-17-2003, 09:20 PM

I completely agree bobrek.

Groogrux

07-17-2003, 09:24 PM

Ugh, crappy baserunning by Berkman. 2 outs, he's on second, a bloop single by Hidalgo and he apparently stopped running as Taylor dove to try and catch the ball.

BALLhog 247 365

07-17-2003, 09:31 PM

he wouldnt have scored anyways. next ab was a walk and the one after was a k

Groogrux

07-17-2003, 09:33 PM

I don't see how you couldn't score from second on a bloop single with two outs unless you're not running on first contact.

BALLhog 247 365

07-17-2003, 09:36 PM

Originally posted by Rocketman95
I don't see how you couldn't score from second on a bloop single with two outs unless you're not running on first contact.

my bad, i thought he was on first base

bobrek

07-17-2003, 09:42 PM

According to ESPN and MLB.com he was on 1st when Hidalgo singled and 2nd when Zaun walked:

From ESPN
HOUSTON 8TH
-Top of the 8th inning
-J Bagwell singled to left.
-J Kent grounded into double play, shortstop to second to first, J Bagwell out at second.
-L Berkman singled to center.
-R Hidalgo singled to shallow center, L Berkman to second.
-G Zaun walked, L Berkman to third, R Hidalgo to second.
-A Everett struck out swinging.

From MLB.com
Top 8th B:3 S: 1 O: 2
Lance Berkman singles, fielded by center fielder Reggie Taylor.

Top 8th B:1 S: 1 O: 2
Richard Hidalgo singles, fielded by center fielder Reggie Taylor. Lance Berkman advances to 2nd.

Top 8th B:4 S: 0 O: 2
Gregg Zaun walks. Lance Berkman advances to 3rd. Richard Hidalgo advances to 2nd.

Groogrux

07-17-2003, 09:46 PM

Yeah, I just checked that...my bad.

I take back my previous negative criticism of Berkman's baserunning. :D

bobrek

07-17-2003, 09:52 PM

Actually that seems to be Berkman's biggest weakness. He hustles, but he doesn't seem to think at times while on the bases.

codell

07-17-2003, 09:52 PM

Geez .......................all he had to do was catch it and throw Larkin out

Groogrux

07-17-2003, 09:53 PM

Ugh, error by Everett, runners on 2nd and 3rd with 2 outs in the bottom of the 9th.

We don't need a blown save to start the "second half".

codell

07-17-2003, 09:56 PM

What a play by Bags!!!!

Everett should spit shine his shoes after the game.

Groogrux

07-17-2003, 09:56 PM

Game over.

Wagner save!!!!! 5-4!!

bobrek

07-17-2003, 09:57 PM

I hate it when they are not on the MLB extra innings package and I have to "watch" via the Internet.

BobFinn*

07-17-2003, 10:26 PM

Originally posted by bobrek
I hate it when they are not on the MLB extra innings package and I have to "watch" via the Internet.

Me too.

Here is the thing that pisses me off, we PAY MONEY to MLB for the extra inning package yet don't get all the games. Yet ALL GAMES are available for viewing on the internet. MLB is one seriously screwed up organization.

And now back to our regular programming...

DaDakota

07-17-2003, 10:31 PM

Whew !!

We get all the games here on Time Warner....if they are not on Fox or KTBC, they are on a special channel....77 is the number.

Good way to start the 2nd half.

DD

Uprising

07-17-2003, 10:37 PM

WHew, that one got kind of scary for a moment there in the 9th. After Everett let that ball get away from him and the runners advanced. But Bags saved the day...man what a hussle to finish off the reds. :D

5 in a row against the reds....:cool:

bobrek

07-17-2003, 10:47 PM

Originally posted by BobFinn*
Me too.

Here is the thing that pisses me off, we PAY MONEY to MLB for the extra inning package yet don't get all the games. Yet ALL GAMES are available for viewing on the internet. MLB is one seriously screwed up organization.

And now back to our regular programming...

I suspect it is channel availability. My cable system has 10 channels available to use and they are showing 11 games today. It would be great if they would add 5 extra channels.

Did you get the 'rebate' offer of the MLB game for playstation or XBOX? I got mine today when signing up for the Extra Inings package. They were out of games so I got a 2003 All Star Game mug.

BALLhog 247 365

07-18-2003, 12:46 AM

well...griffeys tests reveal that hes going to be out for the season...man i feel bad for this guy.

reallyBaked

07-18-2003, 05:05 PM

Originally posted by BALLhog 247 365
well...griffeys tests reveal that hes going to be out for the season...man i feel bad for this guy.

he can kiss his HOF goodbye

BobFinn*

07-18-2003, 05:52 PM

Originally posted by bobrek
I suspect it is channel availability. My cable system has 10 channels available to use and they are showing 11 games today. It would be great if they would add 5 extra channels.

Did you get the 'rebate' offer of the MLB game for playstation or XBOX? I got mine today when signing up for the Extra Inings package. They were out of games so I got a 2003 All Star Game mug.

I have the dish so extra channels is not the reason. I believe that the home team feed is the first option, the visiting teams feed is second option. However, when the Astros are home, most of their games are on FSSW, the ones that aren't don't get picked up for some odd reason (luckily most of the visiting teams feeds are picked up). I don't think I have seen an Astros broadcast of an away game all year, so if the home team isn't televising, we are out of luck.

As for the rebate, maybe it's for new subscribers. I've had MLB extra innings for 3 years now. The NFL/DirecTv did send me a $400 book of coupons for various retail stores.

:) :)

codell

07-18-2003, 07:48 PM

Bags with a 3 run BOMB!!

Goodguys up 3-1.

Surfguy

07-18-2003, 08:07 PM

I get every game in the D/FW market with no MLB League Pass or anything. This is the first season like this and it is sweet!

Hidalgo just dinged one out!

NIKEstrad

07-18-2003, 08:07 PM

#398 for Bagwell...if he plays 3 more seasons,he should be right around 500 (if he hits 30 this year, then 30 in each of the next 3 seasons). Good sign was it was opposite field.

Hidalgo hit #15, solo shot. Also on Hidalgo, Reggie Taylor showed he is as clueless as they come, being thrown out at 2nd by a mile by Hidalgo.

NIKEstrad

07-18-2003, 08:12 PM

Wow, that was spectacular by Everett.

He probably just robbed 2 hits...should be on Web Gems tonight.

BobFinn*

07-18-2003, 08:33 PM

Man, I hope that pitch didn't break any bones in Everett's hand.:mad:

BALLhog 247 365

07-18-2003, 08:37 PM

5-2astros

Nick

07-18-2003, 08:50 PM

Originally posted by BobFinn*
Man, I hope that pitch didn't break any bones in Everett's hand.:mad:

TV crew just said it was a "bruise." (doesn't mean it will be hurting big-time for a while).

If anything, the guy is such a good luck charm for Houston. Look at their record since he's been here. Also, look at that inning right after he left... back-to-back solo shots by the Redlegs.

BobFinn*

07-18-2003, 09:01 PM

Originally posted by Nick
TV crew just said it was a "bruise." (doesn't mean it will be hurting big-time for a while).

Sure hope that's all it is. It reminded me of when Bagwell used to get hit (exact same spot) and knocked him out for the rest of the season (back to back years)

codell

07-18-2003, 09:03 PM

Originally posted by BobFinn*
Sure hope that's all it is. It reminded me of when Bagwell used to get hit (exact same spot) and knocked him out for the rest of the season (back to back years)

What happened with Blum and the catcher's interference call?? I missed all of it.

BobFinn*

07-18-2003, 09:04 PM

Blum popped it up in front of the plate but never moved from the batter's box. LaRue ran into him going for the ball.

Nick

07-18-2003, 09:11 PM

Originally posted by BobFinn*
Man, I hope that pitch didn't break any bones in Everett's hand.:mad:

X-rays negative. He's gonna be day-to-day (which means he won't play till Monday, in Jimy-speak)

BobFinn*

07-18-2003, 09:17 PM

Originally posted by Nick
X-rays negative. He's gonna be day-to-day (which means he won't play till Monday, in Jimy-speak)

Great news!!! Thanks Nick:)

How Sweet It Is

07-18-2003, 09:39 PM

5-3 going to the bottom of 9, good guys. Come on Wags!

arkoe

07-18-2003, 09:42 PM

Originally posted by BobFinn*
Sure hope that's all it is. It reminded me of when Bagwell used to get hit (exact same spot) and knocked him out for the rest of the season (back to back years)

That was the first thing that came to my mind too. I'm glad that it's hopefully not that serious.

How Sweet It Is

07-18-2003, 09:52 PM

Game! Stros win 5-3!:D

BALLhog 247 365

07-18-2003, 10:18 PM

cardinals are rocking ishii in the first inning...the lead will probably stay at 2 games after tonite

Behad

07-18-2003, 10:30 PM

A question for someone who saw the game: In the box score, Wagner is charged with a wild pitch. He had no walks, no hits, no one got on via error, and no one was on base when he came in. How does he get a wild pitch with no runners?

Edit: He faced four batters. Was one of the strike outs a wild pitch to allow a runner on?

DVauthrin

07-18-2003, 10:38 PM

Originally posted by Behad
A question for someone who saw the game: In the box score, Wagner is charged with a wild pitch. He had no walks, no hits, no one got on via error, and no one was on base when he came in. How does he get a wild pitch with no runners?

Edit: He faced four batters. Was one of the strike outs a wild pitch to allow a runner on?

Behad, the only guy who got on was Jose Guillen on cbssportsline's in game update it said it was a strikeout, advance by wild pitch.

So, you are correct.

NIKEstrad

07-19-2003, 01:35 PM

Kent not in the lineup. And apparently, he's not needed.

Biggio single, Bagwell HBP.

Berkman 3 run bomb.

Hidalgo solo.

Ensberg solo.

5-0!!!!!

Back-to-back-to-back!

Astros deciding to give Villone some runs to work with. :)

How Sweet It Is

07-19-2003, 01:39 PM

90 first inning runs, the most in the major leagues!:D

BALLhog 247 365

07-19-2003, 02:10 PM

if only the astros can hit like that every single freakin game...

codell

07-19-2003, 04:47 PM

Wow. Up 6 runs in the 9th and we are about to blow it. :(

arkoe

07-19-2003, 04:58 PM

I got scared there for a minute. I turn it on in the top of the 8th, and look what happens. Glad we pulled it out, we own the Reds.

Somebody needs to tell the Fox announcers that the 'Stros are the Cardiac Kids.

BobFinn*

07-19-2003, 04:59 PM

We Win!!!! 9-8

Whew:eek:

Nick

07-19-2003, 05:00 PM

All ends well. Dotel K's 2 for the final outs. Astros win 9-8.

I'm not too concerned about the final score being that close... the three-run HR by Larue was a product of that wacky wind current they have over there. (then again... so was Berkman's).

I am concerned about having to use Dotel, but at least Jimy didn't get Wagner warmed up after the HR cut it to one. It was Dotel's game to win or lose.

A sweep is now possible...

DaDakota

07-19-2003, 05:31 PM

Anyone else notice that Dotel's fastball was only 88-91, that is a problem if it keeps up.

DD

RIET

07-19-2003, 05:33 PM

Why is Kirk Sarloos in the majors? He should be shipped back to Triple A. He sucks.

Nick

07-19-2003, 06:33 PM

Originally posted by DaDakota
Anyone else notice that Dotel's fastball was only 88-91, that is a problem if it keeps up.

DD

It was probably a product of "not expecting" to go into the game, and he didn't fully get loose.

Also, I'd mention that his fastball was 94-97 last week, before the all-star break, when he was having his hamstring problems.

Come to think of it... Dotel's velocity is always down at the beginning of the year, and its down again after the ASG. Maybe he's a guy who needs that constant work to keep that motor fresh.

The Real Shady

07-19-2003, 07:05 PM

I think Cinncinatti's gun is a little slow or Houston's gun is fast. They had Wagner peaking at 97.

HoneyNut Ichiro

07-19-2003, 08:31 PM

Originally posted by DaDakota
Anyone else notice that Dotel's fastball was only 88-91, that is a problem if it keeps up.

DD

Actually, I saw his fastball hit 96 at least once. There were a couple of times when it hit 91 too. Maybe that was a slider that didn't slide? I think the gun was just off because his fastball looked fairly good to me.

Nick

07-19-2003, 09:51 PM

Originally posted by HoneyNut Ichiro
Actually, I saw his fastball hit 96 at least once. There were a couple of times when it hit 91 too. Maybe that was a slider that didn't slide? I think the gun was just off because his fastball looked fairly good to me.

Dotel has the type of fastball that, even when its only 91-92 mph, it still looks electric because of its movement.

Compare that to, say, Tim Redding's fastball... where it can get around 93-94 mph, but doesn't look all that imposing because its basically straight.

Major leaugers can hit a 99 mph fastball that's comin in straight. They cannot hit a 94 mph fastball coming in w/ the wicked movement provided by Dotel.

Overall... velocity isn't everything.

arkoe

07-19-2003, 11:15 PM

Originally posted by The Real Shady
I think Cinncinatti's gun is a little slow or Houston's gun is fast. They had Wagner peaking at 97.

Many people seem to believe that the Houston gun is a couple of mph fast. Members of the media claim that all the time.

HoneyNut Ichiro

07-19-2003, 11:25 PM

Originally posted by Nick
Dotel has the type of fastball that, even when its only 91-92 mph, it still looks electric because of its movement.

Compare that to, say, Tim Redding's fastball... where it can get around 93-94 mph, but doesn't look all that imposing because its basically straight.

Major leaugers can hit a 99 mph fastball that's comin in straight. They cannot hit a 94 mph fastball coming in w/ the wicked movement provided by Dotel.

Overall... velocity isn't everything.

Yes, I know that. It's called a 2-seam fastball. Though Dotel's fastball is probably more of a 4-seamer with a little movement. I was simply responding to DD's claim that Dotel's fastball didn't eclipse 91.

BigM

07-19-2003, 11:59 PM

Originally posted by arkoe
Many people seem to believe that the Houston gun is a couple of mph fast. Members of the media claim that all the time.

i've only heard that once. it was when tony gwynn said something about wagner's fastball not really as hard as the gun says and that it was just entertainment for the fans. i questioned it after that too, but many times i've seen the gun on the road clock his ball in at triple digits so i'm thinking it's legit. btw he's topped out at 97 at home games also just not often.

Uprising

07-20-2003, 01:18 AM

Damn, this one got scary tonight. I starting to get worried there in the 9th inning.

Atleast the good guys pulled another one out. :D

reallyBaked

07-20-2003, 01:57 AM

why did jimmy lift Ronny V after 6 ip with a 9-1 lead?

why waste the bullpen ?

it is obvious the bullpen is getting worn out from all the use.

jimmy, LEAVE THE STARTER IN WHEN HE IS WINNING 9-1!!!!!

Uprising

07-20-2003, 02:41 AM

Originally posted by reallyBaked
why did jimmy lift Ronny V after 6 ip with a 9-1 lead?

why waste the bullpen ?

it is obvious the bullpen is getting worn out from all the use.

jimmy, LEAVE THE STARTER IN WHEN HE IS WINNING 9-1!!!!!

He tried to let the good guys rest, but when the game began to be too close to comfort he brought in Dotel.

Maybe Villone's pitch count was high...

Roc Paint

07-20-2003, 04:25 AM

The Astros are on a rampage.

I say the Astros and the Yankees will go at it for the pennant.

Go Astros!! :)

How Sweet It Is

07-20-2003, 09:03 AM

Next two weeks will tell a lot about our team.

At Pitt
At Milwaukee
Cubs
at Atlanta
at Florida

bobrek

07-20-2003, 10:46 AM

Originally posted by reallyBaked
why did jimmy lift Ronny V after 6 ip with a 9-1 lead?

why waste the bullpen ?

it is obvious the bullpen is getting worn out from all the use.

jimmy, LEAVE THE STARTER IN WHEN HE IS WINNING 9-1!!!!!

He was right around 100 pitches with a 9-1 lead. Munro, Saarloos and Gallo have pitched little, if at all, in the last 7-10 days. This was one time he should have used the pen. It's not William's fault Munro and Saarloos had bad outings. He's got to be able to trust his middle relievers to hold an 8 run lead.

Uprising

07-20-2003, 12:24 PM

Originally posted by bobrek
He was right around 100 pitches with a 9-1 lead. Munro, Saarloos and Gallo have pitched little, if at all, in the last 7-10 days. This was one time he should have used the pen. It's not William's fault Munro and Saarloos had bad outings. He's got to be able to trust his middle relievers to hold an 8 run lead.

Exactly. Villone did have around 100 pitches, and so it was time to go to the pen to give the starter some rest for his next outing. They just had a bad outing, we still won. :D

How Sweet It Is

07-20-2003, 12:38 PM

Today's Starting Lineups:

For the Astros:

Biggio CF
Ensberg 3B
Bagwell 1B
Kent 2B
Berkman LF
Hidalgo RF
Ausmus C
Bruntlett SS
Miller P

For the Reds:

Jimenez 2B
Taylor CF
Guillen RF
Casey 1B
Boone 3B
Dunn LF
LaRue C
Castro SS
Graves P

Sweep?

Go Stros!:D

Uprising

07-20-2003, 12:41 PM

Originally posted by How Sweet It Is
Today's Starting Lineups:

For the Astros:

Biggio CF
Ensberg 3B
Bagwell 1B
Kent 2B
Berkman LF
Hidalgo RF
Ausmus C
Bruntlett SS
Miller P

For the Reds:

Jimenez 2B
Taylor CF
Guillen RF
Casey 1B
Boone 3B
Dunn LF
LaRue C
Castro SS
Graves P

Sweep?

Go Stros!:D

ACK!!....you just beat me with this. I was about to post the pitchers for todays games etc.