How do we FIX the Astros for next year?

[ESource]

I'm sure a lot of you will agree that we need to acquire a legitimate CF for next year. I cannot believe we would want to go into next season with the same outfielders! For all of Ward's "potential", I want to trade him for whatever we can get or put him back on the bench. He's a DH or a 1st baseman without a doubt!!! Also, I don't think we can move Hidalgo, not with his contract so I'm sure he'll be back. Maybe he can finally put it all back together again?!:eek: Anyway, what move(s) do you all feel we should make in the off-season? BUT keep in mind that we still have to contend with Drayton's self-imposed spending limit...:rolleyes:

[Timing]

We didn't lose the division because of centerfield defense. I think we need a Pedro Astacio type consistent veteran guy in the rotation and a legit power hitter/rbi man to fit in behind Bagwell.

[NewYorker]

What is wrong with the Stros?

Shaky starting pitching outside the 1-2, two outfield positions that were not producing, season ending injury to the shortstop, Adam E couldn't hit, decent third base, an aging second base man who is probably overrated now, an injured first baseman. Outside of Bagwell and Berkman, the power wasn't there.

The stros need some more hitting, at least a center fielder and a third baseman. They need a solid number 3 or 4 assuming Hernedez can play healthy and ok next year. Their relief core was weak especially in the first 3 months, but they still could use another reliever for middle innings. I'm not so Tom Gordon trade worked out too well this season.

They do that and they can go far on the backs of Oswalt and Miller.


Originally posted by ESource
I'm sure a lot of you will agree that we need to acquire a legitimate CF for next year. I cannot believe we would want to go into next season with the same outfielders! For all of Ward's "potential", I want to trade him for whatever we can get or put him back on the bench. He's a DH or a 1st baseman without a doubt!!! Also, I don't think we can move Hidalgo, not with his contract so I'm sure he'll be back. Maybe he can finally put it all back together again?!:eek: Anyway, what move(s) do you all feel we should make in the off-season? BUT keep in mind that we still have to contend with Drayton's self-imposed spending limit...:rolleyes:

[Stickfigure]

Speaking of CFs and more hitting, I would like to revive a trade I suggested before the season:

Get Carlos Beltran from the Royals (making a modest $3.5 mil) for a boatload of second-tier stuff we have, like, say, Ward, Redding, and Ensberg (on the theory that the Royals would never take Hidalgo's salary).

Also, peddle Hidalgo to anyone who will listen.

Talk trades with the Twins, who have a very crowded outfield with Jacque Jones, Torii Hunter, Bobby Kielty, Dustan Mohr, and Michael Cuddyer, Mike Restovich, and Matthew LeCroy (who can play catcher) waiting in the wings.

Do something about the middle relief. Borbon and Puffer ain't gonna cut it.
In fact, see if someone will take Billy W. and his $9 mil per year, and make Dotel the closer. Use the money saved for a decent SS or 3B (yeah, Blum has been better than expected, but he's still only about league average).

Go with a rotation of Oswalt, Miller, Saarloos, Munro, and maybe Lidge or Carlos Hernandez if either of them can stay healthy for a while.

[xiki]

Loretta, Viz, Blum in 'power' places of line-up? Gimme a break. This ol' hitting machine of a team has three major league bats. Three.

Whatever happened to the infield of the '00s? Ginter, Everett, Ensberg?

[bobrek]

Originally posted by Stickfigure
Talk trades with the Twins, who have a very crowded outfield with Jacque Jones, Torii Hunter, Bobby Kielty, Dustan Mohr, and Michael Cuddyer, Mike Restovich, and Matthew LeCroy (who can play catcher) waiting in the wings.



You are correct that the Twins have a crowded outfield, but do not include LeCroy in that bunch. He is a DH/C (possible 1B as well), but does not play the OF at all. Also, Kielty and Mohr (both had great starts) have settled into the .270-.290 range as far as average. Lane will probably be a much better major leaguer.

[Raven Lunatic]

Originally posted by Stickfigure

Go with a rotation of Oswalt, Miller, Saarloos, Munro, and maybe Lidge or Carlos Hernandez if either of them can stay healthy for a while.

I think the Astros organization may have given up on Lidge as a starter due to his injury problems.

[Buck Turgidson]

Originally posted by Timing
We didn't lose the division because of centerfield defense. I think we need a Pedro Astacio type consistent veteran guy in the rotation and a legit power hitter/rbi man to fit in behind Bagwell.
After a great start, Astacio has a 6.91 era in his 12 starts since the All-Star break.

[bobrek]

Originally posted by Raven Lunatic
I think the Astros organization may have given up on Lidge as a starter due to his injury problems.

Lidge will start instead of Hernandez against the Brewers this week. Hernandez' arm is a bit sore.

[Raven Lunatic]

Originally posted by bobrek
Lidge will start instead of Hernandez against the Brewers this week. Hernandez' arm is a bit sore.

Oh really? That's awesome. I remember the last couple years Lidge would get 5 starts or so and then have an injury. But for those 5 starts, it always seemed as if he was lights out, and everyone could only imagine what he would be like if he could stay healthy. This season I thought they were using him as a closer, but maybe I was wrong. Oh well, I would much rather him try to succeed as a starter than a reliever right now...better to get as many solid starters as you can, and then populate the bullpen with guys that couldn't quite make the cut.

[kidrock8]

There is no way that Min would trade Cuddyer, especially since they will be around til 2006. They would be more likely to trade Jacque Jones, who would probably require a 5 mill/year deal...

[Stickfigure]

Originally posted by bobrek
You are correct that the Twins have a crowded outfield, but do not include LeCroy in that bunch. He is a DH/C (possible 1B as well), but does not play the OF at all. Also, Kielty and Mohr (both had great starts) have settled into the .270-.290 range as far as average. Lane will probably be a much better major leaguer.

Sorry, didn't mean to imply that LeCroy was an outfielder. I knew that he was a DH-C, but I put him at the end of that list of Twins prospects that I think would be worth pursuing. He's never going to play there with "All-Star" Pierzynski behind the plate and a bunch of others splitting DH duties.

Kielty's batting average might be a little deceptive: he walks a ton, and the last time I checked he had an OBP of over .400, plus a great slugging percentage. Plus, he's versatile enough to play all three outfield positions. I'm sure the Twins know that also, and will let Jacque Jones walk.

I also think Lane is going to turn out well, though. Certainly no worse than Ward or Hidalgo. :(

[Timing]

Originally posted by Buck Turgidson
After a great start, Astacio has a 6.91 era in his 12 starts since the All-Star break.

He's given up 16 runs in his last 7 innings pitched. His ERA for the year before those two starts was 3.97. The guy can pitch man!

[bobrek]

The Astros were in an unfortunate situation with Astacio. They could have kept him outright for around 7-9 million or they could buy him out for 1 million. His shoulder injury made that decision easier. His reluctance to have surgery kept them from pursuing him at all. The Mets were the only team willing to give him a chance.

You are right that his ERA has recently skied because of two awful outings, but it has been steadily climbing since August 11th. His last 7 games he has given up 6,8,7,6,3,8 and 9 runs. Perhaps his shoulder problems are back. It certainly is odd that he was pitching great, and now is pitching miserably.

That being said, Astacio (or a pitcher like him) would have been good for the team, BUT a healthy Reynolds would have filled the bill as well. Unfortunately, the Astros banked on Reynolds being relatively injury free this year.

[ESource]

Originally posted by Stickfigure
Speaking of CFs and more hitting, I would like to revive a trade I suggested before the season:

Get Carlos Beltran from the Royals (making a modest $3.5 mil) for a boatload of second-tier stuff we have, like, say, Ward, Redding, and Ensberg (on the theory that the Royals would never take Hidalgo's salary).


That would be awesome if we could get Beltran from KC! BUT what would it realistically take for us to get him? He's an up-and-coming player who works cheap . We'd probably have to send a couple of top pitching prospects?:confused:

Originally posted by bobrek
Lidge will start instead of Hernandez against the Brewers this week. Hernandez' arm is a bit sore.

I think Lidge will eventually be a set-up guy like Dotel until he gets some MLB experience. It was great that he stayed healthy this year to get some badly needed innings in but the ultimate plan for Lidge should be to groom him as a stopper. He has all the requisite "power" tools and his history of arm problems make me nervous about him being a starter.....jmo

[Stevie Francis]

i think we need better pitchers, and our CF does suck, especially for the money he is makeing. our Cf is hidalgo right?

[Refman]

Originally posted by xiki
Loretta, Viz, Blum in 'power' places of line-up? Gimme a break. This ol' hitting machine of a team has three major league bats. Three.

Whatever happened to the infield of the '00s? Ginter, Everett, Ensberg?
Since when is SS a "power hitter's" position. The only 2 I can really think of are Tejada and A-Rod. SS has traditionally been a weak offensive position. Batting average around .250 and a RARE HR.

Ginter is with the Brewers. The Astros gave up on him. He wasn't getting it done in AAA. Ensberg is working on his hitting game. Everett will never bat more than .210 on the ML level...not acceptable.

[Refman]

Originally posted by Stevie Francis
i think we need better pitchers, and our CF does suck, especially for the money he is makeing. our Cf is hidalgo right?
Lance Berkman plays center field. Hidalgo is in RF.

[Timing]

Originally posted by Refman
Since when is SS a "power hitter's" position. The only 2 I can really think of are Tejada and A-Rod. SS has traditionally been a weak offensive position. Batting average around .250 and a RARE HR.


I think he's referring to Blum, Viz, and Loretta hitting in the #5/#6 slots in the lineup which are traditionally power hitting slots, not that we need a shortstop with power.

[Refman]

Originally posted by Timing
I think he's referring to Blum, Viz, and Loretta hitting in the #5/#6 slots in the lineup which are traditionally power hitting slots, not that we need a shortstop with power.
Understood. Loretta is a guy who will hit for average, but does not belong in the 5 hole. I'd like to see him in the 7 hole, with Viz/Blum in the 8 hole.

[rezdawg]

Originally posted by Timing
He's given up 16 runs in his last 7 innings pitched. His ERA for the year before those two starts was 3.97. The guy can pitch man!

Here are his last 7 starts:

5.1 IP ---- 5 ER
3.0 IP ---- 8 ER
5.0 IP ---- 6 ER
6.1 IP ---- 6 ER
6.0 IP ---- 3 ER
4.0 IP ---- 8 ER
3.1 IP ---- 8 ER


The guy has completely run out of gas. He has destroyed my fantasy team in the process.

[Behad]

Originally posted by Stevie Francis
i think we need better pitchers, and our CF does suck, especially for the money he is makeing. our Cf is hidalgo right?

And you wonder why people have a problem with you. You have no clue who our CF is, much less how good he is.

[haven]

The Astros won games this year because of "star" power.

Berkman, Oswalt, Miller, Wagner and Dotel were all great.

Biggio, Vizcaino, Blum, and Merced were all serviceable.

But it seems the only "good" player Houston had this year was Bagwell (if you don't count middle relievers). It seems our players were either elite... or mediocre.

Still, all things considered, they didn't have a bad season. If Miller's healthy next year, Munro's as good as he looks, and they can find another outfielder (or if Lane works out), then they could win the Division again.

Positions that could stand to be upgraded:

3b, 2b, ss, C, OF. Perhaps another SP, but I'd leave that alone with so many young guys showing promise. I'd also leave the OF alone, ultimately, unless we can trade Hidalgo. I can't help but think that Lane, Hidalgo, or Ward will work out (at least one of them). So, I think the infield is what must be improved.

So they have lots of options. And an upgrade at any one of those positions wouldn't be that expensive. So, I think the winter forecast looks cheery - easy to upgrade without being a bad team to begin with.

[Major]

3b, 2b, ss, C, OF. Perhaps another SP, but I'd leave that alone with so many young guys showing promise. I'd also leave the OF alone, ultimately, unless we can trade Hidalgo. I can't help but think that Lane, Hidalgo, or Ward will work out (at least one of them). So, I think the infield is what must be improved.


Say what you want about Blum, Viz, Ausmus, and Merced being mediocre, but this team is second in the league in runs scored, and far more consistent offensively than any of the previous years. We may not have the name players, but we score just as well as anyone out of Arizona, which may have even fewer name players.

Where we don't rank so well is team defense (outfield, primarily) and pitching. That tells me we need to improve our outfielders, back-end starters (Munro and Saarloos are both sketchy and don't go many innings), and middle-relief bullpen.

[Raven Lunatic]

Originally posted by bobrek
Lidge will start instead of Hernandez against the Brewers this week. Hernandez' arm is a bit sore.

Crap. This is like deja vu...the guy goes out to start and gets injured. I couldn't see the game, and I have no idea if the injury he got was serious or not. Does anyone know how serious a strained intercostal muscle is for a pitcher? It sucks that he has been injured so much over his career. If he had stayed relatively healthy, he could have been developing as a pitcher all this time, and chances are he could be one kick ass pitcher right now. :(

[Elvis Costello]

The Astros have a load of pitching and a legitimate MVP level player in Lance Berkman, but there is a definite talent deficit throughout most of the everyday players. You could get by with a weak hitting third baseman, or a defensive liability in the outfield if you had somebody producing like Moises Alou, or Carl Everett, or the long, lost Richard Hidalgo to protect Bagwell and Berkman. This is no longer the case. Darryl Ward had a full season to produce and he is just not up to it, especially with the decline of the rest of Astros line-up. Craig Biggio is still game, but the clock is ticking and his range at second is not getting any better. Brad Ausmus is solid, as is as the Astros bench, but the club needs to plug a lot of holes. The Astros are going to have to dangle some of the pitching prospects to acquire better players if Ebenezer Mclane keeps the Astros on the free agency sideline yet again.

[ESource]

Originally posted by Raven Lunatic
Crap. This is like deja vu...the guy goes out to start and gets injured. I couldn't see the game, and I have no idea if the injury he got was serious or not. Does anyone know how serious a strained intercostal muscle is for a pitcher? It sucks that he has been injured so much over his career. If he had stayed relatively healthy, he could have been developing as a pitcher all this time, and chances are he could be one kick ass pitcher right now. :(
It's a "rib-cage" muscle pull. That's all it is. Sucks especially if you're a pitcher but nothing serious. You're right about Lidge though. Has a world of talent and I've been waiting for him to finally get to the bigs when we first drafted him out of ND. I was really looking forward to seeing him get some starts in.....:(

[bobrek]

It is especially frutrating that Lidge got hurt while he was hitting. This is similar to Hernandez hurting his shoulder last year diving into 2nd base.

[Buck Turgidson]

The FA crop sucks this year. Other than Rolen & Kent, either of which would look great at 3rd next year, there's nobody worth a damn. I'd re-sign Gordon (assuming he doesn't have delusions of getting "closer" money or opportunities elsewhere), Borbon & Loretta.

http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/m_n_h_bumbaco/03agency.html

[bobrek]

Gordon has already indicated he still wants to close, just like Mike Williams did.

I'm all for them resinging Loretta, even if he was hitting .275 with them.

Borbon - if they sign him fine, if not, fine.

[Trader_Jorge]

My opinion on the biggest needs for the Astros:

1) A new 3rd baseman, preferably a run-producer. I see no reason for us to keep 3 utility infielders (blum, vizcaino, loretta) if we sign another infielder to play 3rd and Lugo comes back strong. Loretta is most likely out of the mix under this scenario.

2) A centerfielder with speed. This would allow us to put either Ward/Hidalgo/Lane in right field and Berkman in left. Brian Hunter has been decent this season, but he's getting old and isn't starter material for a division-winner.

3) a 3rd starting pitcher -- Oswalt and Miller are great. Hernandez, Reynolds, Mlicki are uncertainties. Saarloos and Munroe are both still untested over a full season.

Dump salary -- if there is any possible way to get rid of Hidalgo, Mlicki, or Reynolds I say we do it. Next on that list is Biggio and Wagner, but I can't see Drayton doing that to guys who have been Astros their entire career.

[bobrek]

Mlicki and Reynolds are already gone. They are both free agents. I suspect they may try and resign Reynolds IF he proves to be healthy and IF he takes a huge paycut.

[Trader_Jorge]

Good point, I went to AstrosDaily.com and checked out who is free agent eligible. Here is the list:

Ausmus
Borbon
Brocail (talk about a waste of $$)
Gordon
Loretta
Mlicki
Reynolds

up for salary arbitration
Blum
Nelson Cruz
Dotel (this will cost some big $$)
Ward
and all players eligible for free agency

We could really free up some cash by letting Reynolds ($7.66mm), Mlicki ($6.2mm), and Brocail ($750k) leave, but we'll also use up money with Dotel's new contract. We'll also be receiving another $4mm or so from the new revenue sharing agreement.

One thing I don't understand is whether or not Lugo or Wade Miller will be arbitration eligible. What is the minimum service requirement (years) form them to qualify?

[ESource]

Originally posted by Buck Turgidson
Other than Rolen & Kent, either of which would look great at 3rd next year, there's nobody worth a damn.

http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/m_n_h_bumbaco/03agency.html
How much $$$ would it take to get Kent in here? And do you think he'd play 3rd?