View Full Version : [Ken Berger Trade Talk Blog Post] Rockets among teams interested in getting Haywood
Carl Herrera
02-09-2010, 11:05 AM
http://ken-berger.blogs.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/11838893/19986881?source=rss_blogs_NBA
So, will we wake up on the morning after trade deadline with Haywood?
I can see how he makes sense. Very good talent to salary ratio for the remainder of this year. Probably can be retained at a somewhat reasonable price next year, too, as a free agent. Washington likely willing to trade him for the right price given that they are rebuilding and he's not that young (and probably not likely to return next season as FA, considering everythign). Morey complained many times about how 7 footers who aren't stiffs are hard to get and expensive. This guy is a glaring exception.
Other teams know it, too, though and might be willing to offer more.
RedRowdy111
02-09-2010, 11:07 AM
I'm pretty sure this is posted a few times on here already.
baller4life315
02-09-2010, 11:08 AM
Are we talking about a separate deal for just Haywood or does this pertain to the Butler + Haywood for whatever talks?
I'd rather have Gortat but I'm definitely open to Haywood in any fashion.
RedRowdy111
02-09-2010, 11:11 AM
Are we talking about a separate deal for just Haywood or does this pertain to the Butler + Haywood for whatever talks?
I'd rather have Gortat but I'm definitely open to Haywood in any fashion.
He would be a rental, so i wouldnt lay down a huge offer.
Big MAK
02-09-2010, 11:11 AM
Love Haywood as a backup for Yao, but I'm not a Butler fan. I'd rather keep Tracy than trade for Butler.
Pass 1st, shoot 2nd
02-09-2010, 11:22 AM
I can see how [Haywood] he makes sense.
I can, too. My only real concern is that he's a talented big man who will want more than he's worth, in terms of salary and years under a guaranteed contract.
With that said, I still want Iggy and Dalembert.
Alvin Choo
02-09-2010, 11:24 AM
Haywood for battier. And Tmac for a wing player. I'm happy for the rest of this season.
this is different, this sounds like a deal for haywood only..
mrfirefly7
02-09-2010, 11:31 AM
C. Butler + Haywood for TMac.
Yes please.
HeyDude
02-09-2010, 11:32 AM
If we get Haywood then Scola would most likely be in the package. No way we would be able to keep all of Landry, Scola, Haywood, Hayes, Yao, Anderson, Dorsey for just 2 positions next year. I could see a TMAC + Scola + Budd for Butler, Haywood, Miller + 2nd round pick type trade.
rockets934life
02-09-2010, 11:38 AM
Haywood for battier. And Tmac for a wing player. I'm happy for the rest of this season.
Shane for Haywood would be ideal but being a big man/expiring contract I can't see them settling for just Shane. Best way to get Haywood would be in a Butler/Haywood deal although if all else fails and they don't get want they need then maybe do something like...
Battier/Andersen/Cook/#2
for
Miller/Haywood
Gives them a veteran wing player, shooting big man and a cook which would almost get them under the LT which saves them TONS of money. This would be a last ditch effort kind of trade but would help us this season, allow us more flexibility next season but would send us further into LT land so a long shot really.
waytookrzy079
02-09-2010, 11:53 AM
Are we talking about a separate deal for just Haywood or does this pertain to the Butler + Haywood for whatever talks?
I'd rather have Gortat but I'm definitely open to Haywood in any fashion.
If DM and the Rockets werent going to offer Gortat more than 2-3 mil/year, what makes you think they would trade for him and be forced to pay him 5-7mil/year for the next 4 years???
BetterThanEver
02-09-2010, 11:58 AM
If DM and the Rockets werent going to offer Gortat more than 2-3 mil/year, what makes you think they would trade for him and be forced to pay him 5-7mil/year for the next 4 years???
With a trade instead of a FA signing, DM won't be limited to splitting the MLE between Gortat and Ariza/Artest.
BetterThanEver
02-09-2010, 12:00 PM
Haywood is also better than Gortat.
Haywood is a 10/10 double double guy. Gortat is a 3/3 guy.
Dave_78
02-09-2010, 12:01 PM
Haywood for Ariza!!
Get it done.
vlaurelio
02-09-2010, 12:18 PM
I'd rather keep Tracy than trade for Butler.
meaning let him rot on the bench 'til he expires or gets bought out?
albuster
02-09-2010, 12:29 PM
Haywood for Ariza!!
Get it done.
This!!! And DM may add Cook to sweeten the deal?
FLASH21
02-09-2010, 12:31 PM
I doubt this would be a straight up thread like Ariza for Haywood or Scola + Taylor for Haywood.
More than likely it would be a mix of Tracy + filler for Butler, Haywood, and filler. I'd take that any day.
Most of you that say you don't like Butler I know haven't really seen him play, he's tough, has a motor that goes for days, and plays with heart. Fits right in with our scrappy "role players".
I'd take Butler and his low 2 year contract over Igoudala and his 5 year increasingly growing contract.
FLASH21
02-09-2010, 12:32 PM
I doubt this would be a straight up trade like Ariza for Haywood or Scola + Taylor for Haywood.
More than likely it would be a mix of Tracy + filler for Butler, Haywood, and filler. I'd take that any day.
Most of you that say you don't like Butler I know haven't really seen him play, he's tough, has a motor that goes for days, and plays with heart. Fits right in with our scrappy "role players".
I'd take Butler and his low 2 year contract over Igoudala and his 5 year increasingly growing contract.
fixed, sorry
RocketsFan11
02-09-2010, 12:39 PM
If we are going to trade we better get an IMPACT player. Not a role player that we really don't need and won't bring back next year. What's the point?
And I DO NOT like Caron Bulter either... PASS!
No, I dont think we will. Rockets appear to be pushing for a trade for KMart23. Not sure if that will happen either.
adammendoza4
02-09-2010, 12:43 PM
I kind of don't care about trades with washington, id rather let tracys contract expire then
To jus be getting rentals or anything
Al Capone
02-09-2010, 12:55 PM
This will not win us a championship.
This will not win us a championship.
we're not winning anything this year anyway..
jump shooter
02-09-2010, 02:17 PM
He would be a rental, so i wouldnt lay down a huge offer.
How would he be a rental when u have his bird rights this offseason? I would only do a Caron Butler trade if Haywood were included. With an career injury plagued center in Yao, its paramount the rockets aquire a serviceable center who can block shots and rebound. Yao will probably not be able to play big minutes the rest of his career.
jump shooter
02-09-2010, 02:19 PM
Haywood is also better than Gortat.
Haywood is a 10/10 double double guy. Gortat is a 3/3 guy.
Agree, Haywood is the proven player.
Al Capone
02-09-2010, 02:21 PM
we're not winning anything this year anyway..
This will not win us a championship any year.
LifeisButaDream
02-09-2010, 02:22 PM
This will not win us a championship any year.
So then what will?
abc2007
02-09-2010, 02:23 PM
Why will Haywood resgin with the rockets to backup Yao next season?
DieHard Rocket
02-09-2010, 02:32 PM
This will not win us a championship any year.
Forget Haywood- if we re-sign him at a decent price, great...he's a good backup Center and a piece of the puzzle. If not, he's off the books after this year.
But a productive, expiring contract of Caron Butler next year could be a useful tool to help build a champion. He could be packaged to bring in a player that could actually help us win a championship, or if we can re-sign him at a decent price it opens up Battier and Ariza to be traded.
There is nobody in free agency this year that we'll be able to afford with the amount of space we have that is better than Butler. Likewise, we probably won't be able to find a backup center as good as Haywood (if we can afford to re-sign him). These two guys are potential ASSETS, and building assets will help you win a championship.
Rockets4279
02-09-2010, 02:37 PM
If DM and the Rockets werent going to offer Gortat more than 2-3 mil/year, what makes you think they would trade for him and be forced to pay him 5-7mil/year for the next 4 years???
Haahaa, they are stockpilling for 2012-2013 and are budget spending, trying to win and collect funds, and have assets at bay. they are after guys like Durant and will wait and not spend, especially in this economy. Ticket sales go down, when economy picks back up they'll be ready for max sale out compacity crouds. No way our economy recovers though. At some point, you have to seriously look into those kinds of option, knowing the best players in the league will be through drafts after LeBron, Wade, Kobe retires - Yao same, guys with new teams, new contracts - etc... That is the only way to look at it. Stockpile now and be patient and be ready by 2012-2013, ofcourse they'll be making move after move if it presents itself, but always be after plugging holes and landing/buying picks and budget spending.
This will not win us a championship any year.
so tell me what the winning lottery numbers are this week, since you seem to know the future...
You dont know who else we'll acquire as tmac's replacement, you dont even know if we'll do it this month or in the summer. you also dont know what core players we'll retain this summer or include in a trade...dont know who we'll sign with our 5 mill this summer...we're not talking about a scrub here, haywood is a VERY solid back up center and he alone won't be the reason we win or l ose a ring, he's a piece of a much bigger puzzle, wait for the puzzle to be finished.
Forget Haywood- if we re-sign him at a decent price, great...he's a good backup Center and a piece of the puzzle. If not, he's off the books after this year.
But a productive, expiring contract of Caron Butler next year could be a useful tool to help build a champion. He could be packaged to bring in a player that could actually help us win a championship, or if we can re-sign him at a decent price it opens up Battier and Ariza to be traded.
There is nobody in free agency this year that we'll be able to afford with the amount of space we have that is better than Butler. Likewise, we probably won't be able to find a backup center as good as Haywood (if we can afford to re-sign him). These two guys are potential ASSETS, and building assets will help you win a championship.
Both butler and battier are FA next year, so battier wont be available to be traded unless we re-sign him...
but this is a reason why i like the butler acquisition, it's very much like the ron experiment. High reward if it works, low risk if it doesnt. We get a year, healthy more than likely, to see what this team can do, if yao doesnt come back as himself or cracks again, butler doesnt work out, and battier isn't worth it anymore, then all 3 can be gone this summer. that makes us tons younger and allows us to end the "win now" experiment, while still having our young guns right before their prime and cap space to sign another rising star.
butler 10 mill+battier 7 mill+ yao 17 mill all off the books....just in time to resign landry and extend brooks. Opt out of DA's team option and that's almost 3 more mill.. that cuts out our oldest players all in one summer. it's the ultimate flexibility when you're trying to decide whether to stick with your vets or go young.
Scola is the only question mark, he'd be one of our oldest, but we have to wait and see if he stays past this summer or not.
Al Capone
02-09-2010, 02:59 PM
so tell me what the winning lottery numbers are this week, since you seem to know the future...
You dont know who else we'll acquire as tmac's replacement, you dont even know if we'll do it this month or in the summer. you also dont know what core players we'll retain this summer or include in a trade...dont know who we'll sign with our 5 mill this summer...we're not talking about a scrub here, haywood is a VERY solid back up center and he alone won't be the reason we win or l ose a ring, he's a piece of a much bigger puzzle, wait for the puzzle to be finished.
I am not knocking this thread nor am I knocking Haywood.
What I am saying is signing players at the caliber of Butler and Haywood, continuing to build around injury prone Yao, adding more role players, etc etc, without adding a bonafide superstar is just not going to cut it with the level of competition out there, especially in the West.
It very well may be the best Morey can do but realistically, it's not good enough.
LifeisButaDream
02-09-2010, 03:06 PM
I am not knocking this thread nor am I knocking Haywood.
What I am saying is signing players at the caliber of Butler and Haywood, continuing to build around injury prone Yao, adding more role players, etc etc, without adding a bonafide superstar is just not going to cut it with the level of competition out there, especially in the West.
It very well may be the best Morey can do but realistically, it's not good enough.
Remember when kobe wanted to be traded because had no help.it took years for the fakers to get this good.
All things considered, I think the Rox are better off trading with the Wizards than getting Iggy from the 76ers. Butler has a more affordable contract that expires after next season. Iggy is paid like an elite player and has proven that he cant carry a team any further than T-Mac can. A trade with the Wizards could also net you Haywood, who can provide a legit big body to defend the rim and rebound. Thats something the Rox have needed all season. He could possibly be resigned next season to a reasonable contract.
I'd much rather get Butler/Haywood and whatever filler that comes along than by just letting T-Mac's contract expire.
Just my $2.02 (adjusted for inflation)
baller4life315
02-09-2010, 03:10 PM
If DM and the Rockets werent going to offer Gortat more than 2-3 mil/year, what makes you think they would trade for him and be forced to pay him 5-7mil/year for the next 4 years???
LOL....Where did you get $2-3M per year? Your figures are not even close. We were prepared to offer Gortat roughly 3/4's of the MLE or something along those lines with the holdup being Morey wanted to retain a portion of the MLE for future roster flexibility (i.e. signing rookies). If you feel as I do that he's a starter in this league, $5-7M per year isn't such a steep asking price after all. The guy can play both frontcourt spots and we have one of our key bigs entering free agency this summer. There's a laundry list of reasons why Gortat makes sense.
...and Haywood is NOT better than Gortat. Haywood has been a marginal starter in this league for years and is just now having his "breakout" season at the age of 30 in a contract year no less. I know he's a decent player and I would take him on this team in a heartbeat, but I don't for one second believe he's better than Gortat. Once Gortat gets a chance to actually play you'll understand why this is the case. It doesn't help when you back up one of the most durable players in the league.
Al Capone
02-09-2010, 03:49 PM
Remember when kobe wanted to be traded because had no help.it took years for the fakers to get this good.
Yea, but we don't have a Kobe.
I am not knocking this thread nor am I knocking Haywood.
What I am saying is signing players at the caliber of Butler and Haywood, continuing to build around injury prone Yao, adding more role players, etc etc, without adding a bonafide superstar is just not going to cut it with the level of competition out there, especially in the West.
It very well may be the best Morey can do but realistically, it's not good enough.
I think it's clear that superstars with no help cant get it done, we've been through that, but fans seem to feel as if the only winning formula is superstars +help, but it's not. Although not common, you can win without having that bonafide superstar, like the pistons did. And really there's very few of those supersstars, the kobes, wades, and lebrons. One could argue that the boston trio has those superstars, but that's only through their reputation, in reality, when they won a ring they didnt play like the superstars they use to be. They turned more into super role players, no longer they did score 25+ a game. PP was the only one who even reached 20ppg.
We can have a similar scoring distribution here with yao, brooks and someone like butler or even iggy AND we'd still have solid help in scola, landry, ariza, and haywood. Any of them can average 10-12 pts a game without trying to do too much or stepping out of their comfort zone.
Cohete Rojo
02-09-2010, 04:29 PM
The Wizards are trying to move Jamison to Cleveland, and Scola could replace him. Three team trade?
The Wizards are trying to move Jamison to Cleveland, and Scola could replace him. Three team trade?
i dont think the wiz are interested in vets, which is part of the reason why they are willing to trade jamison. they want expirings and youth.
LifeisButaDream
02-09-2010, 04:40 PM
i dont think the wiz are interested in vets, which is part of the reason why they are willing to trade jamison. they want expirings and youth.
Then why do they want to keep m.miller?
rockets934life
02-09-2010, 04:46 PM
Then why do they want to keep m.miller?
Who said they did? I think Miller is gone to a contender, dude is a difference maker that could transform a team from real good to great. I'd kill to get that dude over here with Butler/Haywood.
Then why do they want to keep m.miller?
yeah i dont think they've said they want to, he just hasnt been in rumors much, so it seems like they are pushing jamison/haywood/butler out and not miller, but i doubt that's the case.
saleem
02-09-2010, 05:30 PM
http://ken-berger.blogs.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/11838893/19986881?source=rss_blogs_NBA
So, will we wake up on the morning after trade deadline with Haywood?
I can see how he makes sense. Very good talent to salary ratio for the remainder of this year. Probably can be retained at a somewhat reasonable price next year, too, as a free agent. Washington likely willing to trade him for the right price given that they are rebuilding and he's not that young (and probably not likely to return next season as FA, considering everythign). Morey complained many times about how 7 footers who aren't stiffs are hard to get and expensive. This guy is a glaring exception.
Other teams know it, too, though and might be willing to offer more.
I'm surprised that you have changed your mind so quickly. Haywood isn't bad,and we do need a true backup center,but he lacks fighting spirit.
DieHard Rocket
02-09-2010, 05:40 PM
Both butler and battier are FA next year, so battier wont be available to be traded unless we re-sign him...
but this is a reason why i like the butler acquisition, it's very much like the ron experiment. High reward if it works, low risk if it doesnt. We get a year, healthy more than likely, to see what this team can do, if yao doesnt come back as himself or cracks again, butler doesnt work out, and battier isn't worth it anymore, then all 3 can be gone this summer. that makes us tons younger and allows us to end the "win now" experiment, while still having our young guns right before their prime and cap space to sign another rising star.
butler 10 mill+battier 7 mill+ yao 17 mill all off the books....just in time to resign landry and extend brooks. Opt out of DA's team option and that's almost 3 more mill.. that cuts out our oldest players all in one summer. it's the ultimate flexibility when you're trying to decide whether to stick with your vets or go young.
Scola is the only question mark, he'd be one of our oldest, but we have to wait and see if he stays past this summer or not.
Good post. Exactly why I'm all for a Butler trade. He gives us more firepower short term than free agency would, and doesn't kill us long term.
I was thinking Battier had one more year than Butler, but you're right. Still, that gives us a chance to package Battier as an expiring if we'd rather keep Butler (and think we can re-sign him).
Rockets4279
02-09-2010, 08:37 PM
Wizards wont trade Jamison to Cavs do to that signing from Larry Hughes and their recent playoff series, their GM wont trade Jamison to Cavs so he can help them win a ring.
Rockets4279
02-09-2010, 08:53 PM
Then why do they want to keep m.miller?
Because he's expiring and they may have plans with him. He could be a reason why they'd ask for Budinger.
We have the pieces they need to fit their agenda, the question is they don't want to help another team, and not even themseleves, because they could not get it done in Washington. They want pieces that put them in a good jump position to rebuild from which ain't happening. Our young pieces are producing and winning and their aged vets lose more then they win, that is the story. They need to start over and it did not work, but let them continue in that direction and they are going nowhere. Utah can land Butler and or Jamison for their pick and youth if they wanted to maybe! even Phoenix, but they don't have the pieces/pick like Houston does, just salaries that match to make it look good.
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