[yahoo] McGrady and Adelman in heated argument

[ibm]

the drama, 2 years in a row.

i was irritated last year. this time around, i actually feel pretty entertained. the team is in control (unlike last year), and i get to read a lot fun threads on cfan.

mcgrady entertains me. no on the court, but off. that is his only value to me - until he leaves this team or is traded (hope it doesn't get to an ai situation).

[tested911]

I do think he is ready....I think he was ready at the start of training camp, I think the team is using this as an excuse to:

a: Punish him for last year
b: Get insurance eligible
c: get Rick's system in place
d: develop new talent.

I am ok with all of that.

DD


DD I think you forgot

e: looking at reasonable trade offers :grin:

[DieHard Rocket]

This could get very ugly if this escalates. We can't just trade him for scrap- we HAVE to turn that contract into one of our next start players either through trade or FA. No way we are just going to give him what he wants if he ends up wanting out.

The Rockets on the other hand have no reason to hurry him back. We are collecting insurance money on him, we are playing well, and frankly, it isn't a given that he's going to produce for us. Believe me, if this were the T-mac of 2004, they'd at least be talking about getting him back on the court. You can't blame the Rockets and you can't blame Tracy for being frustrated. John Weisbrod is looking a little less like an idiot now, though.

[t_mac1]

Well couldn't this draw unfold after the 23rd?? Then basically he would have all the ammo on his side.. By doing this publicity stunt he has given 0 good reasons. If this came out after the 23rd and he say's "I"m healthy as a fiddle and have been cleared to play by the MRI" then the Rockets organization would look silly not to play him...

i think it's pretty much known the MRI is not going to reveal anything. he's been pain-free FOR MONTHS. like the article says, it's about insurance money.

again, 41 games passed. i think the team might want to keep him out and collect a certain amount of money (don't know how much). and they want to to punish him for last year.

i just want both sides to sit down and say what's on their minds. the team needs to tell him what they are doing explicitly and what hteir expectations of him are. mcgrady needs to tell the team what he thinks his role is on this team and how he expects to play. if mcgrady still thinks he's an alpha-male player, then it's time to ship him off or bench him permanently until a trade is done.

[Dream Shake 81]

Rick knows what happened last year. I know ppl who are in the rox org- they ALL said the locker room got tense at times. Rafer, T-mac, Artest etc. This year it's Battier and the Chuckster leading the team. Just imagine how much positivity / example of hard work those guys bring to all the young guys. This is THE reason we have such great chemistry right now. There is an atmosphere of sharing the ball etc. I am a T-mac fan, but he has a SuperStar ego, and mannerisms. If the young guys look up to him our team would not be as effective. Rick is in complete control right now. He does not want to change that. He does need to come to terms with T-mac. It is BS to let him rot on the bench. Let him come off the bench for a while so he fits in to what is already there.

[MiddleMan]

Right now i feel really mad at Adelman, he's clearly being unfair to McGrady, and
he shouldn't be treating him that way.Like someone said, is like he's taking revenge about last season. The thing is
THAT'S NOT HOW BASKETBALL BUSINESS SHOULD BE HANDLED!!

I know that's Adelman's job and i can tell him how to do his job, but still, they don't look
at the way he can play right now, they only look at the way he played last season...

The confrontation had been building for weeks, sources say, and underscores a lingering uneasiness between the organization and McGrady. Adelman and McGrady had a dispute last February over the way McGrady informed the team that he had chosen to undergo season-ending knee surgery. Instead of telling them directly, McGrady released the information to the public.

I hope Les, Aldeman and Morey stick to their guns on this one!!!! They have my support.

[DaDakota]

I hope Les, Aldeman and Morey stick to their guns on this one!!!! They have my support.

They heard the boos, they know that most Rocket fans support the team over any player.

DD

[tinman]

They heard the boos, they know that most Rocket fans support the team over any player.

DD

Well, all Rocket fans support the team over any player.
Who are those other people who support player over team?

[MiddleMan]

Yahoo Sports broke...

The Yao Ming out for year story...
The Ariza/ Artest "swap"...
The draft night "pick purchases"...

All before Feigen did...

They have a know into what is going on.


They are in denial, bro.

[tested911]

The confrontation had been building for weeks, sources say, and underscores a lingering uneasiness between the organization and McGrady. Adelman and McGrady had a dispute last February over the way McGrady informed the team that he had chosen to undergo season-ending knee surgery. Instead of telling them directly, McGrady released the information to the public.

I hope Les, Aldeman and Morey stick to their guns on this one!!!! They have my support.

Let me Play!!

http://squirtgunn.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/05/tmac.png

[dachuda86]

Well, all Rocket fans support the team over any player.
Who are those other people who support player over team?

http://thejoyoflex.files.wordpress.com/2009/05/i-see-what-you-mean-denver.jpg


I see what you did there.

[blactrs2]

i think let him play. we need a closer. its not going to hurt anything or anyone to try it out. i understand they're probably making him wait bc of his actions last season and if so thats fine but dont let it get out of hand, just play him and if he messes up the chemistry (which i feel he will bc he's never had a lot of movement on the court, he will stifle ball movement IMO) then get rid of him. its that simple...but i can also understand then allowing him to sit out bc of the insurnace situation...but i wld love to see him if for no other reason just to get ariza to stop handling the ball so often. battier and ariza are great bball players but terrible ball handlers which puts pressure on our guards to handle the ball too much at times

[legend215]

and that's reasonable. my problem AFTER READING THE YAHOO ARTICLE (again, i'm going by what they report) is this:

mcgrady's cleared by the doctor who did the surgery to do full contact. if they don't want to rush him back to play actual NBA games, that's fine. that's the right thing to do in fact. BUT WHY HOLD HIM OUT IN PRACTICE AT TRAINING CAMP?


So t_mac1...what do you have to say about the info coming out that the argument didn't happen and that Tracy was the one that fed Yahoo the story?

[MiddleMan]

What round of the playoffs did we get to that year?

I think it was the same round Francis took us too

Rocket River

It's on me!!!

[MiddleMan]

Let me Play!!

http://squirtgunn.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/05/tmac.png



You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to tested911 again.

[Possum]

TMac is the new Steve Francis. Like I said a year ago the only value this guy has left to this team is as an expiring contract. Anyone who doesnt see that isnt paying attention. :rolleyes: We need to get what we can for this guy and move on.

[Angkor Wat]

Well, all Rocket fans support the team over any player.
Who are those other people who support player over team?

Well, to support the team, means you have to support T-Mac, who is still on the team. Nice to see you're still T-Mac's biggest fan. :cool:

[Tenchi]

i think let him play. we need a closer. its not going to hurt anything or anyone to try it out. i understand they're probably making him wait bc of his actions last season and if so thats fine but dont let it get out of hand, just play him and if he messes up the chemistry (which i feel he will bc he's never had a lot of movement on the court, he will stifle ball movement IMO) then get rid of him. its that simple...but i can also understand then allowing him to sit out bc of the insurnace situation...but i wld love to see him if for no other reason just to get ariza to stop handling the ball so often. battier and ariza are great bball players but terrible ball handlers which puts pressure on our guards to handle the ball too much at times

If you let him play, it takes away time from the younger guys who are still learning and trying to develop. If he plays and you either trade him or let his contract expire then he's not going to be here next year. If your players develop this year, figure out how to run the offense, and come back next year with Yao and whatever Free Agent, they'll have a good chance of going very far into the playoffs. The positives of sitting him out outweigh the negatives, whether for insurance money, or for letting him heal properly.

[EssTooKayTD]

Let me Play!!

http://squirtgunn.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/05/tmac.png

Um...funny with the detail, but he wears number 3. Forgot to add, "if this is new."

[EssTooKayTD]

If you let him play, it takes away time from the younger guys who are still learning and trying to develop. If he plays and you either trade him or let his contract expire then he's not going to be here next year. If your players develop this year, figure out how to run the offense, and come back next year with Yao and whatever Free Agent, they'll have a good chance of going very far into the playoffs. The positives of sitting him out outweigh the negatives, whether for insurance money, or for letting him heal properly.
Then just tell him that straight up. Everyone thinks he's coming back soon. If they have no intentions of that happening, just tell him. Take the higher road, none of this punish him crap. What's the saying? Don't stoop to so-and-so's level.

[MiddleMan]

[QUOTE=Yahoo]The confrontation had been building for weeks, sources say, and underscores a lingering uneasiness between the organization and McGrady. Adelman and McGrady had a dispute last February over the way McGrady informed the team that he had chosen to undergo season-ending knee surgery. Instead of telling them directly, McGrady released the information to the public.


You know what would be real Karma??? If Morey is real quite and trade Tracy while he find out watching Sportcenter!!! That will put the cherry on top!! :grin:

[Franchise2001]

“There is no timetable,” Adelman said. “Though it looks like there's been a lot of timetables out there the last day or so, there hasn't been for me.”

timetable means approximate dates. adelman has reiterated MANY times there is no timetable. he's been very adamant about that. 11/23 is simply the date of the MRI and practice. no one from the organization has said if he practices well, he'll play right after. or if he practices well, how much more would he have to stay out before playing.

When you have $20M+/year invested in an asset. You should have complete control over what you do with it for the better of the team. If Tmac comes back healthy and plays within the system, then we all win.

You are dealing with a serious injury. Let the Rockets have all the info, between MRI and quality of practice, they need to make the best decision for them.

Another point: Tmac wanted to play last year when he had zero business doing so.

[Seth]

You know what would be real Karma??? If Morey is real quite and trade Tracy while he find out watching Sportcenter!!! That will put the cherry on top!! :grin:
Lol, would be really funny. Though i think Adelman and Morey are better men than McGrady, they will inform him first. But when the deal is done, so that he cannot call himself out for the season again.

[daywalker02]

Nowhere else can a peaceful conversation turn into a heated argument. ;)

[Angkor Wat]

You know what would be real Karma??? If Morey is real quite and trade Tracy while he find out watching Sportcenter!!! That will put the cherry on top!! :grin:

Not karma, but reality. The majority of the time, players get traded and find out via media. Nothing new. Even Skip said last year he didn't even know he got traded until he saw it on TV. This is another reason why I thought they blew that situation out of proportion because teams do that to players all the time. Then agian, management has the power, players do not.

[Dream Shake 81]

If it was me in T-mac's situation, i would do the same thing. As a man you are looking out to keep your job or worth. RA is overall lessening Tracy's value.

[rimrocker]

http://l.yimg.com/n/util/anysize/230x-259200,http:%2F%2Fa323.yahoofs.com%2Fymg%2Fnull__15%2Fnull-994688870-1245342299.jpg%3Fymb5_bBDynsUZsoa

It's not personal T-Mac. It's just business.

[baller4life315]

The most important point that everybody is missing from this article:

The Rockets have insisted McGrady hasn’t had enough practice time and is still unfit to pay, a claim that McGrady disputes.

His conditioning and lack of practice time is the main issue here. Sure, we've all known about the Nov 23rd MRI for quite some time now. Do I expect him to pass the MRI with flying colors? Absolutely. But will that change anything in regards to the timetable of his return? No, because if the opinion of Rockets brass on Nov 20th is that he's not game ready, that most certainly is not going to change between now and Monday. You don't just magically gain months of conditioning overnight....literally.

As far as the validity of the report goes, I don't doubt that McGrady is frustrated and that some form of "What the hell is going on?" type exchange took place between he and Adelman. The whole incident of McGrady putting on his uniform was sort of like a mini-protest. I'm sure there's been tension building there on both sides. I just hope that a compromise can be met because (1) We don't need any distractions, (2) It kills his trade value if we tip our cap and let everybody know that we HAVE to deal him and (3) Because, well, i'm still curious if he can help this team out. In any event, burning bridges and not communicating does this team absolutely no good at all. Even if he never plays another game for the Rockets, I hope we at least have the decency to explain the situation to him that "Hey, we're moving on and we'll do our best to trade you".

[tested911]

If it was me in T-mac's situation, i would do the same thing. As a man you are looking out to keep your job or worth. RA is overall lessening Tracy's value.

It's not like he's a rookie or trying to establish himself in the league. He has already accumulated over 100+ Million dollars.. Show respect to the organization and maybe they will treat you the same. DM has consistently said good things about him yet he pulls a whiner card out.

[tingalingy]

Question about TMAC and the insurance.

We can begin collecting insurance after the 41st consecutive missed game. But is that something that would be tradeable?

Could we conceivably trade TMac to another team, where they could apply for the insurance money?

Because if they could, that would be a HUGE asset in a trade situation.

Although that's not something that we would do. But think about it. I mean, as it is, insurance is picking up about 9 million of TMac's salary. In a trade situation, with the trade rules of player's salaries being within 25% of each other, we could trade a 14 million salary (23mil - 9mil insurance) for 28 mil in return.

We wouldn't do it, but WOW!, how good of a chip would that be if we could? 28 million for 14 million in this economy. It'd be gold!!!!

[tmacfor35]

I was at work listening to the radio a few months ago and they had Steve Francis on, he claimed his last year in Houston when Morey and Adelman were saying he couldn't play because of his leg injuries, that he could have easily played and played the way he likes to play the game.The same thing is happening here. We have seen the videos, a month in a half ago in Boston, Mcgrady was repeatedly jumping off his left foot and dunking the basketball with ease. Not to attack Morey, because you have to love the guy for being such a great GM for our Rockets, but the guy is obviously is pulling a Drayton McLane and taking the money over the team success. Now I could be completely wrong and very well may be, as he could be waiting for that MRI, but im getting tired of this drama and the bad mouthing Tracy gets for WANTING to PLAY.

[aghast]

...Assuming that McGrady is covered under the NBA’s Temporary Total Disability (TTD) insurance policy, Houston can start to collect up to 80 percent of his prorated per-game salary after he’s missed 41 consecutive games. McGrady sat out his 42nd straight game Wednesday in Minnesota, and the league insurance plan would reimburse the Rockets for any additional missed games.

For the rest of the season, the insurance policy could cover 80 percent of his per-game salary of $282,946. Even if McGrady returns to the lineup for one or more games this season, the insurance would still pay the Rockets for each additional missed game...

As others have pointed out, we now know why the MRI date scheduled was set in stone, as an insurance policy on his insurance policy.

It's a smart financial move by the Rockets, even if it alienates McGrady and weakens the team in the short term. (This assumes the Rockets never planned to keep McGrady past this season, and instead will either trade him or let him go this offseason.) McGrady will still have to play well when he does return in order to get another deal, and the Rockets and/or (presumably) the team he is traded to can cash some disability checks if he is re-injured.

Bad for basketball, good for business.

[aghast]

Also, to those blaming McGrady for wanting to come back at Minnesota: if I'm reading the above correctly, wasn't McGrady wanting to come back during the 42nd game?

In other words, wasn't McGrady resigned to waiting until insurance covered him the rest of the season, and voiced his anger to reporters when the Rockets didn't play him in that 42nd game?

[tmacfor35]

This team in the halfcourt with Mcgrady, is a much better team. Our first unit is not a running team so I still dont understand why people assume Tracy will hurt the team. He will start. He takes the pressure off Ariza and Brooks and makes our 1st unit significantly better with the ability to create shots for other players. I for one, am tired of watching Ariza try to create for himself.

[Dave_78]

The Rockets are not punishing McGrady. What good could come out of being petty and starting a feud with a guy you want to move? Other teams smell blood when things like that happen. Plus, when was the last time you heard Morey or Adelman say anything bad about the guy? They have been nothing but accommodating to Tracy and his ego even when it hurt the team. They are not going to throw him under the bus now without a really, really good reason.

More likely it's a combination of the Rockets wanting the insurance money and the team wanting to be sure he is fit before letting him play. We all know the guy is a flat-out liar when it comes to his health so it's better to be safe than sorry. I'm not saying the Rockets really want him back on the court because I doubt they care that much considering how good the team is without him. I'm just saying they are not going to hold out a healthy player just to get revenge on the guy for him being a bum last year.

I would imagine, on a personal level, they are so sick of this guy they wish he would get hit by a dump truck tomorrow but they are professionals and will continue to be even though their star player isn't.

[G0 R0CKETS]

Let that vato play man.....either two things happen he plays well or he injures himself. Either way what do we have to lose?

[ibm]

Let that vato play man.....either two things happen he plays well or he injures himself. Either way what do we have to lose?

really? what if he doesn't play well and doesn't get injured either?

and "he plays well" =/= the team plays well. there's a lot at stake, like team chemistry, or leslie's wallet.

logic, man.

[Angkor Wat]

Lol, would be really funny. Though i think Adelman and Morey are better men than McGrady, they will inform him first. But when the deal is done, so that he cannot call himself out for the season again.

Actually, they traded Skip and he didn't know until he watched TV. Now, that doesn't make Morey and Rick bad people. Nor does it make the hundreds of GMs out there who've done the same thing year after year. Players get traded and don't find out about it through the media all the time. But T-Mac essentially does the same time and he's the worst man alive. Then again, like I said, T-mac isn't the one with the power.

[shortfuse3]

...Assuming that McGrady is covered under the NBA’s Temporary Total Disability (TTD) insurance policy, Houston can start to collect up to 80 percent of his prorated per-game salary after he’s missed 41 consecutive games. McGrady sat out his 42nd straight game Wednesday in Minnesota, and the league insurance plan would reimburse the Rockets for any additional missed games.

For the rest of the season, the insurance policy could cover 80 percent of his per-game salary of $282,946. Even if McGrady returns to the lineup for one or more games this season, the insurance would still pay the Rockets for each additional missed game...

As others have pointed out, we now know why the MRI date scheduled was set in stone, as an insurance policy on his insurance policy.

It's a smart financial move by the Rockets, even if it alienates McGrady and weakens the team in the short term. (This assumes the Rockets never planned to keep McGrady past this season, and instead will either trade him or let him go this offseason.) McGrady will still have to play well when he does return in order to get another deal, and the Rockets and/or (presumably) the team he is traded to can cash some disability checks if he is re-injured.

Bad for basketball, good for business.

bad for basketball if you think t-mac elevates us from playoff team to a dark horse contending team. since morey and adelman are in no rush to have t-mac back i don't think they think he will help that much.

[Hakeemtheking]

Soon the Players Association, the NBA front office will get involved as well. They will put pressure on the Rockets to either play him or trade him. It might be wishful thinking but I hope things get resolved soon.... one way or the other.

REMEMBER TRUE ROCKETS FANS: TEAM ABOVE ANY PLAYER. ANY.

[Texxx]

I see that this site still has a bunch of pathetic Tmac fan boys who can't get over there infatuation with one of the biggest losers in NBA history. A guy with all that talent that could never get his team through the first round of the playoffs, and mentioned more than once that he wasn't always completely into it when regarding the sport of basketball.

Tmac couldn't ever get the Rockets anywhere in the post season and the first season that he was gone the Rockets finally advanced behind the leadership of Ron Artest of all people. Tmac screwed over the team last season and he'll remain in management's dog house from here on out until he is traded and rightfully so. He is a team cancer at this point and won't be able to play like the Tmac of old any way.

Some of you people really need to let it go and realize that there is a great Houston Rockets team to watch right now. They may be a superstar away from being a true contender, but they're fighting really hard and doing what they need to do. I love this current team and I will root for them no matter what they end up doing. Go Rockets!

[EssTooKayTD]

bad for basketball if you think t-mac elevates us from playoff team to a dark horse contending team. since morey and adelman are in no rush to have t-mac back i don't think they think he will help that much.

It's funny how, what is it, 12 games into the season we are a playoff bound team? Lil early for all that right? Teams will know what the Rockets are trying to do with their current play style. They will expose each player's weaknesses. Where do you go when you HAVE to have a basket? Who do you depend on in the current lineup?

I don't know man, I hope I'm wrong. I sincerely hope I'm wrong, but I just don't think our current team can make the playoffs. Maybe squeak in at the 8 spot? I hope they prove me wrong if the squad stays as it is now. That would be exciting to watch.

[BleedRed]

This entire episode is just shameful. As a disclaimer I am as big a TMac and Yao fan as they get and I do blame TMac for last year's PR debacle and his actions. Having said that, I still expected much more from the Rockets organization. Star players have always been egoistical and petty but as an organization you should be better than that. To not give TMac a chance to play and prove himself is just not right.

Ttime to ship TMac somewhere. Oh well, we will always have that 13 seconds.

[Texxx]

This team in the halfcourt with Mcgrady, is a much better team. Our first unit is not a running team so I still dont understand why people assume Tracy will hurt the team. He will start. He takes the pressure off Ariza and Brooks and makes our 1st unit significantly better with the ability to create shots for other players. I for one, am tired of watching Ariza try to create for himself.

Dude have you ever watched a Rockets game in the last 3 years? Tmac isn't creating shots for anyone, because he doesn't attack the basket anymore. He's nothing but a jump shooter off the dribble and he isn't a good shooter either. His athleticism won't be the same anymore either. It never is after microfracture surgery. Look at the players before him that have had the same surgery. None of them have been completely the same, and we're talking about a guy that is soft as it is and avoids contact at all costs. Tmac won't be creating shots for anyone but himself at this point and that's not a good thing for a guy that isn't a good jump shooter. Drop the homerism for Tmac. His stint here in Houston is finished.

[ROXTXIA]

I was at work listening to the radio a few months ago and they had Steve Francis on, he claimed his last year in Houston when Morey and Adelman were saying he couldn't play because of his leg injuries, that he could have easily played and played the way he likes to play the game.

And you just take Steve at his word?

If Steve Francis still had it, you'd think he'd be playing with SOME team or another.

[DreamShook]

Wednesday’s incident wasn’t the first testy exchange recently between Adelman and McGrady. They also argued in a practice session last week. In the preseason, sources say McGrady asked management to let him play approximately 12 to 15 minutes total in two exhibition games to gauge where he stood in his comeback. The organization, sources say, told him he would need to pass a standardized conditioning test. McGrady did but still stayed on the sideline.

Rockets saying anything to Tmac to get him past that 41 game date except actually telling him why they are doing it.

Sounds like the organization doesn't want to tell him certain things about the insurance and his scheduled comeback.. Maybe they are afraid he will let it slip when he has his famous brain farts to the media which in turn would probably get the Rockets in trouble with the insurance company and the NBA

There are certain things that you just cant divulge to McGrady.. There is definably a trust issue. I cant blame them though Tracy sees the cameras and the tape recorders and he goes nuts.

[EssTooKayTD]

I see that this site still has a bunch of pathetic Tmac fan boys who can't get over there infatuation with one of the biggest losers in NBA history. A guy with all that talent that could never get his team through the first round of the playoffs, and mentioned more than once that he wasn't always completely into it when regarding the sport of basketball.

Tmac couldn't ever get the Rockets anywhere in the post season and the first season that he was gone the Rockets finally advanced behind the leadership of Ron Artest of all people. Tmac screwed over the team last season and he'll remain in management's dog house from here on out until he is traded and rightfully so. He is a team cancer at this point and won't be able to play like the Tmac of old any way.

Some of you people really need to let it go and realize that there is a great Houston Rockets team to watch right now. They may be a superstar away from being a true contender, but they're fighting really hard and doing what they need to do. I love this current team and I will root for them no matter what they end up doing. Go Rockets!

Leadership of Artest? Couldn't have been that the team was actually a good team outside of Yao and Tracy for the first time in years right? Not just a bunch of hand me down role players for once.

Tracy gets dogged a lot. Deservingly so, if all reports of his "drama" are true. He hasn't done all bad here though. I don't know, maybe I"m not mean enough to just put down someone so bad, and I always feel like people can always come back and redeem themselves.

I've always said, he could say he hates Houston, but if he wins, no one cares. It has been, and always be about winning. Tracy has only been able to win in the regular season. And if he doesn't change that, he'll always be regarded that way. NO matter how well or bad he plays in the post-season, he'll be branded that way.

Much like how KG was. KG is a great talent, much like McGrady. But now KG's the man b/c he finally won with Paul Pierce and Ray Allen. One of the most clutch players and one of the smoothest shooters in the game.

[DaDakota]

Rockets saying anything to Tmac to get him past that 41 game date except actually telling him why they are doing it.

Sounds like the organization doesn't want to tell him certain things about the insurance and his scheduled comeback.. Maybe they are afraid he will let it slip when he has his famous brain farts to the media which in turn would probably get the Rockets in trouble with the insurance company and the NBA

There are certain things that you just cant divulge to McGrady.. There is definably a trust issue. I cant blame them though Tracy sees the cameras and the tape recorders and he goes nuts.

As a business owner I guarantee you they told Tmac NOTHING about this.....

The Rockets are a smartly run organization, they would never put millions of $$$$$ at risk by informing a player whose lips are looser than Jenna Jamisons.

DD

[EssTooKayTD]

As a business owner I guarantee you they told Tmac NOTHING about this.....

The Rockets are a smartly run organization, they would never put millions of $$$$$ at risk by informing a player whose lips are looser than Jenna Jamisons.

DD
Don't you say anything bad about Jenna...

[DreamShook]

Dude have you ever watched a Rockets game in the last 3 years? Tmac isn't creating shots for anyone, because he doesn't attack the basket anymore. He's nothing but a jump shooter off the dribble and he isn't a good shooter either. His athleticism won't be the same anymore either. It never is after microfracture surgery. Look at the players before him that have had the same surgery. None of them have been completely the same, and we're talking about a guy that is soft as it is and avoids contact at all costs. Tmac won't be creating shots for anyone but himself at this point and that's not a good thing for a guy that isn't a good jump shooter. Drop the homerism for Tmac. His stint here in Houston is finished.

I understand what you're saying but there have been success stories too

Jason Kidd
John Stockton
Amare Stoudemire
Zach Randolph

[The_Yoyo]

Also, to those blaming McGrady for wanting to come back at Minnesota: if I'm reading the above correctly, wasn't McGrady wanting to come back during the 42nd game?

In other words, wasn't McGrady resigned to waiting until insurance covered him the rest of the season, and voiced his anger to reporters when the Rockets didn't play him in that 42nd game?


quoted for some actual logic

then i would say considering where the team is on the schedule (on the road then a set of back to backs road/home) i think the coaching staff want to have at least one FULL practice to have Tmac run through and adjust the lineups accordingly. trying to do that on the fly is not going to help the team.

morey/rick probably realized this from the get go that if the team was playing well at the time..hold strong to the nov 23rd date if the team wasnt then may as well insert him in.

tmac probably felt that he was told to sit the first 11 games (making it 41 straight) and then they'll get whatever insurance policies. he probably needed the first few games to still fully get into the shape he wanted but after that he probably was ready to go.

give the guy at least a little credit this year he has been working out pretty hard before games and has been with the team. had he been a serious cancer he probably would have been asked to stay at home and not be with the team

[Angkor Wat]

Dude have you ever watched a Rockets game in the last 3 years? Tmac isn't creating shots for anyone, because he doesn't attack the basket anymore. He's nothing but a jump shooter off the dribble and he isn't a good shooter either. His athleticism won't be the same anymore either. It never is after microfracture surgery. Look at the players before him that have had the same surgery. None of them have been completely the same, and we're talking about a guy that is soft as it is and avoids contact at all costs. Tmac won't be creating shots for anyone but himself at this point and that's not a good thing for a guy that isn't a good jump shooter. Drop the homerism for Tmac. His stint here in Houston is finished.

Umm he does create shots for his teammates. Even last year whenever he could play. You don't have to attack the rim to create shots. He is one of the best pick and roll players in the NBA. As of right now, I will say he has the best vision and passing skill out of all our current players. Probably better ball control too. He didn't shoot well during the 22 game winning streak season but he still impacted games by getting others easy buckets.

[Texxx]

Leadership of Artest? Couldn't have been that the team was actually a good team outside of Yao and Tracy for the first time in years right? Not just a bunch of hand me down role players for once.

Tracy gets dogged a lot. Deservingly so, if all reports of his "drama" are true. He hasn't done all bad here though. I don't know, maybe I"m not mean enough to just put down someone so bad, and I always feel like people can always come back and redeem themselves.

I've always said, he could say he hates Houston, but if he wins, no one cares. It has been, and always be about winning. Tracy has only been able to win in the regular season. And if he doesn't change that, he'll always be regarded that way. NO matter how well or bad he plays in the post-season, he'll be branded that way.

Much like how KG was. KG is a great talent, much like McGrady. But now KG's the man b/c he finally won with Paul Pierce and Ray Allen. One of the most clutch players and one of the smoothest shooters in the game.


Tmac was a loser in Orlando before we ever got him and their GM told us that when we brought him here. He warned us that he was a quitter and had no heart. Houston fans were just so stoked that we got a superstar talent, that we didn't want to listen despite the fact that Tmac could never even get in the 2nd round in the East even with a 3-1 lead over the Bucks.

I'll grant him the fact that he's been good in the regular seasons, but when it came down to close games in the playoffs in the 4th quarters he was a choke artist in Houston. He had two home court advantages with Utah and couldn't lead the team. Tmac never did anymore than what Francis was able to do when you look at the bigger picture. ONly Francis has a much worse team to play with, but they Tmac never went any further, but just had more playoff appearances.

The guy has been a great stats guy his whole career but that's where it stops. He's not a great leader and never has been. Fans on this site need to let it go and move on. Stop rooting for the player and start rooting for the team! We did fine without him and we're playing good ball right now for what we have. We don't need this guy anymore.

[Dave_78]

he's not guaranteed to ply after those 5 days. i think that's why mcgrady is irritated. if the team said, "YOU'RE GOING TO PLAY ON THE 23RD," he's gonna shut up.

he just wants an official timetable of when he will play an actual NBA game. and i don't think that's unreasonable to ask.

if they don't want to play him, sit him so these drama can be avoided. it's taing attention away from a great 7-5 start for this team.

What are you arguing. The guy has a time table for his MRI. It's on the 23rd. If that works out then he gets a chance to EARN playing time by PRACTICING (full practices) back-to-back and proving he is good enough to land in the rotation.

What's with all of you now claiming because a doctor cleared his knee he should be playing. How many doctors cleared his knee a year ago yet he couldn't play? All I heard then was how wrong the doctors were. Funny how you changed your tunes.

Let's be real. The guy is 30, coming of multiple surgeries including a major one, he has a history of being injury prone, unable to heal from minor surgeries and of being a liar about his health. HE DOESN'T GET A SAY IN THIS. He lost that right and now he think he deserves to have things his way?

[macalu]

<a href="http://s455.photobucket.com/albums/qq275/bolo1357/?action=view&current=tmaccopy.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i455.photobucket.com/albums/qq275/bolo1357/tmaccopy.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

[tmacfor35]

Dude have you ever watched a Rockets game in the last 3 years? Tmac isn't creating shots for anyone, because he doesn't attack the basket anymore. He's nothing but a jump shooter off the dribble and he isn't a good shooter either. His athleticism won't be the same anymore either. It never is after microfracture surgery. Look at the players before him that have had the same surgery. None of them have been completely the same, and we're talking about a guy that is soft as it is and avoids contact at all costs. Tmac won't be creating shots for anyone but himself at this point and that's not a good thing for a guy that isn't a good jump shooter. Drop the homerism for Tmac. His stint here in Houston is finished.

I live in San Antonio and have missed maybe a few games the last three years. Pick and roll with Mcgrady was a bread and butter play for Houston and still can be with his passing skills. They are highly overlooked. Mcgrady's never been quick off the dribble, hes long and good with the basketball in his hands. He can be a much needed piece for this Rockets team.

[Sweet Lou 4 2]

Well, I am not sure T-mac wanting to play and being frustrated is really all that bad. He's bitching and all, but good, at least he does want to play. At least he cares. Give the man a bit of respect for wanting to play and not taking it sitting down.

There can be conflict between players and coaches. It's not always bad. And so far, no one has really been hard on the other in public or the media - or even privately said anything negative.

That's a really good sign.

[EssTooKayTD]

Tmac was a loser in Orlando before we ever got him and their GM told us that when we brought him here. He warned us that he was a quitter and had no heart. Houston fans were just so stoked that we got a superstar talent, that we didn't want to listen despite the fact that Tmac could never even get in the 2nd round in the East even with a 3-1 lead over the Bucks.

I'll grant him the fact that he's been good in the regular seasons, but when it came down to close games in the playoffs in the 4th quarters he was a choke artist in Houston. He had two home court advantages with Utah and couldn't lead the team. Tmac never did anymore than what Francis was able to do when you look at the bigger picture. ONly Francis has a much worse team to play with, but they Tmac never went any further, but just had more playoff appearances.

The guy has been a great stats guy his whole career but that's where it stops. He's not a great leader and never has been. Fans on this site need to let it go and move on. Stop rooting for the player and start rooting for the team! We did fine without him and we're playing good ball right now for what we have. We don't need this guy anymore.

Come on dude, look at it.

No one can do it alone. Kobe finally had success post-Shaq. He "only" has Pau, Bynum, Odom and company to help him out.

Who did Tracy have? ( Forgive my memory...I'm trying to remember how these series went. )

vs. Mavs...team was actually decent, although they were a lot of players on their way out of the NBA. I think we can all agree, the refs assed Houston out on that one.

vs. Jazz #1
A recently returning-from-injury Yao. Who else outside of that?

vs. Jazz #2
No Yao

I don't need to mention our role players b/c they just don't match up to rosters of championship teams. Some of them even missed games due to injuries or didn't show up to play. Others that are now playing much higher levels of basketball were in their first year or two.

[DaDakota]

Well, I am not sure T-mac wanting to play and being frustrated is really all that bad. He's bitching and all, but good, at least he does want to play. At least he cares. Give the man a bit of respect for wanting to play and not taking it sitting down.

There can be conflict between players and coaches. It's not always bad. And so far, no one has really been hard on the other in public or the media - or even privately said anything negative.

That's a really good sign.

How did you feel about Von?

Hopefully consistent....to this message.

;)

DD

[RedRaiderRocket]

As a business owner I guarantee you they told Tmac NOTHING about this.....

The Rockets are a smartly run organization, they would never put millions of $$$$$ at risk by informing a player whose lips are looser than Jenna Jamisons.

DD

I am sure they did not mention anything about it but I am pretty sure T-mac and his agent knew about this since T-mac thought he was ready to play and the team choosing a scheduled MRI after the 41 days have passed. I am sure if the Rockets were sucking and were having trouble with ticket sales then the Rockets would be playing him very soon. I don't know much about the Rockets this year since I do not get there games here. But based on what Morey said in his 610 interview yesterday ticket sales were still good. I am just worried this will become a huge distraction the longer this drags on. As a Rocket fan I feel I have mixed emotions I think adding a player like Tmac can not hurt the team, if he sucks keep him on the bench if he does well than that is just more money in their pockets.

It will be an interesting to see, what I expect to happen after the 23rd is what has been going on since training camp. The team will say, "The MRI revealed no damage it is just that we think Tmac is not in great conditional shape." Whether that be true or not, but in the meantime the Rockets collect insurance money on a 23 million dollar player and still keep winning. If they start to lose, I can see the Rockets saying, "We feel like Tmac has shown great strides in practice and will be ready to play."

[DaDakota]

I am sure they did not mention anything about it but I am pretty sure T-mac and his agent knew about this since T-mac thought he was ready to play and the team choosing a scheduled MRI after the 41 days have passed. I am sure if the Rockets were sucking and were having trouble with ticket sales then the Rockets would be playing him very soon. I don't know much about the Rockets this year since I do not get there games here. But based on what Morey said in his 610 interview yesterday ticket sales were still good. I am just worried this will become a huge distraction the longer this drags on. As a Rocket fan I feel I have mixed emotions I think adding a player like Tmac can not hurt the team, if he sucks keep him on the bench if he does well than that is just more money in their pockets.

It will be an interesting to see, what I expect to happen after the 23rd is what has been going on since training camp. The team will say, "The MRI revealed no damage it is just that we think Tmac is not in great conditional shape." Whether that be true or not, but in the meantime the Rockets collect insurance money on a 23 million dollar player and still keep winning. If they start to lose, I can see the Rockets saying, "We feel like Tmac has shown great strides in practice and will be ready to play."

Kind of how I see it too.

DD

[Texxx]

Come on dude, look at it.

No one can do it alone. Kobe finally had success post-Shaq. He "only" has Pau, Bynum, Odom and company to help him out.

Who did Tracy have? ( Forgive my memory...I'm trying to remember how these series went. )

vs. Mavs...team was actually decent, although they were a lot of players on their way out of the NBA. I think we can all agree, the refs assed Houston out on that one.

vs. Jazz #1
A recently returning-from-injury Yao. Who else outside of that?

vs. Jazz #2
No Yao

I don't need to mention our role players b/c they just don't match up to rosters of championship teams. Some of them even missed games due to injuries or didn't show up to play. Others that are now playing much higher levels of basketball were in their first year or two.


These are nothing but excuses. It's a reason why the Rockets had home court advantage over the Jazz and had a better record. What's the excuse for the Jazz then since we had a better over all record? Oh, that's right we did! So in essence there is no excuse for us to have not won either one of those series when we had the home court advantage over the Jazz those two seasons. And again Dallas we were up 2-0 to start the series and then fell apart. That is 3 freaking post season collapses behind that guy as the superstar and then you go back to his collapse in Orlando, it's no coincidence. The excuses made for this man by you fan boys are ridiculous at this point. Then he shut it down last season and released his news to the media so we couldn't trade his ass and we got stuck with the highest salary in the NBA. Oh, and remember that year he quit playing for a like a week because he was supposedly "depressed?" The guy is one of the most soft players in the league.

It will be a wonderful day when he is traded. Good riddance Mcgrady and don't let the door hit you in the ass.

[EssTooKayTD]

These are nothing but excuses. It's a reason why the Rockets had home court advantage over the Jazz and had a better record. What's the excuse for the Jazz then since we had a better over all record? Oh, that's right we did! So in essence there is no excuse for us to have not won either one of those series when we had the home court advantage over the Jazz those two seasons. And again Dallas we were up 2-0 to start the series and then fell apart. That is 3 freaking post season collapses behind that guy as the superstar and then you go back to his collapse in Orlando, it's no coincidence. The excuses made for this man by you fan boys are ridiculous at this point. Then he shut it down last season and released his news to the media so we couldn't trade his ass and we got stuck with the highest salary in the NBA. Oh, and remember that year he quit playing for a like a week because he was supposedly "depressed?" The guy is one of the most soft players in the league.

It will be a wonderful day when he is traded. Good riddance Mcgrady and don't let the door hit you in the ass.

Reasons man, not excuses.

Mavs series, like I said, it was taken from Houston by just not one or two calls, but by a lot of calls. Heck wasn't the ref who was busted for gambling on games one of the refs in that series? Of all the years McGrady was here, that was the best by far. We can disagree all day, I can't blame that one on him.

Jazz: Again, correct me if my recollection is off, but didn't we get home court barely that year? As in it came down to the last few games or so to decide who had it? Either way, home court or not...what about the players on the floor. I think they have a little to do with the game. Do tell me of the awesome play of our players not named Tracy or Yao.

I bet Yao is glad he doesn't get as much hate as McGrady since he's in the same boat. Only difference is his demeanor and his paycheck. I mean since it seems most people only care about the end result, which is fair enough. You don't win, you don't get the love.

[ibm]

Reasons man, not excuses.

Mavs series, like I said, it was taken from Houston by just not one or two calls, but by a lot of calls. Heck wasn't the ref who was busted for gambling on games one of the refs in that series? Of all the years McGrady was here, that was the best by far. We can disagree all day, I can't blame that one on him.

Jazz: Again, correct me if my recollection is off, but didn't we get home court barely that year? As in it came down to the last few games or so to decide who had it? Either way, home court or not...what about the players on the floor. I think they have a little to do with the game. Do tell me of the awesome play of our players not named Tracy or Yao.

I bet Yao is glad he doesn't get as much hate as McGrady since he's in the same boat. Only difference is his demeanor and his paycheck. I mean since it seems most people only care about the end result, which is fair enough. You don't win, you don't get the love.

the difference is yao doesn't whine or quit, or point fingers at others. yao didn't say "had i had kobe but not mcgrady..."

win or lose, the process matters. and demeanor matters, too.

[t_mac1]

So t_mac1...what do you have to say about the info coming out that the argument didn't happen and that Tracy was the one that fed Yahoo the story?

from who? the chron?

i don't even care for the argument. that's not what surprised me from that article. what surprised me was the doctor who performed surgery cleared him for full-contact play v. real NBA players and the team wouldn't even let him do anything to start training camp. that's the thing that surprises me.

i just think both sides are really looking out for themselves, and there has been some miscommunication.

and look, we're not talking about the team that is 7-5, we're talking about tmac's timetable and when he's going to return.

[t_mac1]

When you have $20M+/year invested in an asset. You should have complete control over what you do with it for the better of the team. If Tmac comes back healthy and plays within the system, then we all win.

You are dealing with a serious injury. Let the Rockets have all the info, between MRI and quality of practice, they need to make the best decision for them.

Another point: Tmac wanted to play last year when he had zero business doing so.

that was tmac talking. you don't trust tmac ALONE.

in that article, it explicitly stated the doctor (one of the most reputable surgeons) who performed surgery cleared him. he's the one who has been talking with mcgrady the most. i'm assuming that doctor should have SOME IDEA of how tmac is progressing. if he clears mcgrady, tmac should be ready to AT LEAST practice to start training camp.

what perplexes me AGAIN is that the team did NOT let him practice. IT'S PRACTICE.

[TranMcGrady]

What round of the playoffs did we get to that year?

I think it was the same round Francis took us too

Rocket River

Who took us to the playoffs that year?

Tracy McGrady

[EssTooKayTD]

the difference is yao doesn't whine or quit, or point fingers at others. yao didn't say "had i had kobe but not mcgrady..."

win or lose, the process matters. and demeanor matters, too.

I think it only matters when you don't win, and only to some people. To me, I do enjoy when they do play. I appreciate the effort on the court. I, probably, too often give passes to behavior that people love to harp on around here.

To me, if you win, people don't care. I am just as disappointed in Yao as I am in Tracy. The end result is the same. So...until either of them win, years from now, I'll just remember the injury-filled seasons of the Yao and Tracy era.

I mean with Dream, speaking ill of him is like blasphemy around here. Wasn't he being accused of faking injuries and trade talks were in the works before the champion year? All is forgiven if you win.

Kobe, was on camera talking about trades. He got more help, they won, and no one really talks about him chewing out teammates, quitting ON THE COURT in the playoffs, allegedly raping a woman. You win, you are the man.

[amaggie05]

yeah. they can always marbury him.. but that will create more drama .. you really want additional drama from Tracy's end? havent we had enuf..?

instead they can just start playing him and see what he does.. if he sucks.. send him back home and ask him to do rehab.. end of story.


if TMAC is really fit, then he's not gonna suck, it's just that we are gonna play a whole different type of game with him on the floor, and I'm not sure if coach RA or Morey wants that. The team is winning anyway.

Also some of the players may not be happy with that either considering what he has done to the team chemistry. In the club's perspective, I think they just want to keep up the current chemistry and give the young players plenty of minutes so that they can grow for the future.

[EssTooKayTD]

Who took us to the playoffs that year?

Tracy McGrady

I just think it quite silly that people will say it was the ABSENCE of McGrady that allowed the team to get out of the first round. That's like throwing the entire team under the bus isn't it? Like they had nothing to do with it.

[cavevato]

Let me Play!!

http://squirtgunn.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/05/tmac.png
:p What does a cartoon of Usher wearing Ariza's jersey (with a combover) have to do with anything? :p

[ibm]

I think it only matters when you don't win, and only to some people. To me, I do enjoy when they do play. I appreciate the effort on the court. I, probably, too often give passes to behavior that people love to harp on around here.

To me, if you win, people don't care. I am just as disappointed in Yao as I am in Tracy. The end result is the same. So...until either of them win, years from now, I'll just remember the injury-filled seasons of the Yao and Tracy era.

I mean with Dream, speaking ill of him is like blasphemy around here. Wasn't he being accused of faking injuries and trade talks were in the works before the champion year? All is forgiven if you win.

Kobe, was on camera talking about trades. He got more help, they won, and no one really talks about him chewing out teammates, quitting ON THE COURT in the playoffs, allegedly raping a woman. You win, you are the man.

i can't offer a lot of arguments to your post, because you do have a point.

but if you refuse to admit there is a difference b/w players' behaviors and characters, such as mgrady's and yao's, you're either lying or are blind.

i know for me, demeanors do matter. if affects, sometimes even determines if i like a player (or even a team). i know it matters to a lot of other fans, too.

[EssTooKayTD]

i can't offer a lot of arguments to your post, because you do have a point.

but if you refuse to admit there is a difference b/w players' behaviors and characters, such as mgrady's and yao's, you're either lying or are blind.

i know for me, demeanors do matter. if affects, sometimes even determines if i like a player (or even a team). i know it matters to a lot of other fans, too.

I do agree with you for the most part. I guess to me, McGrady's actions are petty, and I just don't think much of them one way or the other. They have angered me much less than a good majority of the active posters here.

Yao is just a very likeable person. As you are saying, it's most likely the reason he doesn't get as much detest from everyone, although he does get some still.

I'm more concerned about how McGrady will play when/if he comes back, and what happens with the team from that point on. If he comes back and wins, all the drama is an even more distant memory. If he jacks things up, I'll be the first to say, "you crazy guys were right the whole time!"

Yao's return seems so far away that I don't even think about it with this season just being underway.

[aghast]

...then i would say considering where the team is on the schedule (on the road then a set of back to backs road/home) i think the coaching staff want to have at least one FULL practice to have Tmac run through and adjust the lineups accordingly. trying to do that on the fly is not going to help the team...
This seems entirely reasonable.

However, if he is indeed guaranteed a thumbs up with the MRI, a rational person (having in some manner already agreed to, at least somewhat quietly, sit out 41 straight games to suit management) wouldn't balk at waiting an extra week to take the court. The "we have no set timeline" company line is either a dodge to the insurance underwriters to keep his policy redeemable, or a dodge to McGrady in his efforts to play.

There are serious trust issues involved. Or, perhaps because the Rockets are playing moderately well without him, McGrady has reason to believe that the playing time carrot will continue to be pushed further and further back, in a manner which actually could impact his ability to prolong his career beyond this season.

How did you feel about Von?

Hopefully consistent....to this message...
When healthy, Tracy McGrady = one of the ten best players of the last decade.
When healthy, Von Wafer = a borderline NBA player.
When healthy, me = an out-of-shape loudmouth with a weak left hand, and an easily-countered spin move.

Every Rockets game I go to, I scream my head off at Adelman to put me in, and let me be the "Kobe-Befuddler" (TM, me). For some reason, my chants fall on deaf ears. Apparently, talent level actually plays a role in such decisions, and considerations for ability to actually help the team win play a factor.

Why do you keep bringing up Wafer in this discussion?

[tmacfor35]

I thought Wafer could have been a better than average player given playing time and a better attitude. But that is mostly just ignorance on his part. As for Tracy, he was the sole reason this team even got to 7 games in all 2 out of the 3 series. Game 2 in Dallas. I dont want to go to war with Yao Ming only fans, but his lack of consistent play in the playoffs in the Dallas and the first Utah series cost us the first round win. I tend to give a pass to the guy who put up 25+ a night and noticeably raised his game to the next level over the guy who put up 25 one night and 12 the next. The Mcgrady hate is ridiculous.

[pgabriel]

They're about to go Around the Horn on this topic


HOOORRRRNNNN

I love that show

[TmacsRockets]

This is like the Kobe situation when he demanded out. Mcgrady just wants help on this team.

[Yak]

I just heard Adrian call in on Carl Duke's show, but unfortunately it was as he was hanging up.

Does anyone know if he said anything we didn't already know?

[Pocket Rockets]

Reasons man, not excuses.

Mavs series, like I said, it was taken from Houston by just not one or two calls, but by a lot of calls. Heck wasn't the ref who was busted for gambling on games one of the refs in that series? Of all the years McGrady was here, that was the best by far. We can disagree all day, I can't blame that one on him.

Jazz: Again, correct me if my recollection is off, but didn't we get home court barely that year? As in it came down to the last few games or so to decide who had it? Either way, home court or not...what about the players on the floor. I think they have a little to do with the game. Do tell me of the awesome play of our players not named Tracy or Yao.

I bet Yao is glad he doesn't get as much hate as McGrady since he's in the same boat. Only difference is his demeanor and his paycheck. I mean since it seems most people only care about the end result, which is fair enough. You don't win, you don't get the love.

So they are good enough to get home court advantage but not good enough to win the series?

[PASTORofMUPPETS]

Because they are developing young guys that will be here next year when Yao gets back, because they know Tracy won't be here.

Makes perfect sense to mothball him.

DD

I totally agree. There is nothing to gain from the Rockets perspective in playing him. They are developing talent this year to get ready for 2010-2011.

On the other hand, if they don't play him, they make their insurance money for every game he misses.

Playing Mac (if he comes back healthy) will only increase Mac's value.

[PeppermintCandy]

This is from today's Chronicle:
A person with knowledge of NBA insurance policies said that insurance has been paying McGrady's salary since last season. The Rockets have said that doctors chose Nov. 23 for McGrady's MRI based on the time doctors believed he would need following the surgery and the team's practice schedule.

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/hotstories/6731426.html


An indirect refute of Yahoo's report about having to miss 41 days.

Um, so who should be believed? Yahoo or Chron? Or neither?

[worzel gummidge]

This is from today's Chronicle:


An indirect refute of Yahoo's report about having to miss 41 days.

Um, so who should be believed? Yahoo or Chron? Or neither?
Chron are saying the Rockets have been collecting insurance money since last season.

Yahoo are saying after 41 days, McGrady's insurance will not reset if he re-injures himself. If McGrady goes down again there is no waiting period. They collect again instantly.

[TheGreat]

This sounds like an Alex Rodriguez type story with McGrady. We think he is not a team player and think players like Cody Ransom can replace them. Yanks go 13-15, A-Rod comes back and leads them to the championship.

[BizzleRocket]

This sounds like an Alex Rodriguez type story with McGrady. We think he is not a team player and think players like Cody Ransom can replace them. Yanks go 13-15, A-Rod comes back and leads them to the championship.
Propping up T-Mac again, come up with new material if you are going to defend T-Mac all day. When T-Mac leaves, are you still going to stay here? Just out of curiosity.

[ChrisBosh]

Another sign that McGrady is not a team guy, if the team wants to save some money, let them, it's better for him.

[TheGreat]

I just think it quite silly that people will say it was the ABSENCE of McGrady that allowed the team to get out of the first round. That's like throwing the entire team under the bus isn't it? Like they had nothing to do with it.
They would of swept the Blazers with McGrady.

[PeppermintCandy]

Chron are saying the Rockets have been collecting insurance money since last season.

Yahoo are saying after 41 days, McGrady's insurance will not reset if he re-injures himself. If McGrady goes down again there is no waiting period. They collect again instantly.

I'm still confused. Maybe I'm reading it wrong but Yahoo makes it sound like the Rockets get reimbursed for everything after 41 missed games. Unlike the Chron, they don't mention that the Rockets get reimbursed for those 41 games.Or is that supposed to be implied?

Here's the Yahoo passage:
Assuming that McGrady is covered under the NBA’s Temporary Total Disability (TTD) insurance policy, Houston can start to collect up to 80 percent of his prorated per-game salary after he’s missed 41 consecutive games. McGrady sat out his 42nd straight game Wednesday in Minnesota, and the league insurance plan would reimburse the Rockets for any additional missed games.

For the rest of the season, the insurance policy could cover 80 percent of his per-game salary of $282,946. Even if McGrady returns to the lineup for one or more games this season, the insurance would still pay the Rockets for each additional missed game

It may seem like I'm nitpicking but the difference seems to allow for two divergent explanations regarding the Rockets' intentions.

[TheGreat]

Propping up T-Mac again, come up with new material if you are going to defend T-Mac all day. When T-Mac leaves, are you still going to stay here? Just out of curiosity.
LOL, I don't think you have answered my other question in the other thread. Exposed! Btw, you are ignored.

[BEAT LA]

The Rockets season started on 10/19. Tracy wants to return on 11/18, a day before his check for the first month of the NBA season is distributed.

Why does Tracy care who pays his salary? Someone is manipulating him over money.

[worzel gummidge]

It may seem like I'm nitpicking but the difference seems to allow for two divergent explanations regarding the Rockets' intentions.
I was thinking there might be two. Insurance from outside the league and the TTD.

I'm guessing their collecting from their own insurance but the NBA's safeguards them if T-Mac re-injures himself. It makes him a more valuable trade piece as he's now guaranteed to collect money if he isn't able to play.

[BetterThanEver]

Chron are saying the Rockets have been collecting insurance money since last season.

Yahoo are saying after 41 days, McGrady's insurance will not reset if he re-injures himself. If McGrady goes down again there is no waiting period. They collect again instantly.


It says the League's TTD policy is for 41 games not 41 days. Yahoo may have edited it. Its only for the league's TTD policy not for any private short term disablity insurance that the Rockets may also have.

Many insurance companies have a long term disability plan that kicks in after most short term policies end.

[Angkor Wat]

Going to be real interesting if he plays or not after the MRI. I wonder if Tracy McStatement will suit up today and stand his ground. :p

[tmacfor35]

We have a good team. Only going to be better with Mcgrady.

[BizzleRocket]

We have a good team. Only going to be better with Mcgrady.
Not necessarily....T-Mac right now is a 6'8 heartless, wuss, injury prone version of Allen Iverson.

[Commodore]

McGrady is making the case that he's ready to play, and the Rocket's either don't think he's ready or aren't sure enough to risk rocking the boat by bringing him back to soon.

Both positions make sense and both parties are acting rationally. T-Mac wants to prove to fans and teammates and potential new employers that he still has value to a team.

It's a simple disagreement. For whatever reason people take disagreement between members of an organization and translate that to personal animosity and drama.

Hopefully T-Mac will come back strong and the team well, and we can put all this behind us.

I hate drama, especially in the work place.

[agentkirb87]

We have a good team. Only going to be better with Mcgrady.

Agreed.

Thats kind of the thing that bothers me with this whole McGrady debacle. This isn't like the Allen Iverson situation where he's on a new team and he has a history of being a "me-first" guy. McGrady does kind of have that history... but he also has a history of playing with Battier, Hayes, Scola, Landry, Brooks, etc. They have played together for a few years now.

So when you talk about Chemistry, I suppose there is part of us that doesn't want to mess up a good thing. But at the same time this isn't like trying to add AI to Memphis. When it comes to McGrady, the question was always whether the will to play was there. For this season at least, it looks like he wants to prove people wrong.

And the other thing that bothered me... we put our faith in guys like Ariza and Brooks to put up big numbers when they havn't proven they can play at that level until this season. Yet when it comes to McGrady, you have a guy that has played at that level before as recently as 2 seasons ago before his injuries when there was talk about him being in the MVP conversation during that 22 game win streak, and people doubt that he can help this team.

I'm not saying he WILL help this team, but he certainly can.

[joegoroxy]

its simple people:

- Tracy thinks he is ready to play and wants to know when they are going to put him back on the court.

- Aldeman and Morey are sticking to their guns and going to have the SCHEDULED MRI preformed before they put him back on the court.

- Reasoning behind the decision to wait is because if he isn't fully healed, they don't want him reinjurying himself, that would diminish his trade value greatly.

- in my humble opinion, and i am a T-Mac fan, he needs to stfu and do whatever they need him to do to get him back on the court. all that throwing tantrums is not going to make them change their minds about what they have planned for him already. he needs to just keep working hard and follow their plans for his return.

[agentkirb87]

its simple people:

- Tracy thinks he is ready to play and wants to know when they are going to put him back on the court.

- Aldeman and Morey are sticking to their guns and going to have the SCHEDULED MRI preformed before they put him back on the court.

- Reasoning behind the decision to wait is because if he isn't fully healed, they don't want him reinjurying himself, that would diminish his trade value greatly.

- in my humble opinion, and i am a T-Mac fan, he needs to stfu and do whatever they need him to do to get him back on the court. all that throwing tantrums is not going to make them change their minds about what they have planned for him already. he needs to just keep working hard and follow their plans for his return.

But if you read the article, they talk about all kinds of doctors and trainers clearing him for full contact drills. Obviously I don't think they should put him on the court without practicing with the team first, but what is an MRI going to tell us? If that MRI shows anything, people need to lose their jobs because he shouldn't have been cleared in the first place.

I'm not exactly disagreeing with you, but I think its more about him not practicing with the team before his first game more than not getting an MRI.

[roslolian]

This is HILARIOUS!

"Hey Tmac . . . remember how they treated me on my return . . . I thought I was ready . .. coach didn't . .. my fans saif GIVE ME A SHOT . How does it feel to get that same treat?" - Steve Francis

"Man . . .it sucks! " - TMac

The TMAC Only fans were SCREAMING about Francis being selfish and to trust the coach
not
a total 180 when it is THEIR GUY twisting in the wind

Rocket River
Karma

Yeah...except that the article mentions Tmac passing several examinations:

Exhibit A:
The organization, sources say, told him he would need to pass a standardized conditioning test. McGrady did but still stayed on the sideline.

Exhibit B:
Before McGrady began his rehabilitation in Chicago this summer, he had to be cleared by a top athletic surgeon for full-contact basketball. Ultimately, McGrady was deemed OK to play daily against All-Star talents like Dwyane Wade and Devin Harris.

First of all, let me say this source is legit, or as legit as someone outside the organization can get. AW is one of the most legit sports columnists out there, I have no idea how he gets his stuff but he hasn't made a wrong news item yet. Secondly, it is clear that T-mac is being isoed, at least until the nov 23 deadline. Why? There are probably a ton of reasons:

1) Tmac might affect chemistry badly.

2) Revenge for Tmac's drama last season.

3) Financial gain

4) To teach Tmac a lesson for declaring something out of the blue again (predicting his return during the game)

My guess although all reasons are true, the 4rth option is the most likely biggest reason for doing this. DM and RA want to teach Tmac a lesson about deciding stuff for himself, and staying put on the company line that he will take an MRI, and then be allowed to play sometime in December. Meanwhile while they do that, Tmac gets to cool his ass down and get in shape, the team gets to build chemistry, Les gets more moolah on the table, and who knows, somebody might be desparate enough to put together a decent package for him, like maybe the Nets or Sacto. Its win-win for the organization. They're basically screwing over Tmac here, but at the same time considering what he did last season he probably deserves it.

[clutch citizen]

All this is is payback from last season. The Rockets are ready to announce Amare Stou...oh wait, McGrady's having surgery. Now, McGrady is ready to give his team the extra edge and revive his caree....oh wait, the Rockets don't feel he's ready enough

[9495]

Seriously guys, give him a chance to lead us to the second round this year. Why not? You just sub Yao and Artest with Tracy & Ariza, and the whole young core is back.
In that case, the team may try to resign him. And it will give us high hopes next season when Yao is back.
We need some optimists here!

[agentkirb87]

First of all, let me say this source is legit, or as legit as someone outside the organization can get. AW is one of the most legit sports columnists out there, I have no idea how he gets his stuff but he hasn't made a wrong news item yet. Secondly, it is clear that T-mac is being isoed, at least until the nov 23 deadline. Why? There are probably a ton of reasons:

1) Tmac might affect chemistry badly.

2) Revenge for Tmac's drama last season.

3) Financial gain

4) To teach Tmac a lesson for declaring something out of the blue again (predicting his return during the game)

My guess although all reasons are true, the 4rth option is the most likely biggest reason for doing this. DM and RA want to teach Tmac a lesson about deciding stuff for himself, and staying put on the company line that he will take an MRI, and then be allowed to play sometime in December. Meanwhile while they do that, Tmac gets to cool his ass down and get in shape, the team gets to build chemistry, Les gets more moolah on the table, and who knows, somebody might be desparate enough to put together a decent package for him, like maybe the Nets or Sacto. Its win-win for the organization. They're basically screwing over Tmac here, but at the same time considering what he did last season he probably deserves it.

I agree with the your saying that Tmac is basically able to play (everyone has cleared him for full contact drills and all that). So there shouldn't be any of this "lets take it slow". Taking it slow might be letting him practice or play a few minutes a game and see where things are.

However, I can't blame the coach for saying no. He hasn't practiced with the team yet. That would be stupid to have him play without having practiced. I think thats the reason he isn't on the court yet.

[sirbaihu]

1. After his shenanigans last season, I don't care what T-Mac's opinion of his own health status is.

2. How do you just "give him a chance" without totally changing the rotation and style of play? All I've ever seen Tracy do is jack shots up and not defend. The Rockets are playing a team game now, which includes passing and running the floor. It's not about standing around watching T-Mac jack the next shot.

3. He took himself out of the lineup. He should be pissed at himself, no one else.

4. If his knee was so messed up like he said it was, the team is right to go slow. Did he learn nothing from supposedly coming back too early last season?

[deekay209]

My guess although all reasons are true, the 4rth option is the most likely biggest reason for doing this. DM and RA want to teach Tmac a lesson about deciding stuff for himself, and staying put on the company line that he will take an MRI, and then be allowed to play sometime in December. Meanwhile while they do that, Tmac gets to cool his ass down and get in shape, the team gets to build chemistry, Les gets more moolah on the table, and who knows, somebody might be desparate enough to put together a decent package for him, like maybe the Nets or Sacto. Its win-win for the organization. They're basically screwing over Tmac here, but at the same time considering what he did last season he probably deserves it.

Nope, no way. We don't want him and his drama.

[BMoney]

All this is is payback from last season. The Rockets are ready to announce Amare Stou...oh wait, McGrady's having surgery. Now, McGrady is ready to give his team the extra edge and revive his caree....oh wait, the Rockets don't feel he's ready enough

Could you give some link to the actual trade that McGrady supposedly squashed?

[9495]

I can understand the "working him in slowly" part. But people here are saying not to play him at all because he ruins the chemistry...
Well, making adjustments for available personnel is always part of the game. If Adelman doesn't know how to take advantage of T-mac's talent, he is not a good coach.
The team is weighing the balance between short term success vs. long term benefits. T-mac is feeling insecure right now - he may sense that he is not in Houston's future plans.
From the team's perspective, if he is in the future plans, there is no need to rush him back, just for precaustions. If he is not in the plan, there is really no need to play him. So I think management has been acting appropriatedly so far.

[BetterThanEver]

Yeah...except that the article mentions Tmac passing several examinations:

Exhibit A:


Exhibit B:


First of all, let me say this source is legit, or as legit as someone outside the organization can get. AW is one of the most legit sports columnists out there, I have no idea how he gets his stuff but he hasn't made a wrong news item yet. Secondly, it is clear that T-mac is being isoed, at least until the nov 23 deadline. Why? There are probably a ton of reasons:

1) Tmac might affect chemistry badly.

2) Revenge for Tmac's drama last season.

3) Financial gain

4) To teach Tmac a lesson for declaring something out of the blue again (predicting his return during the game)

My guess although all reasons are true, the 4rth option is the most likely biggest reason for doing this. DM and RA want to teach Tmac a lesson about deciding stuff for himself, and staying put on the company line that he will take an MRI, and then be allowed to play sometime in December. Meanwhile while they do that, Tmac gets to cool his ass down and get in shape, the team gets to build chemistry, Les gets more moolah on the table, and who knows, somebody might be desparate enough to put together a decent package for him, like maybe the Nets or Sacto. Its win-win for the organization. They're basically screwing over Tmac here, but at the same time considering what he did last season he probably deserves it.

Are these same doctors that cleared him to play with his bum shoulder, saying surgery could wait until the end of the season , then changed their minds and wanted surgery immediately? What if the Rockets started T-Mac last month and they changed their minds again? Do we let them go with "Oops, we did it again"?

[Z-Ro&Trae]

I trust Yahoo Sports.. i dont think they bull**** with any news.. most often than not.. the team at Yahoo sports is very very reliable. .atleast from what i have seen

but i do think Adelman has an agenda. and morey is shady.. i think they are trying to hold out t-mac and build chemistry.. which is perfect from the rockets' perspective..

but if T-Mac is "really" fit.. he should be allowed to play.. the next thing he will do is file a grievance with the players union and create a big mess.


what about that chris bosh trade to golden state exclusive story that never happened? :rolleyes: how reiable was that story?!! :rolleyes:

[sirbaihu]

Yeah...except that the article mentions Tmac passing several examinations:

Exhibit A:


Exhibit B:


First of all, let me say this source is legit, or as legit as someone outside the organization can get. AW is one of the most legit sports columnists out there, I have no idea how he gets his stuff but he hasn't made a wrong news item yet. Secondly, it is clear that T-mac is being isoed, at least until the nov 23 deadline. Why? There are probably a ton of reasons:

1) Tmac might affect chemistry badly.

2) Revenge for Tmac's drama last season.

3) Financial gain

4) To teach Tmac a lesson for declaring something out of the blue again (predicting his return during the game)

My guess although all reasons are true, the 4rth option is the most likely biggest reason for doing this. DM and RA want to teach Tmac a lesson about deciding stuff for himself, and staying put on the company line that he will take an MRI, and then be allowed to play sometime in December. Meanwhile while they do that, Tmac gets to cool his ass down and get in shape, the team gets to build chemistry, Les gets more moolah on the table, and who knows, somebody might be desparate enough to put together a decent package for him, like maybe the Nets or Sacto. Its win-win for the organization. They're basically screwing over Tmac here, but at the same time considering what he did last season he probably deserves it.

He's not getting screwed over. Remember, he passed every test and got cleared to play last season. But, according to T-Mac ,the doctors and the tests were wrong, so he had to "shut it down" for ten months. T-Mac taught us not to blindly trust the tests and the doctors when it comes to his knee.

Further, even if his knee is perfectly great now, T-Mac is no different from a hundred other players wanting playing time. He has to fit the team's present needs. He's getting paid $23 million and throwing a fit for having to watch Rox games from the best seat in the house. Do you honestly think that if T-Mac was looking like D-Wade on the practice court, they would be holding him out of games?

[9495]

Do you honestly think that if T-Mac was looking like D-Wade on the practice court, they would be holding him out of games?

True.

[rockets2]

Well according to feigen adelman laughed when he saw tracy in uniform and saw nothing wrong with it. again, haters will believe otherwise. as i said earlier, four eyed wo********** from yahoo i causing crap.

[rockets934life]

Nothing really new but here is a small article from SI.com

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/basketball/nba/11/20/rockets.tmac.ap/index.html?eref=twitter_feed

ATLANTA (AP) -- Tracy McGrady says he is ready to play. The Houston Rockets say he'll have to wait.

The seven-time All-Star had microfracture surgery on his left knee in February, but believes he's good enough to get back on the court. Houston coach Rick Adelman says it's too soon for McGrady to return, admitting there's a difference of opinion.
The Rockets played the Atlanta Hawks on Friday night. The next step for McGrady is an MRI on Monday, which should shed more light on when he can play.

[rockets2]

Nothing really new but here is a small article from SI.com

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/basketball/nba/11/20/rockets.tmac.ap/index.html?eref=twitter_feed

ATLANTA (AP) -- Tracy McGrady says he is ready to play. The Houston Rockets say he'll have to wait.

The seven-time All-Star had microfracture surgery on his left knee in February, but believes he's good enough to get back on the court. Houston coach Rick Adelman says it's too soon for McGrady to return, admitting there's a difference of opinion.
The Rockets played the Atlanta Hawks on Friday night. The next step for McGrady is an MRI on Monday, which should shed more light on when he can play.
That dosent mean they fight all he time. for gods sake according to feigen adelman and tracy were both on friendly terms all of wednesday. difference of opinion dosent = fight. nice try though.

[agentkirb87]

Yeah. Now, for those of you watching the Atlanta game. This is exactly what our team is missing. We play with intensity and energy during the first three quarters of the game, and maybe we play with intensity in the 4th, but the 4 losses we had a close game in the 4th and couldn't get it done.

I'm not saying that we can't get it done in the 4th without Tmac, because we've obviously won close games before, but it is an area we are lacking.

[rockets934life]

That dosent mean they fight all he time. for gods sake according to feigen adelman and tracy were both on friendly terms all of wednesday. difference of opinion dosent = fight. nice try though.

HUH??? When did I say they fight all the time??? I just posted an article I found online and unlike alot of posters I didn't feel like starting another thread over a one paragraph article about a topic we've beaten to death today. I bolded the part about the differences because it was the only thing I thought was remotely different... :confused:

[Artesticles]

Regarding the whole insurance situation, people need to stop blaming Morey. It's not HIS money, it's Leslie Alexander's money. Alexander absolutely is pulling an Uncle Drayton on this, and deserves to shoulder the spot light. Saving money over fielding a more competitive team. I guess you can't blame him if you know about how the stock market has destroyed his wealth. It's obviously good business. If he has an opportunity to save this much cash, he'd do it. And without Yao, he came to the reasonable conclusion that we're not a championship team even with a healthy McGrady.

Now you know why Les was willing to throw cash at 2nd round draft picks like he's Paul Allen, because of all the dough he was saving from T-Mac's insurance clause.

[agentkirb87]

Regarding the whole insurance situation, people need to stop blaming Morey. It's not HIS money, it's Leslie Alexander's money. Alexander absolutely is pulling an Uncle Drayton on this, and deserves to shoulder the spot light. Saving money over fielding a more competitive team. I guess you can't blame him if you know about how the stock market has destroyed his wealth. It's obviously good business. If he has an opportunity to save this much cash, he'd do it. And without Yao, he came to the reasonable conclusion that we're not a championship team even with a healthy McGrady.

Now you know why Les was willing to throw cash at 2nd round draft picks like he's Paul Allen, because of all the dough he was saving from T-Mac's insurance clause.

I don't think Les is intentionally benching the guy just for the money though. Tmac hasn't had a practice with the team yet (our last practice was on the 9th).

That would be stupid. If we bring McGrady back, you have to like our odds at making the playoffs even if it's just the first round. You get money for making the playoffs. Not to mention you are building your brand so that more of the casual fans in Houston will buy tickets next year and sell out more games.

[Artesticles]

I don't think Les is intentionally benching the guy just for the money though. Tmac hasn't had a practice with the team yet (our last practice was on the 9th).

That would be stupid. If we bring McGrady back, you have to like our odds at making the playoffs even if it's just the first round. You get money for making the playoffs. Not to mention you are building your brand so that more of the casual fans in Houston will buy tickets next year and sell out more games.
Well IMO this is a playoff team even if McGrady sits out all year long, so I don't agree with your point. IIRC Les is getting 80% of the contract back? That's a lot, and probably more than what a 1st round playoff appearance would generate.

[rockets934life]

A little more outspoken TMAC in this article from ESPN but pretty smae story...

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=4675855&campaign=rss&source=twitter&ex_cid=Twitter_espn_4675855

McGrady wants to play; Rockets say no

ATLANTA -- Tracy McGrady is eager to play. The Houston Rockets say he'll have to wait.



McGrady

The seven-time All-Star had microfracture surgery on his left knee in February, but insisted that he's fully recovered before Friday night's game against the streaking Atlanta Hawks.

"Right now, I could play," he said.

Not so fast. The Rockets believe McGrady needs more time and would risk hurting his knee again if he comes back too soon. The next step is an MRI on Monday.

"We have a difference of opinion," coach Rick Adelman said. "He wants to play. He's not ready to play. It's as simple as that."

Both sides denied a Yahoo! Sports report that the situation degenerated into a heated argument before the Rockets' previous game at Minnesota. The report quoted a person close to McGrady who was not identified.

"I don't know where that came from," McGrady said. "We talked but it was nothing that was reported like that. I mean, screaming and all."

Adelman shrugged off the report as "our world of the Internet."

"It seems like nowadays people want to dwell on one particular thing that may be newsworthy," he said. "Or maybe catch your eye when you look at it."

Whether the argument actually happened, it's clear that McGrady considers himself much further along in his recovery than the team's timetable.

"I don't know," he said. "It's all about what they want to do."

[topfive]

Alexander absolutely is pulling an Uncle Drayton on this, and deserves to shoulder the spot light. Saving money over fielding a more competitive team. I guess you can't blame him if you know about how the stock market has destroyed his wealth. It's obviously good business.

It's also good business in that it gives McGrady some extra time to continue to heal and get back in shape.

To sum it up very nice and tidy: saves the owner money, helps ensure the player's health and trade value

Now what exactly do people find so wrong about that? The one or two extra wins we might have at this point in the season?

[agentkirb87]

Well IMO this is a playoff team even if McGrady sits out all year long, so I don't agree with your point. IIRC Les is getting 80% of the contract back? That's a lot, and probably more than what a 1st round playoff appearance would generate.

Ok... so you are saying that without Tmac we will make the playoffs, and lose in the first round. But with McGrady we'll make the playoffs and lose in the first round. Is that what you are saying?

I'm going to have to respectfully disagree with you there. I'm not going to sit here and say "oh we'll win a title if Tmac comes back". But you put all this faith that Ariza, Brooks, Budinger, and Landry can all average around 15 points a game for the first time in their careers, and then you guys turn around and can't give McGrady a shot?

The potential for our team is so much greater with Tmac than without. Last year when we had Artest and Yao I would be with you.


-----------


And another point... up to this point last year we had a better record. But were all the players on our team playing up to par? Battier was injured, Artest, McGrady, and Yao were struggling with injuries. Maybe a role player or two had a streak of a few bad games. But we were still winning at a higher clip than we have this year, because we had the talent that could pick up the slack.

So what happens when that happens this season? You can't expect all of our players to stay completely healthy and play at this level all season. Sure, you have Ariza or Brooks have a bad game every now and then, but what if they go into a slump? We go on a losing streak, that's what.

That's where having a guy like McGrady would come in handy. Our depth sucks right now.

[Artesticles]

Ok... so you are saying that without Tmac we will make the playoffs, and lose in the first round. But with McGrady we'll make the playoffs and lose in the first round. Is that what you are saying?

I'm going to have to respectfully disagree with you there. I'm not going to sit here and say "oh we'll win a title if Tmac comes back". But you put all this faith that Ariza, Brooks, Budinger, and Landry can all average around 15 points a game for the first time in their careers, and then you guys turn around and can't give McGrady a shot?

The potential for our team is so much greater with Tmac than without. Last year when we had Artest and Yao I would be with you.


-----------


And another point... up to this point last year we had a better record. But were all the players on our team playing up to par? Battier was injured, Artest, McGrady, and Yao were struggling with injuries. Maybe a role player or two had a streak of a few bad games. But we were still winning at a higher clip than we have this year, because we had the talent that could pick up the slack.

So what happens when that happens this season? You can't expect all of our players to stay completely healthy and play at this level all season. Sure, you have Ariza or Brooks have a bad game every now and then, but what if they go into a slump? We go on a losing streak, that's what.

That's where having a guy like McGrady would come in handy. Our depth sucks right now.
I never said that. All I'm saying is we're good enough to make it without him, and make Les his playoff money, so the whole not playing him to gain insurance money point is still valid. We're probably not championship good unless Yao miraculously comes back or we make a trade, but I do think we're possibly 2nd round good with T-Mac.

[t_mac1]

http://pic40.picturetrail.com:80/VOL293/8719706/16143570/378266832.jpg

BREAKING NEWS: here's tmac and cook poppin' off at each other. look at their reactions towards one another, jesus.

[Jeff Who]

t_mac1 can you please give us links to those photos?

[t_mac1]

t_mac1 can you please give us links to those photos?

oh i just get it from getty images. those are the only pics. i don't know what chinese sites others get their pics from. sorry man.

however, he looks as great physically as i have ever seen him in the past few years. and he doesn't appear to wear any kind of brace/protection for his knee.

hopefully resolutions come soon on monday.

[Jeff Who]

oh i just get it from getty images. those are the only pics. i don't know what chinese sites others get their pics from. sorry man.

however, he looks as great physically as i have ever seen him in the past few years. and he doesn't appear to wear any kind of brace/protection for his knee.

hopefully resolutions come soon on monday.

ok thanks. we need a chinise fan to post all those pictures because I am sure they are available like those

http://sports.sohu.com/20091020/n267533177_2.shtml