ClutchFans - Pudge to the Rangers ?!?!

leroy420

08-18-2009, 08:10 AM

juicystream

08-18-2009, 08:16 AM

The more I think about it, the more I'd give Pudge away for just about anything. What is he doing to help this team at this point? Nothing. His average is slipping to Brad Ausmus levels. His power has dropped to near-Ausmus levels. His OBP is worse than Ausmus. His defense has gotten markedly worse. .184 avg with RISP. He actually hits nearly 70 points worse than his average merely because there is a runner on 2nd and/or 3rd.

Trade Pudge for a bag of balls and let Towles finish out the season. It couldn't be worse than the production they're getting now and at least Towles would cost slightly less.

I'd agree. You might as well take your chance with Towles. This team doesn't need Pudge with the Cardinals so far ahead now. Maybe Towles will show his a ML quality catcher, and either be our starting catcher next year or gain trade value. There are a lot of people thinking Castro may be ready for opening day 2010.

leroy420

08-18-2009, 08:20 AM

I'd agree. You might as well take your chance with Towles. This team doesn't need Pudge with the Cardinals so far ahead now. Maybe Towles will show his a ML quality catcher, and either be our starting catcher next year or gain trade value. There are a lot of people thinking Castro may be ready for opening day 2010.

I think Castro will take a path that will closely resemble the one Pence did. Be with the club in ST until the last possible second. Start the season at AAA for some seasoning and get the call by early May.

I had heard a rumor of the team considering a switch for Towles. They apparently want to see if he can play 3rd. With Chris Johnson failing miserably at AAA, no other prospects anywhere near close, and the Blum/Keppinger duo not being a viable long term option, it would make perfect sense. Of course, he has to be able to do it.

Creepy Crawl

08-18-2009, 08:27 AM

I heard a guy on the radio say that the Astros were interested in Alex Rodriguez..... ;)

juicystream

08-18-2009, 08:35 AM

I think Castro will take a path that will closely resemble the one Pence did. Be with the club in ST until the last possible second. Start the season at AAA for some seasoning and get the call by early May.

I had heard a rumor of the team considering a switch for Towles. They apparently want to see if he can play 3rd. With Chris Johnson failing miserably at AAA, no other prospects anywhere near close, and the Blum/Keppinger duo not being a viable long term option, it would make perfect sense. Of course, he has to be able to do it.

You maybe right. I can't imagine the team not sending him to AAA first, and with Towles there right now it causes a problem. They certainly have to figure that one out.

bobrek

08-18-2009, 08:49 AM

Considering Towles is injured and hasn't played since July 25, any speculation regarding his promotion to the Astros is moot.

Major

08-18-2009, 09:27 AM

I had heard a rumor of the team considering a switch for Towles. They apparently want to see if he can play 3rd. With Chris Johnson failing miserably at AAA, no other prospects anywhere near close, and the Blum/Keppinger duo not being a viable long term option, it would make perfect sense. Of course, he has to be able to do it.

I thought the problem with Towles was that he's struggled with his hitting in the majors (at least in what little time they've given him), not his defense? What good does switching him to a premium offensive position do? If he lived up to potential, he could be an above-average hitting catcher, but would be an average/below-average 3B.

juicystream

08-18-2009, 09:46 AM

I thought the problem with Towles was that he's struggled with his hitting in the majors (at least in what little time they've given him), not his defense? What good does switching him to a premium offensive position do? If he lived up to potential, he could be an above-average hitting catcher, but would be an average/below-average 3B.

He hasn't hit in the majors, but the knock on his offense is a lack of power. He has been a good hitter in the minors, and can get on base. I'd compare him to Jason Kendall.

Major

08-18-2009, 09:53 AM

He hasn't hit in the majors, but the knock on his offense is a lack of power. He has been a good hitter in the minors, and can get on base. I'd compare him to Jason Kendall.

Exactly - who on earth would want Jason Kendall as their 3B?

GlenRice

08-18-2009, 09:57 AM

stros need to rebuild. Trade tejada, berkman ,lee and Oswalt and get some young guys.

juicystream

08-18-2009, 09:59 AM

Exactly - who on earth would want Jason Kendall as their 3B?

A team with Geoff Blum, Aaron Boone, & Jeff Keppinger. How about a move to 2B? I heard somewhere that worked out for the Astros back in the 90's. :cool:

leroy420

08-18-2009, 10:21 AM

I thought the problem with Towles was that he's struggled with his hitting in the majors (at least in what little time they've given him), not his defense? What good does switching him to a premium offensive position do? If he lived up to potential, he could be an above-average hitting catcher, but would be an average/below-average 3B.

IMO, his sample size is still pretty small in the majors. He was rushed last season and hasn't had more than a cup of coffee this season. I think we really don't know what he projects to be at this point. At the least, when healthy, he deserves another shot.

Big Shot Rob

08-18-2009, 10:38 AM

Towles is good for an occassional HR, and that's about it. His batting average was horrendous during his brief stint with the club.

I'd much rather see Castro called up.

Major

08-18-2009, 11:02 AM

IMO, his sample size is still pretty small in the majors. He was rushed last season and hasn't had more than a cup of coffee this season. I think we really don't know what he projects to be at this point. At the least, when healthy, he deserves another shot.

I totally agree with this - I think he should have gotten a full season last year, and should have been given more of a chance this year.

But given that the Astros weren't willing to give him the opportunity at a place where we had crap options (Ausmus, Quintero, etc), they apparently don't think much of him. So why move him to a position where you need to be even better to justify your place on a club? If they don't think he's good enough offensively to start over Ausmus/Q, what makes them think he'd have a shot starting at 3B?

It seems to me the logical reason to move someone from C to 3B is if their defense is lacking but you want to get their bat in the lineup, or you want to extend their career because they are a great hitter. Towles seems to be the opposite.

TheBigAristotle

08-18-2009, 11:03 AM

PLAYOFFS?!

The Cat

08-18-2009, 11:15 AM

Wow, done deal per DMN. No word on what we get back.

juicystream

08-18-2009, 11:20 AM

Wow, done deal per DMN. No word on what we get back.

Can't expect anything more than a journeyman minor leaguer. It won't hurt regardless.

DoitDickau

08-18-2009, 11:30 AM

Rangers Close To Acquiring Pudge From Astros
By Ben Nicholson-Smith [August 18 at 12:18pm CST]
The Rangers are close to re-acquiring Ivan Rodriguez, according to MLB.com's T.R. Sullivan. Sullivan says the Astros would obtain two mid-tier prospects for Rodriguez, who starred with the Rangers from 1991-2002. The Rangers have told Rodriguez that he will back Taylor Teagarden up and Pudge understands the arrangement,

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/

BrooksBall

08-18-2009, 11:36 AM

This would be great for us. I could care less who fills in for Pudge. I'd take one mid-tier prospect. Two would be fantastic. The Rangers' farm system is stacked and they need a catcher with Salty down and them still in the thick of things.

rockets934life

08-18-2009, 11:43 AM

BrooksBall

08-18-2009, 11:44 AM

Now lets move Val for a top tier minor leaguer and it would be a silver lining in a crappy August!

Agreed. That would be even better news.

rockets934life

08-18-2009, 11:53 AM

Agreed. That would be even better news.

I was going nuts(in a good way) when the rumor was floating around we talked to Tampa for Wade Davis but thought was a little to whishful thinking yet if we could move him for a nice AA or maybe AAA quality young arm id be doing cartwheels.

rockets934life

08-18-2009, 11:55 AM

12:47pm: MLB.com's Noah Coslov reports that the Rangers acquired Pudge for a player to be named later.

Two mid tier minor leaguers were to good to be true but atleast something down the road....

rockets934life

08-18-2009, 11:56 AM

Sorry Link...

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2009/08/rangers-close-to-acquiring-pudge.html

juicystream

08-18-2009, 11:58 AM

12:47pm: MLB.com's Noah Coslov reports that the Rangers acquired Pudge for a player to be named later.

Two mid tier minor leaguers were to good to be true but atleast something down the road....

That sounds like the deal I was expecting.

jakedasnake

08-18-2009, 12:11 PM

Here is the article from the Fort Worth-Star Telegram. Any one have any ideas of who we might be getting? Hopefully a pitcher and position player. They are pretty excited her about his return. Poor guys! We are pretty excited about getting players back for him and also the opportunity for Towles or Castro to get some PT. Anyone know if Towles is injured or not?

http://www.star-telegram.com/284/story/1544214.html

BrooksBall

08-18-2009, 12:16 PM

Towles had a few recent injuries. I think the most recent involved a tractor. I have no clue how close he is to recovery.

RocketFan007

08-18-2009, 12:19 PM

Ottomaton

08-18-2009, 12:26 PM

BrooksBall

08-18-2009, 12:34 PM

juicystream

08-18-2009, 12:35 PM

Word is we're getting Matt Nevarez and a PTBNL. Nevarez is a young reliever having a very good year at low A ball.

http://web.minorleaguebaseball.com/milb/stats/stats.jsp?pos=P&sid=milb&t=p_pbp&pid=457764

Apparently he had Tommy John surgery a few years ago, and last year was his first full season. He could be a real steal. Here is a good rundown:

http://rangers.scout.com/2/882788.html

90-95mph Fastball
79-81mph Slider
Changeup

He used to throw a curve, but instead is throwing the slider and both the slider and changeup are works in process.

juicystream

08-18-2009, 12:37 PM

Towles had a few recent injuries. I think the most recent involved a tractor. I have no clue how close he is to recovery.

He played after breaking his nose in the tractor injury during the all-star break, but hasn't played in almost a month. The nose was supposed to be a minor injury. Not sure why he isn't playing right now.

BrooksBall

08-18-2009, 12:38 PM

He played after breaking his nose in the tractor injury during the all-star break, but hasn't played in almost a month. The nose was supposed to be a minor injury. Not sure why he isn't playing right now.

I seem to recall the first injury being something else like a hammy. I asked Z in his blog but I can't recall for sure.

juicystream

08-18-2009, 12:43 PM

I seem to recall the first injury being something else like a hammy. I asked Z in his blog but I can't recall for sure.

http://brianmctaggart.mlblogs.com/archives/2009/07/boone-on-way-back-towles-injured-and-former-first-round-pick-released.html

Catcher J.R. Towles broke his nose in a tractor accident during the All-Star break, but he isn't expected to miss any significant time. Yes, I said tractor. Towles is hitting .303 with three homers and 17 RBIs through 41 games at Triple-A Round Rock.

He's played in 6 games since this blog. That was the best I could find.

BrooksBall

08-18-2009, 12:44 PM

Here it is juicystream: http://blogs.chron.com/unofficialscorer/2009/07/astros_am_report_allstar_regre.html

First comment/response in the comments section.

He must have also played after the tractor incident.

SamCassell

08-18-2009, 12:48 PM

Kind of off topic, but has anybody noticed that Aaron Boone has started a rehab assignment in AA with the Hooks? I was pretty much expecting him to be not around at all, but apparently he wants to be on the ML roster on Sept. 1.
Yep, saw him play Wednesday here in Corpus. He went 1 for 2 and was subbed out for defensive purposes in the 6th. He doesn't look like anything special so far, but he's probably got plenty of rust to shake off.

FR0497

08-18-2009, 12:49 PM

Article from mlb.com on the trade.

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20090818&content_id=6482172&vkey=news_mlb&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlb

E-Man

08-18-2009, 01:02 PM

Astros have already put up the white flag.

TIME TO TANK THIS SEASON!!!!

MadMax

08-18-2009, 01:06 PM

Astros have already put up the white flag.

TIME TO TANK THIS SEASON!!!!

most of what they have is untradeable...for any number of reasons, not the least of which are no-trade clauses.

Big Shot Rob

08-18-2009, 01:07 PM

BrooksBall

08-18-2009, 01:09 PM

I wish we could've have gotten a higher-tier prospect in return.

For a 40-year-old catcher with a .650 OPS that is going to be a backup for them?

I would have been satisified with just the already-named prospect.

Matt Maloney

08-18-2009, 01:14 PM

isnt Coste a catcher as well?
he can fill in there.

cardpire

08-18-2009, 01:18 PM

i like it. i wonder if miggy is next?

SamCassell

08-18-2009, 01:35 PM

isnt Coste a catcher as well?
he can fill in there.
Yeah, get the kid some more ABs.

HeyDude

08-18-2009, 01:37 PM

i like it. i wonder if miggy is next?

I believe they already put, then took, Miggy off the waivers, and I dont think you can put a player back on the waivers to be traded again...

BrooksBall

08-18-2009, 01:39 PM

Yeah, get the kid some more ABs.

:D

Is it too late to bring back Clemens for our "typical" closing stretch?

We can always expect to make up large deficits late in the season. It's in our DNA. :rolleyes:

TheFreak

08-18-2009, 01:43 PM

"on the radio" = fan speculation. How many years will have to pass before people get this?

Ouch.

cardpire

08-18-2009, 01:51 PM

I believe they already put, then took, Miggy off the waivers, and I dont think you can put a player back on the waivers to be traded again...

meaning we was claimed and didn't clear?

The Cat

08-18-2009, 01:54 PM

Ouch.

About three or four posters immediately had the same reaction, and you highlight mine only. Biased much?

juicystream

08-18-2009, 01:59 PM

A reliever in low-A ball and a player to be named...? Not that losing Pudge is going to have a significant impact on our team, as we're basically out of the wild-card hunt anyways, but I wish we could've have gotten a higher-tier prospect in return. But, on the bright side, it's a start at re-tooling what has widely been considered one of the league's weakest farm systems.

I hope we ship Tejada/Valverde to a contender in need of a bat/strong arm in the pen for some young talent.

Getting anything for Pudge was a win, as he wasn't giving much to the club. We got a guy who was considered to have raw talent out of HS, and hurt his arm during his first season(Which he was very good, even though he was considered raw). He had Tommy John Surgery and came back for a full season in 2008, and pitched well. He's having a great 2009. I'll take that for Pudge.

Mattj

08-18-2009, 02:01 PM

The player to be named is Jose Vallejo a scrub infielder...can't be announced until he clears waivers.

SamCassell

08-18-2009, 02:06 PM

The player to be named is Jose Vallejo a scrub infielder...can't be announced until he clears waivers.
Might not be a total waste. 22 yr old 2B in AAA already, looks to have plenty of speed (47 steals in 2007). We definitely need middle IF prospects.

HeyDude

08-18-2009, 02:07 PM

The player to be named is Jose Vallejo a scrub infielder...can't be announced until he clears waivers.

If this dude is not even a small prospect, maybe Drayton trying to save 500 k on salary? (ivan makes 1.5 this year)...

juicystream

08-18-2009, 02:13 PM

Might not be a total waste. 22 yr old 2B in AAA already, looks to have plenty of speed (47 steals in 2007). We definitely need middle IF prospects.

He's not any better than Kata/Maysonet/Manzella.

http://www.thebaseballcube.com/players/V/Jose-Vallejo.shtml

Apparently he is fast, but doesn't get on base well. Unless he is a tremendous defensive player, he probably won't really play in the majors, and I doubt he is that great defensively if he is playing 2B instead of SS.

juicystream

08-18-2009, 02:15 PM

If this dude is not even a small prospect, maybe Drayton trying to save 500 k on salary? (ivan makes 1.5 this year)...

Or the other guy in the deal. :rolleyes:

msn

08-18-2009, 02:19 PM

If this dude is not even a small prospect, maybe Drayton trying to save 500 k on salary? (ivan makes 1.5 this year)...
So, he keeps Tejada and Valverde before the deadline then deals Pudge? What, is Drayton "cheap" and stupid?

Or the other guy in the deal.
Naahhhh, McScrooge is both cheap and stooooopid. Pooppooooura!!

:rolleyes:
concur.

HeyDude

08-18-2009, 02:19 PM

Or the other guy in the deal. :rolleyes:

I'm sure the minor leager is not making even that much....btw, my comment was not to diss Drayton or anything, I was just wondering why he made the move....

msn

08-18-2009, 02:21 PM

I'm sure the minor leager is not making even that much....btw, my comment was not to diss Drayton or anything, I was just wondering why he made the move....
sorry then, I'm used to rolling my eyes at people jumping on the "McCheap" bandwagon. My bad.

As to why he made the deal -- Pudge is on a one-year contract. We have a crappy, crappy farm system. What's not to understand?

HeyDude

08-18-2009, 02:24 PM

So, he keeps Tejada and Valverde before the deadline then deals Pudge? What, is Drayton "cheap" and stupid?

Naahhhh, McScrooge is both cheap and stooooopid. Pooppooooura!!

concur.

MSN, I've never said anything bad about drayton before, and my comment was not meant to criticize him dude. I was merely pointing out that seems like we got a D level prospect while saving potentially a few hundred K....which I dont really have a problem with....

juicystream

08-18-2009, 02:25 PM

I'm sure the minor leager is not making even that much....btw, my comment was not to diss Drayton or anything, I was just wondering why he made the move....

He probably enjoys saving the extra cash, but they got good value for Pudge. I assumed it would just be a cash dump, but we got a player that very well could be part of our bullpen in a couple of years.

juicystream

08-18-2009, 02:27 PM

MSN, I've never said anything bad about drayton before, and my comment was not meant to criticize him dude. I was merely pointing out that seems like we got a D level prospect while saving potentially a few hundred K....which I dont really have a problem with....

Have you seen that this is 2 players we are talking about, not just the one crappy infielder?

msn

08-18-2009, 02:28 PM

ya, I was wrong to assume you were jumping onto the ever-crowded "mcscroogewagon". The deal, at least to my untrained, uneducated senses, appears to be one that gets us something rather than nothing for Pudge who was certain to not return after this season anyway. Think about it -- $500k in MLB economy is beans. Two minor leaguers, on the other hand, at least you have the potential of something. Especially with the Astros' pathetic system. So, I like the deal.

HeyDude

08-18-2009, 02:32 PM

Two minor leaguers, on the other hand, at least you have the potential of something. Especially with the Astros' pathetic system. So, I like the deal.

I was responding to Matt J's take that it was just one crappy infielder. I guess even then, something better than nothing at this point...

HeyDude

08-18-2009, 02:33 PM

Have you seen that this is 2 players we are talking about, not just the one crappy infielder?

I was responding to Matt J's post....

TheFreak

08-18-2009, 03:25 PM

About three or four posters immediately had the same reaction, and you highlight mine only. Biased much?

There were only two posters before you, and neither of them had a similar reaction.

msn

08-18-2009, 03:37 PM

There were only two posters before you, and neither of them had a similar reaction.
 
three others within the first ten posts:
I'm going to lean towards that being an opinion...a stupid one at that.
A very stupid opinion.
I heard a guy on the radio say that the Astros were interested in Alex Rodriguez..... :)
....just sayin' :)

leroy420

08-18-2009, 03:47 PM

^

My reaction was based on this comment

they were trashing the Astros today...saying we were jealous that the Rangers were smart enough to hire Nolan Ryan away from us so we wouldn't make the trade

That...is a stupid opinion.

msn

08-18-2009, 03:52 PM

^

My reaction was based on this comment

That...is a stupid opinion.
ah! my bad. see, it's generally best for me to just back away from the keyboard...

Ottomaton

08-18-2009, 04:17 PM

Does Nevarez's season of injury count as a minor league season?

I ask because at the end of the Vallejo will have 5 full seasons. And minor leaguer's get free agency after 6 seasons, which is why I assume he was pushed from advanced-A to AAA over the course of 2 seasons. He probably needs more seasoning, but the Rangers probably can't afford to let him develop in his own time.

Counting the injury year Nevarez has 5 as well. If the Astros only have 1 year to try him out, and he's been in low A to this point, it might be problematic to have to find a 40 man roster spot for him. Two seasons would make things much easier.

rikesh316

08-18-2009, 04:20 PM

Like the deal. Getting three young players from the Texas Rangers system for 1.5 months of Pudge is a good move. The two named players are only 22 so they still have upside.

The Cat

08-18-2009, 04:20 PM

There were only two posters before you, and neither of them had a similar reaction.

msn cited what I was referring to, but also, where's your proof that this wasn't fan speculation? The Rangers had a need for a backup catcher -- everyone knew this. Dallas folks love Pudge based on his history with them, and saw him in a situation with a team out of the race. It's not that hard to put 2 and 2 together and predict that trade. On draft day, people on this BBS suggested the Rockets deal for a second-round pick and draft Budinger, considering he fit a need and was popular. Did the BBS "break" that trade, or was it coincidental?

My point, aside from this specific instance, is this: in the internet era, if someone has a serious scoop, they're not just going to say it on a radio show. Every publication has a website, and hell, almost every writer has a Twitter, too. If someone has a legit scoop, they'll have it in writing and attributable to them (otherwise, what's the point?) in seconds. And the way sports radio guys talk, it's very difficult to decipher (and they do this intentionally) what's irrelevant speculation from what's a rumor based in fact. Radio-only rumors are unreliable.

Oski2005

08-18-2009, 04:23 PM

If we lose every game the rest of the way, will the Nat'nahls still have a worse record?

Major

08-18-2009, 04:35 PM

msn cited what I was referring to, but also, where's your proof that this wasn't fan speculation? The Rangers had a need for a backup catcher -- everyone knew this. Dallas folks love Pudge based on his history with them, and saw him in a situation with a team out of the race. It's not that hard to put 2 and 2 together and predict that trade.

It's awfully convenient that the trade happened within 24 hours of the "fan speculation" in middle of August when very few trades ever happen.

sammy

08-18-2009, 05:24 PM

Good. Castro is our future anyways.

The Cat

08-18-2009, 05:33 PM

It's awfully convenient that the trade happened within 24 hours of the "fan speculation" in middle of August when very few trades ever happen.

Not really. Monday was the first weekday (aka normal radio hosts, full slate of callers) after Saltalamacchia was placed on the DL this weekend. I'd say it's par for the course for hosts/callers to go down the list of possible replacements in the immediate aftermath.

rockets934life

08-18-2009, 05:37 PM

I know we got the reliever in A ball and the soft hitting middle infielder but there is apaprently a third player...any word who that might be?

World B Free

08-18-2009, 06:33 PM

I heard a guy on the radio say that the Astros were interested in Alex Rodriguez..... ;)

now who looks silly, hahaha

Refman

08-18-2009, 07:27 PM

stros need to rebuild. Trade tejada, berkman ,lee and Oswalt and get some young guys.
Berkman, Lee and Oswalt have full no trade clauses.

They are not going anywhere.

The Astros and Tejada are considering a contract extension (at a reduced salary).

Next.

Refman

08-18-2009, 07:32 PM

It was the class A pitcher and TWO players to be named later.

Ottomaton

08-18-2009, 08:05 PM

Berkman, Lee and Oswalt have full no trade clauses.

They are not going anywhere.

So did Pudge.

Poloshirtbandit

08-18-2009, 09:10 PM

So did Pudge.

Lee has said he will not accept a trade. Oswalt is the only one that would maybe accept a trade, but even then they are limited to what teams they can trade to.

BrooksBall

08-18-2009, 09:55 PM

It was the class A pitcher and TWO players to be named later.

I'm watching the Rangers postgame. One announcer just said the 2nd player to be named later is dependent on the Rangers making the postseason. Is that true?

Jared Novak

08-18-2009, 10:07 PM

I'm watching the Rangers postgame. One announcer just said the 2nd player to be named later is dependent on the Rangers making the postseason. Is that true?

I wouldn't be surprised if this is true, considering that the Rangers had to "sweeten the pot" to get the Astros to make the deal. Some deals have contingencies, it looks like this one might. Glad the Astros got something for Pudge instead of letting him walk away, I doubt he would have been even a Type B free agent, not that the Astros would've offered arbitration anyway, IMO.

CometsWin

08-18-2009, 10:10 PM

"on the radio" = fan speculation. How many years will have to pass before people get this?

LOL Uncanny.

msn

08-18-2009, 10:21 PM

Glad the Astros got something for Pudge instead of letting him walk away, I doubt he would have been even a Type B free agent, not that the Astros would've offered arbitration anyway, IMO.
Agree.

Vinsanity

08-19-2009, 02:02 AM

Small fail by the Cat, but nowhere near the epic fail he'll have if Reggie Bush gets healthy has a pro bowl season and the Saints go deep in the playoffs. He may just off himself if that happens.

Groogrux

08-19-2009, 06:35 AM

The Cat

08-19-2009, 08:00 AM

LOL Uncanny.

And your proof that this wasn't fan speculation is...?

Obsessive, stalkerish CometsWin is back, yet again throwing out lame insults without any substance. I've seen this before.

The Cat

08-19-2009, 08:03 AM

Small fail by the Cat, but nowhere near the epic fail he'll have if Reggie Bush gets healthy has a pro bowl season and the Saints go deep in the playoffs. He may just off himself if that happens.

It wouldn't be any different than the epic fail the Bush jockers, such as yourself, have gone through for three consecutive years now. Tell me, how does it feel? You have to be pretty used to it.

CometsWin

08-19-2009, 09:05 AM

And your proof that this wasn't fan speculation is...?

Obsessive, stalkerish CometsWin is back, yet again throwing out lame insults without any substance. I've seen this before.

Yeah, the last time I replied to you was like a year ago? That's definitely obsessive and stalkerish. You corner the market on posting declarative, expert opinions that blow up in your face. It's quite uncanny.

msn

08-19-2009, 09:27 AM

.....soooooooooooo, how 'bout those Rangers? :D

RocketFan007

08-19-2009, 09:28 AM

Berkman, Lee and Oswalt have full no trade clauses.

They are not going anywhere.

I've read that Lee's full no trade clause ends after this season.

juicystream

08-19-2009, 09:36 AM

I've read that Lee's full no trade clause ends after this season.

It won't matter. His contract makes him very hard to trade. The Astros would probably have to eat a portion of the deal if they moved him.

jakedasnake

08-19-2009, 09:42 AM

And your proof that this wasn't fan speculation is...?

Obsessive, stalkerish CometsWin is back, yet again throwing out lame insults without any substance. I've seen this before.

Look, you can defend this all you want. It's not a big deal. However, this was not pure speculation on the part of the Dallas ESPN Radio guys who have been around for years and years. I heard them yesterday morning mentioning this as a possibility as well and it sounded like they knew the Rangers and Astros were at least having talks and the Astros did not seem interested.

They were on top of this from early in the morning and heard it from a reliable source at the Fort Worth Star-Telegram who ended up breaking the story. At my lunch break I also heard this confirmed before any of the news outlets printed the story. Dallas was on top of this one all the way. That is my proof that this wasn't "fan speculation" as you put it since I actually listened to the report. Dallas radio is not creative enough to speculate. While agree most radio stations speculate, can we agree that this station actually knew something was up or is that so hard to believe? Either way, I really don't care. I am just amazed that you still claim it was pure speculation when the deal actually happened hours later.

msn

08-19-2009, 09:55 AM

Dallas radio is not creative enough to speculate.
awesome. :D

The Cat

08-19-2009, 10:12 AM

Yeah, the last time I replied to you was like a year ago? That's definitely obsessive and stalkerish. You corner the market on posting declarative, expert opinions that blow up in your face. It's quite uncanny.

Really? Well, if it happens so often and I "corner the market", why don't you show me other "declarative, expert opinions" I've made that have "blown up" in my face? Examples, please? Or are you just talking out your ass, per usual?

The Cat

08-19-2009, 10:19 AM

Look, you can defend this all you want. It's not a big deal. However, this was not pure speculation on the part of the Dallas ESPN Radio guys who have been around for years and years. I heard them yesterday morning mentioning this as a possibility as well and it sounded like they knew the Rangers and Astros were at least having talks and the Astros did not seem interested.

They were on top of this from early in the morning and heard it from a reliable source at the Fort Worth Star-Telegram who ended up breaking the story. At my lunch break I also heard this confirmed before any of the news outlets printed the story. Dallas was on top of this one all the way. That is my proof that this wasn't "fan speculation" as you put it since I actually listened to the report. Dallas radio is not creative enough to speculate. While agree most radio stations speculate, can we agree that this station actually knew something was up or is that so hard to believe? Either way, I really don't care. I am just amazed that you still claim it was pure speculation when the deal actually happened hours later.

Considering the DMN broke the story about 11, I find it hard to believe your lunch break was prior to then.

Look, every rule has its exceptions, and perhaps this was one of them. But it's quite possible it's not, and logical speculation mirrored the actual talk, as it did with Budinger and the Rockets on draft day. And like you said, this isn't a big deal at all -- it's so trivial. But for whatever reason, I seem to have a couple of obsessive stalkers on this board who live for the day I make any mistake, and I'm not going to give them the satisfaction of admitting a wrong when it isn't 100% (and if it is, was irrelevant to the larger point). I'll be happy to discuss the issue logically with you or most others on this board, but CometsWin has always been about unwarranted and unfounded personal attacks, so I see no reason to even try that with him.

TheFreak

08-19-2009, 10:22 AM

msn cited what I was referring to, but also, where's your proof that this wasn't fan speculation?

That wasn't really the point to me. A guy makes a post about something he heard on the radio in Dallas and asked if anyone in Houston had heard anything. Not having heard what he heard, you immediately call it "fan speculation" and imply that he isn't "getting" something. I found it strange that you would jump on someone for such an innocent post. When it turned out to be true, I thought it was worth a small chuckle. Nothing personal, really.

msn

08-19-2009, 10:27 AM

Cat, while it's none of my business, it would seem the ignore button would serve you well.

The Cat

08-19-2009, 10:29 AM

Yeah, the last time I replied to you was like a year ago? That's definitely obsessive and stalkerish. You corner the market on posting declarative, expert opinions that blow up in your face. It's quite uncanny.

You know, just for you, I decided to go through the posts I made on this board, and see just how my opinions/predictions had blown up in my face. Let's take a look:

Rockets-Portland: Rockets in 6
Rockets-Lakers: Lakers in 7 (in fact, picked Rockets to win both Games 4 and 6 post-Yao, even when the world called me an idiot for not believing doom)
Ron Artest, post LA: wouldn't be back
Said Bush's production would be comparable to Kevin Faulk last year.
Said Lidge's problems were injury-related, not mental, and would straighten in Philly -- then perfect season, World Series. Knee problems return, and voila! He struggles, again.
Called out Amare "rumor" as typical radio rubbish.
Called the Jennings deal a wash because Astros gave up garbage -- Taveras has .273 OBP, Hirsh is a 27-year-old AAA pitcher, Buchholz' arm is gone and out for year

Those are just a few of the major debates I've seen myself in over the past year or so... which of these, exactly, blew up in my face? I'm waiting...

The Cat

08-19-2009, 10:32 AM

That wasn't really the point to me. A guy makes a post about something he heard on the radio in Dallas and asked if anyone in Houston had heard anything. Not having heard what he heard, you immediately call it "fan speculation" and imply that he isn't "getting" something. I found it strange that you would jump on someone for such an innocent post. When it turned out to be true, I thought it was worth a small chuckle. Nothing personal, really.

My bad, then. I've had quite a few confrontations (in the Texans/Astros forum) with a certain poster who does seem to have a personal problem with me, and it was a little reminiscent of his style, so I jumped to conclusions. Sorry.

The Cat

08-19-2009, 10:40 AM

Cat, while it's none of my business, it would seem the ignore button would serve you well.

I guess. It's just frustrating because the poster I'm referring to generally has some solid takes on this board, outside of his issues with me. Sorry for sidelining the thread with this, it's been a bad morning.

To get back on topic, the optimism from Rangers fans over Pudge in the past day has been a little extreme. I can see that it's fun given his history with them, but in reality, we're talking about a 37-year-old with mediocre defense and a .660 OPS -- Ausmus-esque. Yet the folks I talk to in Dallas are acting like this is the missing link to put them in the playoffs and contend. It's a little over the top.

MadMax

08-19-2009, 12:36 PM

To get back on topic, the optimism from Rangers fans over Pudge in the past day has been a little extreme. I can see that it's fun given his history with them, but in reality, we're talking about a 37-year-old with mediocre defense and a .660 OPS -- Ausmus-esque. Yet the folks I talk to in Dallas are acting like this is the missing link to put them in the playoffs and contend. It's a little over the top.

too funny. i've seen a thousand facebook updates celebrating the return of pudge...i've simply replied with his OBP.

Refman

08-19-2009, 07:00 PM

too funny. i've seen a thousand facebook updates celebrating the return of pudge...i've simply replied with his OBP.
Why do you have to hate on the Kung Fu Panda like that?

CometsWin

08-19-2009, 08:17 PM

Really? Well, if it happens so often and I "corner the market", why don't you show me other "declarative, expert opinions" I've made that have "blown up" in my face? Examples, please? Or are you just talking out your ass, per usual?

You sure talk a lot of crap for someone who's such a thin skinned little bitch. "Stalking you" and your 13,000 posts. Get a grip on yourself woman.

Off the top of my head, there was the crazy Mo Taylor love affair, the Chris Simms idolatry, the Brad Lidge retardedness, the "it was a great pitch" even though Braun hit it out of the park drama in defense of your boy Lidge of course, and even in the last year there was the genius talk about the Texans offense being far superior to the Titans even though the Titans had outscored the Texans offense at the time.

You can reguarly be seen taking the bat **** crazy position in the Hangout any time there's a controversial referee call on Monday Night Football or something. You think you're some resident Charlie Pallilo but you're more like Charlie Brown dude. I'm going to do myself a favor and put YOU on ignore.

Mr. Clutch

08-19-2009, 08:25 PM

Good, let's see more of this.

Oswalt had a quote that hopefully the Astros do more of this so that they have a shot next year.

Vinsanity

08-19-2009, 10:42 PM

[QUOTE=The Cat]You know, just for you, I decided to go through the posts I made on this board, and see just how my opinions/predictions had blown up in my face. Let's take a look:
[QUOTE]

I think this is why some people take issue with you. You seriously act like a know-it-all. You are never wrong, we get it.

MadMax

08-20-2009, 08:22 AM

Why do you have to hate on the Kung Fu Panda like that?

i love me some kung fu panda! :)

The Cat

08-20-2009, 08:46 AM

Off the top of my head, there was the crazy Mo Taylor love affair

I'm sorry I wasn't a perfect person like you when I was 15 and 16 years old. How would you like it if I judged you by the person you were at 16?

the Chris Simms idolatry

I think Chris Simms was and is a good quarterback. What specifically do you disagree with here?

the Brad Lidge retardedness

When he was healthy, he recovered fully and delivered one of the greatest individual seasons in baseball history, capped by a World Series and plenty of "big game" saves along the way. If by retardedness you mean "dead on correct", then maybe. Lidge did nothing but prove me right.

the "it was a great pitch" even though Braun hit it out of the park drama in defense of your boy Lidge of course

Are you really this dense? This is mind-blowing stupidity. Do you not acknowledge that even great pitches can occasionally be hit? Why doesn't Mariano Rivera have a 0.00 ERA?

and even in the last year there was the genius talk about the Texans offense being far superior to the Titans even though the Titans had outscored the Texans offense at the time.

Tell me, who ended up winning that game, even with a clearly lesser defense? Again, if by "blowing up in my face" you mean dead-on correct, then yup, great example.

You can reguarly be seen taking the bat **** crazy position in the Hangout any time there's a controversial referee call on Monday Night Football or something.

Ah, the old generic "regularly" without citing a single specific example. Again, that's called talking out of your ass.

You think you're some resident Charlie Pallilo but you're more like Charlie Brown dude.

The three major professional sports organizations in this city respect my writing and takes enough that I regularly have credentials for all of them -- I think I'll take their affirmation over yours, thank you very much.

I'm going to do myself a favor and put YOU on ignore.

God I hope that's true. Get a life.

HillBoy

08-20-2009, 09:13 AM

thacabbage

08-20-2009, 09:35 AM

Off the top of my head, there was the crazy Mo Taylor love affair
LOL! Sorry Cat, but remembering this made me chuckle. You are one of my favorite posters on here now (mainly because we seem to get irritated by the same type of idiocy), but we definitely butted heads pretty regularly in the early years over your obsessions with Mo Taylor, the late Jason Collier, and Jerome Moiso. Good times. To be naive again and think the team seemed headed towards greatness. :( Do you not follow the Rockets anymore? - you seem to confine yourself to this forum.

juicystream

08-20-2009, 09:38 AM

...

...

Thank God one of you put the other on ignore. An immature argument at best.

The Cat

08-20-2009, 10:19 AM

LOL! Sorry Cat, but remembering this made me chuckle. You are one of my favorite posters on here now (mainly because we seem to get irritated by the same type of idiocy), but we definitely butted heads pretty regularly in the early years over your obsessions with Mo Taylor, the late Jason Collier, and Jerome Moiso. Good times. To be naive again and think the team seemed headed towards greatness. :( Do you not follow the Rockets anymore? - you seem to confine yourself to this forum.

Yeah, I absolutely loved Mo's post game and offensive efficiency, to the point where I overlooked, well, everything else. In retrospect, that tends to happen when you're 16. :) I still love the Rockets -- freelanced with the Houston Press covering them this past year. But you know my posting style -- when I post a lot, it tends to be in a lot of back-and-forth debates, and the GARM is just so big now that it's tough to have much a sustained conversation before everything gets lost. The Texans/Astros forum is a lot more reasonably sized, and by and large, it's confined to more regular/respected posters as well... so I end up posting here a lot more. I still read the GARM constantly, though.

FLASH21

08-21-2009, 11:43 AM

So.... while all this back & forth was going down with The Cat did anyone ever state exactly who or what we got for Pudge?

I mean I know it's not top notch prospects or anything just trying to see what he netted us and what they've been doing in the minors.

BrooksBall

08-21-2009, 04:09 PM

The Astros appear to have been cursed by the baseball gods. Before he left Houston, Pudge couldn't hit water if he fell out of a boat. On Pudge's first at bat last night, he ignites a 3 run inning for the Rangers and ends up 3-for-4 for the game.

He had a few nights like that for us earlier in the season. With Texas, he'll be getting more rest and will be used more appropriately given his age and the decline in his abilities. There is also often a psychological rejuvenation when you change environments, esp. when you are returning to your old stomping grounds. Pudge is washed up and it's great that we got something for him. It's amazing that a catcher lasted as long as he did. He's a legend but not a good baseball player anymore.