Mock Draft Thread

[Cannonball]

With the draft a month away. I figured we could use a thread to post various mock drafts in. Either our own or ones done by "experts".

Todd McShay's latest mock is based on a scenario where the Lions don't take Matt Stafford. He has us taking Beanie Wells at 15. I don't know if that's better or worse than the mock McShay did that had us taking Mark Sanchez. But in both mocks, he has us using our first pick to take a player at a position where we already have a good starter.

http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/draft09/insider/columns/story?columnist=mcshay_todd&id=4020260

1. Detroit Lions - Jason Smith OT Baylor
2. St. Louis Rams - Michael Crabtree WR Texas Tech
3. Kansas City Chiefs - Aaron Curry OLB Wake Forest
4. Seattle Seahawks - Matt Stafford QB Georgia
5. Cleveland Browns - Brian Orakpo DE Texas
6. Cincinnati Bengals - Eugene Monroe OT Virginia
7. Oakland Raiders - B.J. Raji DT Boston College
8. Jacksonville Jaguars - Mark Sanchez QB USC
9. Green Bay Packers - Aaron Maybin DE Penn State
10. San Francisco 49ers - Andre Smith OT Alabama
11. Buffalo Bills - Everette Brown DE Florida State
12. Denver Broncos - Tyson Jackson DE LSU
13. Washington Redskins - Robert Ayers DE Tennessee
14. New Orleans Saints - Malcolm Jenkins CB Ohio State
15. Houston Texans - Chris Wells RB Ohio State
16. San Diego Chargers - Jeremy Maclin WR Missouri
17. New York Jets - Percy Harvin WR Florida
18. Chicago Bears - Darrius Heyward-Bey WR Maryland
19. Tampa Bay Buccaneers - Josh Freeman QB Penn State
20. Detroit Lions - Brandon Pettigrew TE Oklahoma State
21. Philadelphia Eagles - Michael Oher OT Mississippi
22. Minnesota Vikings - Eben Britton OT Arizona
23. New England Patriots - Clay Matthews OLB USC
24. Atlanta Falcons - Brian Cushing OLB USC
25. Miami Dolphins - Vontae Davis CB Illinois
26. Baltimore Ravens - Rey Maualuga ILB USC
27. Indianapolis Colts - Peria Jerry DT Mississippi
28. Philadelphia Eagles - Knowshon Moreno RB Georgia
29. New York Giants - Hakeem Nicks WR North Carolina
30. Tennessee Titans - Kenny Britt WR Rutgers
31. Arizona Cardinals - Donald Brown RB Connecticut
32. Pittsburgh Steelers - Darius Butler CB Connecticut

[xcrunner51]

that mock draft is ridiculous. He has 6 WR's in the first round, Mark Sanchez in the top 10 and the Texans taking Beanie Wells. No way any of that happens.

[MadMax]

BAYLOR GUY GOES #1!!!! :)

[kaleidosky]

to me, that signifies a definite need to trade down unless someone falls unexpectedly. Mocks can't assume that.. but they also don't want us drafting someone wayyy higher than they should go.

[EddieWasSnubbed]

Good thread...


I don't see how we let all (or any for that matter) of these guys slip by us, while taking Beanie Wells:

Oher
Matthews
Cushing
Davis
Jerry
Malauaga

[DonnyMost]

That is the most ridiculous mock draft I have seen this year.

Maybe ever.

[Castor27]

to me, that signifies a definite need to trade down unless someone falls unexpectedly. Mocks can't assume that.. but they also don't want us drafting someone wayyy higher than they should go.

Agreed. the mock doesn't allow for trades down, and I am pretty sure McShay doesn't really expect Houston to take Wells. The problem is there really isn't anyone else slotted to go near that pick that they would take either. I think you are right on that if that type of scenario happens the Texans will be looking to deal down.

[xcrunner51]

Agreed. the mock doesn't allow for trades down, and I am pretty sure McShay doesn't really expect Houston to take Wells. The problem is there really isn't anyone else slotted to go near that pick that they would take either. I think you are right on that if that type of scenario happens the Texans will be looking to deal down.

If the picks before us went down like McShay thinks, then everyone Eddie listed would be taken before Wells. Our 1st rounder is going to be a starter, no question. We have way too many holes to draft a backup in the 1st.

[EddieWasSnubbed]

That is the most ridiculous mock draft I have seen this year.

Maybe ever.
I just heard Kiper on ESPN say that in order to possibly take Marc Sanchez, the Bucs would have to move up past the Texans and possibly the Jags.

What is this guy smoking? I think his hair is giving off fumes....

Edit: I think Sanchez would be a nice fit in San Fran. I could see him going to the Niners at pick number 10.

My ideal first round would be to trade down about a few spots and pick up one of the following, depending on who's available:

Peria Jerry
Vontae Davis
Malcolm Jenkins(very unlikely he;d be available)
Cushing
Matthews
Malauaga
Oher

Basically, the people I listed above.

Hopefully, by going down those few spots, we can get an extra third.

[No Worries]

17. New York Jets - Percy Harvin WR Florida

Has Harvin's star fallen this much?

Texans will no doubt be drafting defense in the first two rounds.

[arkoe]

I think this guy was on the radio the other day. Someone from ESPN was on at least that had us taking Wells in the first. He said the mock where he had us taking Wells was kind of a shakeup draft for him, and he was looking at this one as a possibility if things didn't go as expected.

Basically I got the impression he was just penciling whoever where ever.

[moestavern19]

17. New York Jets - Percy Harvin WR Florida

Has Harvin's star fallen this much?

Texans will no doubt be drafting defense in the first two rounds.

Harvin wasn't supposed to be a first round pick because he doesn't have a true position.

Now he's a virtual lock to be the likely 3rd WR taken.

[rocketfan83]

We need a bruiser running back but no way in the first round this team isnt deep enough to take backupsthat early.

Also I thought Crabtree was dropping.

This mock draft sucks

[Castor27]

If the picks before us went down like McShay thinks, then everyone Eddie listed would be taken before Wells. Our 1st rounder is going to be a starter, no question. We have way too many holes to draft a backup in the 1st.


I wasn't saying not to take the players Eddie, but that McShay's mock doesn't factor in teams trading down. I don't think he expects Houston to take Wells, but rather he'd expect they would trade down and take a player of need, which is what the person I quoted was saying and also what Eddie says below mine. The guys he lists are guys going in the 20's. If the draft goes according to this or some of the other mocks I have seen the Texans would be reaching to take a need player at their spot. They should be able to trade back and get someone they can use. I think McShay just stuck Wells in there because he really didn't have a fit for him or a fit for the Texans.

[Joe Joe]

I just heard Kiper on ESPN say that in order to possibly take Marc Sanchez, the Bucs would have to move up past the Texans and possibly the Jags.

What is this guy smoking? I think his hair is giving off fumes....

15 is about right for Sanchez. Texans want to trade down. I don't see Sanchez falling past the 15 pick.

[Wakko67]

I quit looking at McShay's once he had us taking Sanchez at 15. I do think we could trade down little bit so someone else can take him there. I think we can do that and still grab Matthews around the 20th pick, but its dicey as his stock is rising. If we can do this and net an extra third or fourth rounder that would be great. I can really see it, especially seeing as a team like Tampa would love to get Sanchez. Here's hoping.

Either way, Wells would be cool, but I highly doubt we're going defense with our pick even if we trade down.

[Jet Blast]

That scenario is based on the Lions not drafting Stafford. Both Kiper and McShay still believe Detroit will draft Stafford.

Here's their draft based on that:

http://proxy.espn.go.com/nfl/draft09/insider/columns/story?id=3972427

Kiper has us drafting Brian Cushing and McShay has us drafting Robert Ayers.

[No Worries]

Harvin wasn't supposed to be a first round pick because he doesn't have a true position.

Now he's a virtual lock to be the likely 3rd WR taken.
From the last two games Harvin played, I was thinking that he had to be a top 5 lock. I guess the football scouts see it different. Go figure.

[Jet Blast]

Here are some mock drafts from the so-called analysts at nfl.com:

Charles Davis (http://www.nfl.com/draft/story?id=09000d5d80f4002b&template=with-video-with-comments&confirm=true)

Charles has us drafting Vontae Davis.

Jamie Dukes (http://www.nfl.com/nflnetwork/story?id=09000d5d80f4a526&template=with-video-with-comments&confirm=true)

Jamie has us drafting Michael Johnson.

Pat Kirwan (http://www.nfl.com/draft/story?id=09000d5d80f53f26&template=with-video-with-comments&confirm=true)

Pat has us drafting Chris Wells.

Steve Wyche (http://www.nfl.com/draft/story?id=09000d5d80f55308&template=with-video-with-comments&confirm=true)

Steve has us drafting Malcolm Jenkins.

[brentdapmp]

There is no such thing as a draft expert. Their guess is as good as mine. I will be shocked if the Texans don't trade back and pick up an extra pick along with a linebacker in the first round assuming Jenkins is off the board at 15.

[Fulgore]

Why when John McClain talks about the Texans picking an OLB in the draft he never mentions Maybin? That guy reminds me of Terrell Suggs but faster and could easily be there at 15.

[Wakko67]

Why when John McClain talks about the Texans picking an OLB in the draft he never mentions Maybin? That guy reminds me of Terrell Suggs but faster and could easily be there at 15.

Don't know, but it seems like the Texans are really big on Matthews. From what I'm hearing about his work ethic and skill, he could be a great addition.

[RocketFan007]

Why when John McClain talks about the Texans picking an OLB in the draft he never mentions Maybin? That guy reminds me of Terrell Suggs but faster and could easily be there at 15.

Because Maybin will play OLB in a 3-4, not a 4-3, he's an undersized DE.

[gucci888]

Why when John McClain talks about the Texans picking an OLB in the draft he never mentions Maybin? That guy reminds me of Terrell Suggs but faster and could easily be there at 15.

Maybin is a DE/3-4 OLB who really didn't perform as well as some expected at the combine/pro day. If the Texans are looking at OLB, both Cushing and Matthews should be available at #15 and would be able to step right in as a 4-3 OLB and contribute.

[Fulgore]

Maybin is a DE/3-4 OLB who really didn't perform as well as some expected at the combine/pro day. If the Texans are looking at OLB, both Cushing and Matthews should be available at #15 and would be able to step right in as a 4-3 OLB and contribute.All that combine junk is so overrated. He weighs 248 so im not sure why they call him under size. I know the Big 10 is weak that guy was a beast as far as putting pressure on the qb. Most mocks dont even have Matthews going in the 1st rd.

[rhino17]

All that combine junk is so overrated. He weighs 248 so im not sure why they call him under size. I know the Big 10 is weak that guy was a beast as far as putting pressure on the qb. Most mocks dont even have Matthews going in the 1st rd.
what mock drafts have you been looking at?

[rpr52121]

All that combine junk is so overrated. He weighs 248 so im not sure why they call him under size. I know the Big 10 is weak that guy was a beast as far as putting pressure on the qb. Most mocks dont even have Matthews going in the 1st rd.

I read a lot of scouts thought he was way too inconsistent this year especially given the pressure the scouts had on him this year. That knock on him is causing him to drop, along with the combine even though the combine values and docking someone for one afternoon is incredibly capricious.

[Bruins&RedSox21]

Not to hijack the thread, but what is you guy's take on Clay Matthews? There's been a lot of talk on how he could be the 1st round selection for the Texans, but I think he's vastly overrated. Could we be doing better with Cushing? Personally, I think Vontae Davis or Malcolm Jenkins needs to be drafted ASAP if available. Patrick Chung or Willaim Moore in the 2nd round?

[bottlerocket]

Texans will trade down so someone can grab Mark "dirty" Sanchez.

[Wooderson]

Not to hijack the thread, but what is you guy's take on Clay Matthews? There's been a lot of talk on how he could be the 1st round selection for the Texans, but I think he's vastly overrated. Could we be doing better with Cushing? Personally, I think Vontae Davis or Malcolm Jenkins needs to be drafted ASAP if available. Patrick Chung or Willaim Moore in the 2nd round?

I think that the current thought on Matthews vs. Cushing is that Matthews has a better work ethic and much more upside, whereas Cushing may already be as good as he is going to get. I think that either one would work, but in the long run Matthews may just fit the Texans system better.

I don't know if I could draft him if Jenkins is still on the board, tho - that guy is going to be good. I guess if Jenkins is available they'll have to justifiy taking him with 4 CBs already on the team when they could get an instant starter at the OLB position.

[Fulgore]

what mock drafts have you been looking at?Just various mock drafts on the net. Not sure if they pull any weight but this time of the year its a ton of them out. A few even had Beanie Wells coming here.

[Wooderson]

Just various mock drafts on the net. Not sure if they pull any weight but this time of the year its a ton of them out. A few even had Beanie Wells coming here.

What are the dates on the Mocks you're talking about? I've seen some online that haven't been updated since February or early March. I could see those not having a guy like Matthews. I think at this point he's pretty much locked in the first round, tho.

Oh, and good rule of thumb - instantly dismiss any mock that has us going offense in round one! ;)

[Fulgore]

What are the dates on the Mocks you're talking about? I've seen some online that haven't been updated since February or early March. I could see those not having a guy like Matthews. I think at this point he's pretty much locked in the first round, tho.

Oh, and good rule of thumb - instantly dismiss any mock that has us going offense in round one! ;)Dates were early March. Slim chance we go offense in the 1st rd but I wouldnt be upset at all if Kubiak shocked us with Beanie Wells.That would be one hell of a backfield.

[Dubious]

Todd seems to be rational in this version:

Cutler deal shakes up first round
USC QB Mark Sanchez becomes hot prospect in wake of big trade
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USC QB Mark Sanchez stands to benefit most from the Jay Cutler-to-Chicago deal. The Broncos just traded away their franchise quarterback and Sanchez has the quick release, accuracy and gym-rat mentality that Josh McDaniels looks for in his signal caller. If Denver is targeting the former Trojan as Cutler's eventual replacement, it is in no position to sit back and hope Sanchez falls to pick No. 12. The team would need to take advantage of its newfound ammunition and move up to secure Cutler's long-term successor.

I believe Kyle Orton should be nothing more than a bridge-the-gap solution. But McDaniels may completely disagree. Remember, he's been a part of the development process of Tom Brady and Matt Cassel. Right or wrong, McDaniels has to believe he can turn Orton into a similar marvel. So it shouldn't be a surprise if Denver opts to use its two first round picks (12 and 18) on its defensive front-seven and possibly even a stud running back. Regardless of McDaniels' actual intentions, teams in the market for Sanchez -- or any of the top-three quarterbacks for that matter -- must now consider the Broncos a legitimate competitor.

The threat of Seattle pulling the trigger on Sanchez is fascinating. Of course, St. Louis (pick No. 2) and Kansas City (No. 3) will look to exploit the situation by putting their all-of-a-sudden attractive top-five draft picks up for public auction. The same goes for Cleveland (No. 5), Cincinnati (No. 6) and Oakland (No. 7) should Sanchez last through the first four picks, but Jacksonville at pick No. 8 becomes the next threat.

With that in mind; here's one opinion on how the first round could unfold:

1. Detroit Lions (Record: 0-16): Matthew Stafford, QB, Georgia

2. St. Louis Rams (2-14): Jason Smith, OT, Baylor

3. Kansas City Chiefs (2-14): Aaron Curry, LB, Wake Forest

4. Seattle Seahawks (4-12): Eugene Monroe, OT, Virginia

5. Cleveland Browns (4-12): Brian Orakpo, DE/OLB, Texas

6. Cincinnati Bengals (4-11-1): Andre Smith, OT, Alabama

7. Oakland Raiders (5-11): Jeremy Maclin, WR, Missouri

8. Jacksonville Jaguars (5-11): Michael Crabtree, WR, Texas Tech

9. Green Bay Packers (6-10): B.J. Raji, DT, Boston College

10. San Francisco 49ers (7-9): Aaron Maybin, DE, Penn State

11. Buffalo Bills (7-9): Everette Brown, DE, Florida State

12. Denver Broncos (8-8): Mark Sanchez, QB, USC

13. Washington Redskins (8-8): Robert Ayers, DE, Tennessee

14. New Orleans Saints (8-8): Chris "Beanie" Wells, RB, Ohio State

15. Houston Texans (8-8): Malcolm Jenkins, CB, Ohio State

16. San Diego Chargers (8-8): Michael Oher, OT, Mississippi

http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/draft09/insider/columns/story?columnist=mcshay_todd&id=4037988&action=login&appRedirect=http%3a%2f%2finsider.espn.go.com%2fnfl%2fdraft09%2finsider%2fcolumns%2fstory%3fcolumnist%3dmcshay_todd%26id%3d4037988

[rhino17]

I am happy with Jenkins

[right1]

Not to hijack the thread, but what is you guy's take on Clay Matthews? There's been a lot of talk on how he could be the 1st round selection for the Texans, but I think he's vastly overrated. Could we be doing better with Cushing? Personally, I think Vontae Davis or Malcolm Jenkins needs to be drafted ASAP if available. Patrick Chung or Willaim Moore in the 2nd round?


So...you're a Boston Bruins and Red Sox fan....and a Rockets and Texans fan :confused: ?

[Bruins&RedSox21]

So...you're a Boston Bruins and Red Sox fan....and a Rockets and Texans fan :confused: ?
Yes, actually. And it has nothing to do with bandwagon. If you like to me explain / give my story, I'd be certainly happy to. :cool:

[Dubious]

I am happy with Jenkins

Pro Days wrap: Who helped their stock, hurt it, still has questions


• Malcolm Jenkins, CB, Ohio State: After posting only marginal times in the 40-yard dash at the combine (4.54), Jenkins was unable to solve the dilemma as to what pro position he fits best at with more marginal times in Columbus, registering 4.58 and 4.54 second times.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/story/11588632/rss


If you love mocks the best way to look at them really is on a Mock Muncher that factors in a bunch of mocks to get a consensus. I like to look at them and look 4 or 5 spots under our picks to see what the alternative picks might be.

http://www.thejetsblog.com/mockdraft/

I really think the Texans will trade down but Sanchez will not drop past #12 to Denver, in fact they will probably trade up from 12 to get him.

I know the conventional wisdom is Defense defense defense but how can you pass on Beanie Wells?

• Chris "Beanie" Wells, RB, Ohio State: The 6-1, 235-pound Wells answered any questions that were raised at the combine (4.59) about his straight-line speed in exactly 4.38 seconds. Though scouts still question his toughness and consistency, his blend of size and speed could lead to a selection in the top 10.

Especially when the Mucher has us taking Conner Barwin with the #46 that addresses the OLB and speed rusher needs in one guy. (not to mention primo special teamer and goal line H-back blocker)

[moestavern19]

The draft is virtually impossible to predict past the first half of the first round.

Seems to me like the Texans could use a Vontae Davis or Malcolm Jenkins.


The Raiders are not taking Maclin though, I guarantee it.

[Fulgore]

Wells ran a 4.38???? Didnt realize he could move like that. He will be a Larry Johnson type only faster.

[Refman]

BAYLOR GUY GOES #1!!!! :)
Yet another sign that the guy making that mock draft is smoking something interesting. :)

[Dubious]

I agree we need someone like Jenkins or Davis, they could add a lot when we have to face 4 wides and be Dunta insurance but they don't seem worth a #15, Jenkins maybe but being a tweener and us being stocked with at least average talent at CB and S, maybe not.

The reason I'm jumping on the Beanie wagon is I just don't want to pass on taking a playmaker in the top half of the first round. He and Slaton could be a relentless run game and that free's up coverage for AJ.

Ahh, we're gonna trade down anyway. We can get somebody like Sean Smith and another pick instead of Jenkins.

[EddieWasSnubbed]

Well's would be a great addition, no doubt he would be good change of pace from Slaton. I just don't see a team that has a pro-bowl quality running back(albeit, based on one season), and a horrible secondary taking the running back with their first round pick.

I really like the running back from Colorado State as a late round change of pace guy (thanks to Moes for bringing him to my attention.)

Question to Moes, who do you see the Raiders going after?

[H-Town Info]

Please for goodness sakes that we don't draft Wells. I think he's going to biggest bust in this draft.

I really think they'll go after Jenkins hard now and I think this might spell the end for Dunta.

[EddieWasSnubbed]

Please for goodness sakes that we don't draft Wells. I think he's going to biggest bust in this draft.

I really think they'll go after Jenkins hard now and I think this might spell the end for Dunta.
It would be too bad if that did. I would love to see a combo of Jenkins and Dunta for years to come. I hope this team doesn't let ANY productive young defensive player go.

[moestavern19]

Question to Moes, who do you see the Raiders going after?

I think they will take somebody defensively. Since we are set at corner, Curry will be gone by 7, and no safeties are worth taking until later... that would mean they must be looking at the D-line, where Orakpo and Raji come into play. Orakpo is gonna be gone by 5, so logically you think maybe Raji is the guy they want... but honestly who the hell knows when Al is running things.

Maclin would just seem like a stupid pick.

[The Cat]

Maclin would just seem like a stupid pick.

Until you follow it up by taking Chase in the 5th/6th, then you'll really have something there... :eek:

[XBLRocketman111]

I'm hoping we can get davis at 15 but i think he goes at 14 to NO. If not gotta get Jenkins.

[DonnyMost]

raiders signed garcia...

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=4047125

[DieHard Rocket]

raiders signed garcia...

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=4047125

That should end well.

[Dubious]

The local perspective on the Garcia deal:

http://www.mercurynews.com/breakingnews/ci_12082745

[moestavern19]

That should end well.


Why? Signing a veteran backup is a bad thing?

:rolleyes:


Andrew Walter and Bruce Gradkowski were the backups before this signing.

Those guys should be in the Indoor Football League.

[moestavern19]

PFT is saying that the Lions could possibly forfeit the 1st overall pick and just let the clock run out and pick maybe 2nd or 3rd instead.

It is a perfectly legal move since no one has really attempted giving up draft position without compensation before.

Just shows how stupid the current top pick salaries are.

They need to be scaled like in the NBA.

[EddieWasSnubbed]

PFT is saying that the Lions could possibly forfeit the 1st overall pick and just let the clock run out and pick maybe 2nd or 3rd instead.

It is a perfectly legal move since no one has really attempted giving up draft position without compensation before.

Just shows how stupid the current top pick salaries are.

They need to be scaled like in the NBA.
How does this work? If they simply don't pick, they can pick whenever they feel like it? They should just try and trade the pick really cheap...

Trade it to the Rams or Chiefs, make a deal that they don't pick who you want, and pick up an extra 4th rounder or so for it....


By the way, I like the Garcia signing. I could see him probably starting over JaMarcus. Not that Russell is bad, but they need more pieces around him. It would be nice to see Crabtree fall to the Raiders, as I think he and JaMarcus would be a nice pair to build on.



I can't wait for this season! Aren't the schedule dates coming out soon? I hope we play Buffalo early in the season. I don't want to have to sit through another 20-degrees or less game....

[moestavern19]

How does this work? If they simply don't pick, they can pick whenever they feel like it? They should just try and trade the pick really cheap...

Trade it to the Rams or Chiefs, make a deal that they don't pick who you want, and pick up an extra 4th rounder or so for it....


By the way, I like the Garcia signing. I could see him probably starting over JaMarcus. Not that Russell is bad, but they need more pieces around him. It would be nice to see Crabtree fall to the Raiders, as I think he and JaMarcus would be a nice pair to build on.



I can't wait for this season! Aren't the schedule dates coming out soon? I hope we play Buffalo early in the season. I don't want to have to sit through another 20-degrees or less game....


Why would the Rams or Chiefs want to move up to #1 and pay a guy #1 pick money when they probably would be happy ending up with any of the guys in the top 5?

This is what happens when there isn't a clear cut #1 selection.


edit -- heres the article...

http://www.profootballtalk.com/2009/04/07/league-says-lions-can-pass-on-the-first-pick/

League Says Lions Can Pass On The First Pick
Posted by Mike Florio on April 7, 2009, 8:41 a.m. EDT

With the more-needs-than-one-player-could-ever-fill Lions holding the first overall pick in a year with no obvious candidate worthy of being the initial name called, the question is coming up again.

What if the team with the No. 1 overall pick in the draft chooses not to use it?

Last year, rumors swirled that the Dolphins might do just that. Yours truly devoted an entire SportingNews.com column to the topic of whether V.P. of football operations Bill Parcells should allow the allotment of time to expire, if for no reason other than to prove a point.

In the end, Parcells opted to take Michigan tackle Jake Long, signing him to a contract before the draft began.

This year, some are suggesting that the pro football team based in Michigan should decide not to exercise their prerogative to pick first. Last week, Ross Tucker of SI.com made the case for the post-Millen regime to shake things up by not submitting a name.

Tom Kowalski of Mlive.com reports that, indeed, it would be a legitimate move, if the Lions were to choose to do it.

“It has never been an issue,” league spokesman Greg Aiello told Kowalski. “There is no penalty for passing, other than losing a higher pick.”

In our view, however, it would create a mess when it comes to sorting out player contracts. If the Lions were to pass and the Rams were to pick first and then the Lions were to pick before the Chiefs could submit a card at No. 3, the agent for the player selected by the Rams would crow that his client was the first overall pick. In turn, the agent for the player picked by the Lions would claim that his client is the true No. 1 pick, since the Lions have used this unprecedented tactic (but for the Vikings’ blunder in 2003) merely to avoid paying a fair and just sum to the player they picked.

Then there’s the potential P.R. fallout. Even if the media explains that the Lions passed as part of a purposeful plan, some fans and media types would criticize them harshly for letting the Rams cut the line (a la Banya at the soup stand) — and it would only get worse if the player the Rams pick ends up being a stud, and if the one the Lions land becomes a bust.

So while it’s an intriguing issue to ponder, the tactic of not exercising the first pick in the draft could ultimately cause more problems than it ever solves. For a franchise that already has more than its fair share of problems, then, it might make sense to stick with convention.

[DonnyMost]

PFT is saying that the Lions could possibly forfeit the 1st overall pick and just let the clock run out and pick maybe 2nd or 3rd instead.

It is a perfectly legal move since no one has really attempted giving up draft position without compensation before.

Just shows how stupid the current top pick salaries are.

They need to be scaled like in the NBA.

That would be freaking brilliant and hilarious.

[EddieWasSnubbed]

Why would the Rams or Chiefs want to move up to #1 when they probably would be happy ending up with any of the guys in the top 5?

This is what happens when there isn't a clear cut #1 selection.
Good point.... :D


I know I remember seeing the Lions were unsure of Stafford, but it would be too ironic if they screw this draft up, don't draft him, and he turns into a perennial all-pro. Not saying the kid is going to be a star, because I haven't seen him play much, but most seem to think he's pretty worthy of number one. I think Sanchez could end up better than Stafford, though.


So, how does the not picking thing work?

[DonnyMost]

So, how does the not picking thing work?

It just cascades I think.

If the Lions don't pick, then the people behind them get the #1 pick, and so on, and so on, until someone finally picks.

If the first 3 teams don't pull the trigger for fear of having to commit to #1 pick money, then it just becomes a free for all for the pick order after that.

I, personally, would love to see that. It would be a classic owners rebellion against inflated salaries.

[moestavern19]

Good point.... :D


I know I remember seeing the Lions were unsure of Stafford, but it would be too ironic if they screw this draft up, don't draft him, and he turns into a perennial all-pro. Not saying the kid is going to be a star, because I haven't seen him play much, but most seem to think he's pretty worthy of number one. I think Sanchez could end up better than Stafford, though.


So, how does the not picking thing work?


As soon as the time runs out on that little clock... if an official draft card hasn't been submitted... the team who is up next can quickly submit their draft card instead and their pick would by rule be counted as that selection.

If you remember the 2003 draft when the Texans drafted Andre Johnson, this happened with the Minnesota Vikings who held the 7th selection but didn't pick in the allotted time... Jacksonville held the 8th pick and Carolina who held the 9th pick both submitted their picks before Minnesota got around to picking, so Jacksonville ended up picking 7th (Byron Leftwich) Carolina 8th (Jordan Gross) and Minnesota 9th (Kevin Williams)

Minnesota still ended up with an All-pro DT, and Leftwich wasn't on their board anyway... so it probably ended up saving them a bit of money in the long run. There was a controversy with Williams' agent though who thought Williams should have been given 7th overall pick money.

[DieHard Rocket]

Why? Signing a veteran backup is a bad thing?

:rolleyes:


Andrew Walter and Bruce Gradkowski were the backups before this signing.

Those guys should be in the Indoor Football League.

Not that it's a bad thing, but I doubt Garcia is going to be happy all season as a backup. I'm sure he looked at Oakland and figured it would be the easiest chance to take over (at least of the teams that might have had interest in him). And Garcia isn't exactly one to keep quiet and accept his role if he's not happy with it. The last thing the Raiders need is more distraction.

All of that, and he and JaMarcus have drastically different styles. It's not like they can just plug him in and not miss a beat.

[Raven Lunatic]

Minnesota still ended up with an All-pro DT, and Leftwich wasn't on their board anyway... so it probably ended up saving them a bit of money in the long run. There was a controversy with Williams' agent though who thought Williams should have been given 7th overall pick money.

This is the biggest flaw in the plan to let the pick slip. Granted it isn't a very strong bargaining position to state that your guy "should have been #1" but was just allowed to slip for money reasons, but as the article above stated, it seems like it could create more problems than it really saves.

Man, it must suck to be a Detroit fan. You suffer through the worst season ever and don't even have sure-fire stud waiting for you at the top of the draft class.

[moestavern19]

Not that it's a bad thing, but I doubt Garcia is going to be happy all season as a backup. I'm sure he looked at Oakland and figured it would be the easiest chance to take over (at least of the teams that might have had interest in him). And Garcia isn't exactly one to keep quiet and accept his role if he's not happy with it. The last thing the Raiders need is more distraction.

All of that, and he and JaMarcus have drastically different styles. It's not like they can just plug him in and not miss a beat.


Garcia grew up in the Bay Area and lives there... nobody offered him a starting gig.

He's 40 years old and Russell is 40 million dollars invested.

Its not a question of who is gonna be starting, its an insurance policy.

[Dubious]

I think the one team that could possibly, maybe, consider a move up to #1 would be the Broncos to take Sanchez. They have picks to play with. But I think they would want to have an understanding with his agent to do it.

They can probably get him at whatever number he comes up with 2 #1's and might still have him available at 12 IF Stafford is picked.

And having two starting quarterbacks is divisive. It's natural for old vets to want old vets to play if they think he's the best chance to win now. And it's Garcia's will and ego that got him where he's been. He's going to rip sinews in the weight room to show he's better than The Kid.

[moestavern19]

Of course internal competition makes better football players, so its technically a good thing when you have 2 guys vying for the gig instead of 1 guy who isn't mentally capable yet of handling everything that goes along with being "the guy"

Garcia has enough left in the tank to step in and take over...

this is phase 2 in Cable's "light a fire under JaMarcus' ass" program.


I like what they are doing for once. Cable played his cards right so far, he's said everything he'd needed to say to get more control of the team (i.e. Raider pride, this is where I want to be, I love Al blah blah blah)

Big contrast from Kiffin who tried to come in there and act brash like he knew what he was doing.

[JLEW1818]

Stafford is going number 1. get over it.

[moestavern19]

Stafford is going number 1. get over it.


What are you? His cousin?

[DonnyMost]

Of course internal competition makes better football players, so its technically a good thing when you have 2 guys vying for the gig instead of 1 guy who isn't mentally capable yet of handling everything that goes along with being "the guy"

Garcia has enough left in the tank to step in and take over...

this is phase 2 in Cable's "light a fire under JaMarcus' ass" program.


This is what I suggested we do for Carr going into year 3-4... but Charlie Pallilo laughed at me.. jerk :mad:

[moestavern19]

This is what I suggested we do for Carr going into year 3-4... but Charlie Pallilo laughed at me.. jerk :mad:

Charlie Pallilo laughs at mere mortals?

Who knew.

[Raven Lunatic]

Garcia grew up in the Bay Area and lives there... nobody offered him a starting gig.

He's 40 years old and Russell is 40 million dollars invested.

Its not a question of who is gonna be starting, its an insurance policy.

Plus Garcia is a homo and the West coast is populated by nothing BUT homos. You only just narrowly saved yourself by moving to Houston.

[Dubious]

Stafford is going number 1. get over it.

You understand the risks right?

The Detroit franchise is the laughing stock of the NFL and has been for ...
I don 't know, how long was Matt Milan in charge? If they take Stafford #1 commit that cap killing #1 money and he busts, they have no chance to regain any respectability for another 5 years.

The crevasse is 10 feet wide and 1000 feet deep; do you jump?



Well, bi maybe.
http://usversusthem.files.wordpress.com/2007/09/jeff_garcia_and_carmella_de.jpg

[noscrusir]

I wouldn't mind taking WR Jeremy Maclin at 15 if Jenkins is gone. He's probably the BPA at that point and has great speed, allowing Walter to move to the slot. Having a nice upgrade at the return position couldn't hurt either.

It just seems Maclin would have as much an impact to help us win games as any other defensive player available at that point if Jenkins is gone.

[Mike Hunt]

I have a feeling that the Lions will trade down. I dont think there is a significant difference between Sanchez and Stafford and frankly, I think Sanchez will pan out to be better and maybe the Lions think this way as well

[DonnyMost]

I have a feeling that the Lions will trade down. I dont think there is a significant difference between Sanchez and Stafford and frankly, I think Sanchez will pan out to be better and maybe the Lions think this way as well

I think the Lions want to.

However, I don't think anyone else wants to BE #1.

Unless the Lions give up a lot to move down...

[DieHard Rocket]

I think the Lions want to.

However, I don't think anyone else wants to BE #1.

Unless the Lions give up a lot to move down...

Yeah, very strange year. It's almost like they would have to pay more to move DOWN than teams would have to pay them to move UP.

But if they could get anything at all in return to move down to the 10th-15th pick range for their #1 I think they'd be smart to do it. I don't think Stafford will be that much better than Sanchez either so why pay him number one type money?

[msn]

Yeah, very strange year. It's almost like they would have to pay more to move DOWN than teams would have to pay them to move UP.
If that's really true, then is the #1 pick really a #1 pick?

That, and they *have* to get this insane draft money thing worked out. The #15 pick this year, and unproven rook who's never played a down of NFL ball, will make more than Demeco Freaking Ryans.

It's out of control.

[gucci888]

If that's really true, then is the #1 pick really a #1 pick?

That, and they *have* to get this insane draft money thing worked out. The #15 pick this year, and unproven rook who's never played a down of NFL ball, will make more than Demeco Freaking Ryans.

It's out of control.

I believe that is one of the high priority issues for Goodell. The amount of money these kids are making is ridiculous, having the #1 pick is almost becoming a burden. You're rarely going to see a team trade up for the #1 pick just because of the amount of money you going to have to pay.

[No Worries]

I think the Lions want to.

However, I don't think anyone else wants to BE #1.

Unless the Lions give up a lot to move down...
Would the Lions take the Texans #1 and one of their #4s to swap #1s?

[Dubious]

As a certifiable draft junkie I've already been looking at 5 round mocks and this really seems like an off year generally. I know you can't say that and no one knows for three years after the draft but there aren't a lot of guys that I'm plotting for in the mid rounds like most years. Linebackers and OL's seem pretty deep but WR and CB seem lacking. Even Jenkins and Davis ran over 4.5's. There are 4 or 5 serviceable RB's but no Chris Johnson/Bush/Felix Jones types. Last year had 4 or 5 of those 6'3, 6'4" receivers and I don't see any this year.

I wonder if some owners are willing to let draftee's hold out to make a point and reset the draft contract values.

[DonnyMost]

I believe that is one of the high priority issues for Goodell. The amount of money these kids are making is ridiculous, having the #1 pick is almost becoming a burden. You're rarely going to see a team trade up for the #1 pick just because of the amount of money you going to have to pay.

Kind of makes you think twice about tanking the season too. No wonder owners say they are going to try to win every game :D

[moestavern19]

As a certifiable draft junkie I've already been looking at 5 round mocks and this really seems like an off year generally. I know you can't say that and no one knows for three years after the draft but there aren't a lot of guys that I'm plotting for in the mid rounds like most years. Linebackers and OL's seem pretty deep but WR and CB seem lacking. Even Jenkins and Davis ran over 4.5's. There are 4 or 5 serviceable RB's but no Chris Johnson/Bush/Felix Jones types. Last year had 4 or 5 of those 6'3, 6'4" receivers and I don't see any this year.

I wonder if some owners are willing to let draftee's hold out to make a point and reset the draft contract values.


No kidding, there were a lot of RB studs in last years' draft. This year there is barely a back worth taking.

I think Rashad Jennings out of Liberty is going to be a steal for whoever gets him though.

[percicles]

Denver should pick up the best available or trade down for picks next year.

Same with the Texans.

Why? 2010 might be the sickest draft this decade.

2010 Mock Draft (http://walterfootball.com/draft2010.php)

[Wooderson]

I think that the ultimate goal of the #1 pick is to get the maximum value over the longest period of time, and that will often mean to pass over the flashier players.

When looking at Stafford vs. Sanchez, trying to determine which will be the better pro QB, I don't see a discussion of future hall of famer vs. future hall of famer. I don't even see Manning vs. Leaf.

Stafford and Sanchez are Carr & Harrington all over again. They will not turn a depleted team like Detroit around any time soon as neither can do it on their own.

Detroit has to rebuild, so with this #1 pick they should take the guy who will have the most potential to be a long-term part of the foundation: and that guy is Jason Smith. O-Linemen may not get the Gatorade contracts, but they open the holes and protect the pocket so that other guys at the QB and RB spots get those endorsements.

If they are dead-set on a QB, then they really need to trade down and get more picks. I just see so many other players in this draft that will mean more to the Lions than Stafford or Sanchez.

[gucci888]

I think that the ultimate goal of the #1 pick is to get the maximum value over the longest period of time, and that will often mean to pass over the flashier players.

When looking at Stafford vs. Sanchez, trying to determine which will be the better pro QB, I don't see a discussion of future hall of famer vs. future hall of famer. I don't even see Manning vs. Leaf.

Stafford and Sanchez are Carr & Harrington all over again. They will not turn a depleted team like Detroit around any time soon as neither can do it on their own.

Detroit has to rebuild, so with this #1 pick they should take the guy who will have the most potential to be a long-term part of the foundation: and that guy is Jason Smith. O-Linemen may not get the Gatorade contracts, but they open the holes and protect the pocket so that other guys at the QB and RB spots get those endorsements.

If they are dead-set on a QB, then they really need to trade down and get more picks. I just see so many other players in this draft that will mean more to the Lions than Stafford or Sanchez.

I'm not a big fan of Stafford or Sanchez but they need a QB really bad. They're probably going to use the same blueprint as the Falcons used last year by using their first 1st rounder on a QB (Stafford) and using their #20 pick on a OT (Oher could be available). If they can grab these 2 players, they will have a very nice foundation for their offense.

No one person, whether its Jason Smith or Stafford, will be able to turn the Lions around right off the back. They just have too many holes on both sides of the ball, but I think getting a QB and OT in the first would be a good start.

[Wooderson]

I'm not a big fan of Stafford or Sanchez but they need a QB really bad. They're probably going to use the same blueprint as the Falcons used last year by using their first 1st rounder on a QB (Stafford) and using their #20 pick on a OT (Oher could be available). If they can grab these 2 players, they will have a very nice foundation for their offense.

No one person, whether its Jason Smith or Stafford, will be able to turn the Lions around right off the back. They just have too many holes on both sides of the ball, but I think getting a QB and OT in the first would be a good start.

You know - I keep forgetting that they have the #20 pick as well. I can't deny that would be a good plan, but I still think that they may be able to trade down and still get one of the QBs.

[rocketman101]

im going to ruffle a few feathers with this post...im pretty sure no one will agree with me...well i dont want a rb in the first becuz its to early,plus they are a huge injury risk, set on OL and i dont trust any dl except orakpo..

i also think its to early and risky for a cb in first...i like safety with first pick, but there isnt a safety worthy of 15

that leads to lb, which, i dont trust any of the usc lb (long story) and we have demeaco

so that leads to qb, i like shaub(is that how you spell it) but he is so freakin injury prone its a joke

im REALLY surprised we didnt trade for cutler...

i would love to have vince young as a backup..

but anyways, i want mark sanchez or freeman with the 15#...haha see i told you i would ruffle feathers

[nWo34Life]

Mel Kiper has us picking the following according to Paul Kuharsky, ESPN:

No. 15: Linebacker Brian Cushing, USC
No. 46: Defensive tackle Evander Hood, Missouri
No. 77: Cornerback Keenan Lewis, Oregon State
No. 112: Defensive end David Veikune, Hawaii
No. 122: Receiver Mike Thomas, Arizona

No RB. Interesting....

[Rookie34]

The Mock Draft 2009 of Jeff Risdon (RealGM): Version 8.0

First round:
15. Malcolm Jenkins, CB, Ohio State.
Every Texans fan's wildest dreams (football-related anyways) comes true, as a player some rate as the best defensive player in this draft falls all the way to #15. Houston is coming off a run where they allowed the highest opposing passer rating over a 3-year period in NFL history, and they addressed the pass rush part with Antonio Smith. This scenario seems implausible the more I look at it, but stranger things have happened.

Second round:
46. Brandon Tate, WR, North Carolina

Third round:
77. Patrick Chung, S, Oregon

http://football.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/11674/20090409/2009_nfl_mock_draft_version_80/

I would love this! I was a little surprised with Tate in the second round, but why not?

[Chamillionaire]

The Mock Draft 2009 of Jeff Risdon (RealGM): Version 8.0

First round:
15. Malcolm Jenkins, CB, Ohio State.
Every Texans fan's wildest dreams (football-related anyways) comes true, as a player some rate as the best defensive player in this draft falls all the way to #15. Houston is coming off a run where they allowed the highest opposing passer rating over a 3-year period in NFL history, and they addressed the pass rush part with Antonio Smith. This scenario seems implausible the more I look at it, but stranger things have happened.

Second round:
46. Brandon Tate, WR, North Carolina

Third round:
77. Patrick Chung, S, Oregon

http://football.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/11674/20090409/2009_nfl_mock_draft_version_80/

I would love this! I was a little surprised with Tate in the second round, but why not?

if we could get jenkins or wells at that 15, it would make my day. we can draft a LB with a later pick.

[Dubious]

Mel Kiper has us picking the following according to Paul Kuharsky, ESPN:

No RB. Interesting....

And wrong. I have to think that with one of the two picks in the fourth round The Texans will take the complimentary 'big' back. There are a few of them in this draft.

And if they don't in the fourth look out in 5 or 6 six for ........

Jorvorskie Lane The ultimate complimentary big back

[danny317]

And wrong. I have to think that with one of the two picks in the fourth round The Texans will take the complimentary 'big' back. There are a few of them in this draft.

And if they don't in the fourth look out in 5 or 6 six for ........

Jorvorskie Lane The ultimate complimentary big back

i dont know about lane. he looks like he'll eat himself out of the nfl.

[nWo34Life]

And wrong. I have to think that with one of the two picks in the fourth round The Texans will take the complimentary 'big' back. There are a few of them in this draft.

And if they don't in the fourth look out in 5 or 6 six for ........

Jorvorskie Lane The ultimate complimentary big back

I want a big back who can run like Slaton, but who can knock down people like Vonta Leach.....any backs in the draft who can do that?

[moestavern19]

I want a big back who can run like Slaton, but who can knock down people like Vonta Leach.....any backs in the draft who can do that?

Gartrell Johnson is a guy they are eyeing I'm sure.

He's a bit bigger back compared to Slaton (220 compared to 200) and he's been in a ZBS scheme at Colorado State. He also probably won't be looked at until the 5th round or so at the earliest and might even not be drafted at all since he isn't rated as a top 10 RB.

Rashad Jennings is another option. He's out of tiny Liberty but he's a freak of nature (6'1 230) with good speed and power. He'll probably be a 3rd or 4th round pick, same range as Javon Ringer or Glenn Coffee.

also Ian Johnson had a pretty prestigious career at Boise State, he'll get a look in the later rounds as well.


Also, Kiper is smoking crack rocks if he thinks Mike Thomas (WR, Arizona) will last until the middle of the 4th. He's regarded as the best slot receiver in the draft.

[SamCassell]

I want a big back who can run like Slaton, but who can knock down people like Vonta Leach.....any backs in the draft who can do that?
Bo Jackson is a free agent, but he's a little old.

[xcrunner51]

Denver should pick up the best available or trade down for picks next year.

Same with the Texans.

Why? 2010 might be the sickest draft this decade.

2010 Mock Draft (http://walterfootball.com/draft2010.php)

I agree that those are some sick players but that mock draft has too few skill players in the 1st round. I can't imagine every team is going to take an OT, LB or DB in the first round.

[gucci888]

McClain's Newest Mock:

1 Detroit Matthew Stafford, QB, Georgia

2 St. Louis Jason Smith, OT, Baylor

3 Kansas City Aaron Curry, OLB, Wake Forest

4 Seattle Mark Sanchez, QB, USC

5 Cleveland Brian Orakpo, OLB, Texas

6 Cincinnati Eugene Monroe, OT, Virginia

7 Oakland Michael Crabtree, WR, Texas Tech

8 Jacksonville Jeremy Maclin, WR, Missouri

9 Green Bay B.J. Raji, NT, Boston College

10 San Francisco Everette Brown, DE, Florida State

11 Buffalo Aaron Maybin, DE, Penn State

12 Denver Rey Maualuga, ILB, USC

13 Washington Andre Smith, OT, Alabama

14 New Orleans Malcolm Jenkins, CB, Ohio State

15 Houston Clay Matthews, OLB, USC

Matthews can play either side. He can rush, stop the run or drop into coverage. He's smart and has an incredible work ethic. Hopefully, the report about him and USC teammate Brian Cushing testing positive for steroids at the combine won't be true.

http://blogs.chron.com/nfl/2009/04/check_out_my_latest_mock_draft.html


Not too bad. I'd be really suprised if the Seahawks take Sanchez, Walter Jones is 35 and Monroe would be a much better pickup rather than reaching for QB.

Also, McClain seems so deadset on Matthews but I'm not so sure they would pass on Cushing if they went for one of the USC OLBs.

[Fulgore]

It seems McClain is putting on his mock who he wants the Texans to draft rather than who they will take. I think with the Cato June pickup they will take either Vontae Davis or Jenkins in the 1st and go after OLB in the 2nd

[juicystream]

19. Tampa Bay Buccaneers - Josh Freeman QB Penn State

Kansas State :confused: :p

[gucci888]

It seems McClain is putting on his mock who he wants the Texans to draft rather than who they will take. I think with the Cato June pickup they will take either Vontae Davis or Jenkins in the 1st and go after OLB in the 2nd

Agreed, Davis or Jenkins would be an upgrade over Reeves/Bennett and would be insurance in case things don't work out with Dunta. With that said, I don't think Jenkins will make it past the Saints, they need a CB bad.

Cato June only signed a 1-year deal so if Cushing/Matthews happens to be the best defensive player available, I could see them pulling the trigger on one of them, especially considering Diles still isn't able to practice.