Starting 5...

[Aggie 99]

Does it even matter who the starting five will be?

I have to believe that besides T-mac and Yao, Aledman is going to play everyone else (Rafer, Head, James, Scola, Battier, Steve, and Bonzi about the same amount of time). I just love the fact that we can play with just about any style from any team.

This is the most excited I have been about the Rockets since we aquired Scottie Pippen. I just hope I am not as wrong as I was that summer.

[Tha TC]

Does it even matter who the starting five will be?

I have to believe that besides T-mac and Yao, Aledman is going to play everyone else (Rafer, Head, James, Scola, Battier, Steve, and Bonzi about the same amount of time). I just love the fact that we can play with just about any style from any team.

This is the most excited I have been about the Rockets since we aquired Scottie Pippen. I just hope I am not as wrong as I was that summer.

I dont know who that guy is...

but the starting 5 will be either

Yao
Scola
Battier
T-mac
Rafer

or

Yao
Hayes
Battier
T-mac
Rafer

[Mr. Clutch]

I have to believe that besides T-mac and Yao, Aledman is going to play everyone else (Rafer, Head, James, Scola, Battier, Steve, and Bonzi about the same amount of time). .

What on earth gives you that idea? Steve is not going to get many minutes.

Adelman said someone is not going to play.

[doublehh03]

Does it even matter who the starting five will be?

I have to believe that besides T-mac and Yao, Aledman is going to play everyone else (Rafer, Head, James, Scola, Battier, Steve, and Bonzi about the same amount of time). I just love the fact that we can play with just about any style from any team.

This is the most excited I have been about the Rockets since we aquired Scottie Pippen. I just hope I am not as wrong as I was that summer.

u were excited for scottie pippen? he wasn't the same impact player when he left chicago. that guy was built for the triangle and THAT'S IT.

[mag]

I dont know who that guy is...

but the starting 5 will be either

Yao
Scola
Battier
T-mac
Rafer

or

Yao
Hayes
Battier
T-mac
Rafer

Why people keep insisting on Hayes as a starter. He should have never been a starter. He is a nice hustle guy and plays his role but he is not a starter.

[Tha TC]

Why people keep insisting on Hayes as a starter. He should have never been a starter. He is a nice hustle guy and plays his role but he is not a starter.

I'm going by that because of what Rick has said... he says that Chuck surprized him with his play over and over. Now honestly i would rather Chuck start then bring luis off the bench at least that way when luis is in the game we have a pf who can score on more than just lay ups

[Aggie 99]

Why people keep insisting on Hayes as a starter. He should have never been a starter. He is a nice hustle guy and plays his role but he is not a starter.


I don't know if it matters. Hayes is a good/decent passer. He makes the hustle play, and plays decent D. The good thing is that now he can play with high energy more often, because he has Scola to give him a rest. And vice versa.

[Barkley]

Rafer
McGrady
Battier
Scola
Yao

I'd love FRancis to start but if he cannot do that i hope he will be in the rotation at least

[durvasa]

Why people keep insisting on Hayes as a starter. He should have never been a starter. He is a nice hustle guy and plays his role but he is not a starter.

Who should have been the starter last year, then?

I don't understand why people find it necessary to categorize players as starters versus bench players. That seems very artificial to me. It's all about how groups work together and matchups. The primary starting five last year was excellent. Detractors like to point to the Utah series, while ignoring the mountain of evidence over the course of the entire regular season. Even if you specifically look at how that group did against the best teams in the league, or the best 5-man units in the league, they were dominant. And yet, we're to believe that Rafer, Chuck, and (some even say) Shane aren't capable of being effective starters.

Thank god Adelman isn't that close-minded.

[AXG]

I'm going by that because of what Rick has said... he says that Chuck surprized him with his play over and over. Now honestly i would rather Chuck start then bring luis off the bench at least that way when luis is in the game we have a pf who can score on more than just lay ups
Chuck is a role player off the bench. He's an energy guy who hustles and makes plays on defense. Luis is similar to Chuck defensively but has a much better offensive game.

[TeamUSA]

Deke
Novak
Snyder
Head
Francis

I'm sure they'll all be the first 5 squad to cheer up our best guys.

[krosfyah]

I really like Scola as the starter. I think Chuck compliments Yao pretty well with his hustle play. But I think Scola gives you similar hustle energy plus adds a legit scoring threat.

With all our guns sitting on the bench, Chuck playing in the 2nd unit with guys like Mike James and Bonzi and Steve makes more sense now.

[LAYGO]

Does it even matter who the starting five will be?

Yes, because you want to still have SOME offense coming off the bench.

Starting Hayes & having Hayes/Deke on the floor at the same time cuts our offensive capability. Scola/Deke of the bench for Hayes/Yao.

[metalshred]

It'll be great to hav the following combination on the court:

Yao+Hayes
Mutombo+Scola

We get both boards and scoring+defense

[LAYGO]

Why people keep insisting on Hayes as a starter. He should have never been a starter.

Because that 5's +/- from last year was one of the best lineups . . . IN THE LEAGUE.

Why break that down?

[TeamUSA]

Hayes is more effective offensively when he's playing with Yao or Tmac or both because the D is focused on the superstars, then he's great in finding his way to be open. Thsi is in addtion to their pik n rol play with tmac.

[mlwoo]

This guy is obviously a troll. The Scottie comment gave it away.

[metalshred]

Why people keep insisting on Hayes as a starter. He should have never been a starter. He is a nice hustle guy and plays his role but he is not a starter.
then who do u suggest should hav been our starting PF last season? Juwan got traded, only Jake and Novak were left. Hayes did an amazing job last year, u saw how many times i was found in the open? he was just great defensively. Undersized, but defends bigger.

[gta]

I dont know who that guy is...

but the starting 5 will be either

Yao
Scola
Battier
T-mac
Rafer

or

Yao
Hayes
Battier
T-mac
Rafer

+1
Hayes will share the starting role with Scola. 1 thing for sure, Hayes and Deke playing together ain't a good idea. Hayes is more effective playing with Yao

[Tha TC]

then who do u suggest should hav been our starting PF last season? Juwan got traded, only Jake and Novak were left. Hayes did an amazing job last year, u saw how many times i was found in the open? he was just great defensively. Undersized, but defends bigger.

Chuck???

[ReD_1]

It even doesn't matter,but I would love to see Mike James as starting PG.
That's that spot that is undefined but sure we don't lack players and we're in better position than last year.We're fully covered and tanked on every position so starting doesn't mind,as you can easily contribute from the bench.

[drankcity]

it don't matter who starts its how the rockets finish and thats is something the rockets are notorious for!

[duteman]

Yeah I'm thinking its going to be Yao, Chuck, battier, tmac, rafer.....chucks proved that he can play and he makes things happen with his hustle, but I'm not saying he'll stay a started for long.

Maybe after the first few games scola will prove to be a better starter? And I agree with most are saying Yao + chuck = good....deke + chuck = no offense and tmac hurting his back trying to hard.

[MrButtocks]

Do not start Rafer!!! I really appreciate his good attitude and impressive performance after this offseason, but he cannot start for us. It's only a matter of time before opposing teams catch on and play off him completely. Fans love how he runs the offense now, but Rafer WILL be exposed again.

Starting lineup:

MJ
Tmac
Shane
Scola
Yao

[metalshred]

It even doesn't matter,but I would love to see Mike James as starting PG.
That's that spot that is undefined but sure we don't lack players and we're in better position than last year.We're fully covered and tanked on every position so starting doesn't mind,as you can easily contribute from the bench.
I don't think the position's undefined. James' great, but i just find it hard for rafer to lose his starting spot. If he could play like he did in the preseason thru out the season, we r going to be unstoppable. The truth is, even if he still shoots bricks like he did last year in some games, i still dont' think james can get the starting job easily from rafer's hands, cuz rafer's got great hands at passing and running the offense, but as u said, james' great, the starting spot won't matter how much he'll contribute, he'll get the minutes he deserves.

[thacabbage]

I have to second the thread starter's excitement. I honestly haven't been this hyped for a Rockets season since we picked up Shane Battier and Bonzi Wells last year and that in itself had been a long time coming dating back to the excitement I felt when we picked up Stromile Swift and Derek Anderson to round out our starting 5 the summer before.

[davidkconover]

Why people keep insisting on Hayes as a starter. He should have never been a starter. He is a nice hustle guy and plays his role but he is not a starter.

The ROX starters had the biggest plus/minus advantage in the league last year. Why on earth would you change that combination? Our problem last year was lack of scoring off the bench. The second unit of Scola, Wells and James provide that this year. Switching Scola and Hayes in the first unit defeats the whole purpose of having a strong, scoring second unit. Hayes needs to start. We need his defense help.

[LAYGO]

What just struck me was, Hayes/Battier banging on our opponents scorers saves TMac's/Yao's energy on the defensive end. Granted Yao on the help D/interior D.

The smaller guys matched up with Yao SAT night really put a body on him, I think the reason for his offensive inefficiency.

[mag]

Because that 5's +/- from last year was one of the best lineups . . . IN THE LEAGUE.

Why break that down?

Because we have not been in the playoffs for the last 10 years.
As I said before, we need to have our best 5 starting and taking big leads to start the game. If we don't have our best five to start, teams will double on Yao. With Scola starting, they won't be able to leave him alone. Scola demands somebody to be defending him.
Be real. Hayes is a role player and when he is on the field, his defender has the luxury to be roaming around.

[Aggie 99]

This guy is obviously a troll. The Scottie comment gave it away.


Yah I guess I should have been more excited about the T-mac trade or the Yao pick, but I haven't thought we would win it all since we had Barkley, Pippen, and Clyde on the same team. Why, does that make me a troll?

My guess is that you are a pecker head. :cool:

[Barkley]

It even doesn't matter,but I would love to see Mike James as starting PG.
That's that spot that is undefined but sure we don't lack players and we're in better position than last year.We're fully covered and tanked on every position so starting doesn't mind,as you can easily contribute from the bench.

If James passes the ball first I will agree. He's better than skip as a scorer, shooter, but skip's probably is better as a playmaker

[durvasa]

Because we have not been in the playoffs for the last 10 years.

Huh?


As I said before, we need to have our best 5 starting and taking big leads to start the game. If we don't have our best five to start, teams will double on Yao. With Scola starting, they won't be able to leave him alone. Scola demands somebody to be defending him.
Be real. Hayes is a role player and when he is on the field, his defender has the luxury to be roaming around.

I don't have a problem with Scola and/or Mike James starting, to be honest. But let's get something clear. You say we need starting group that can jump out to big leads. That's exactly what we had last year with Rafer and Chuck starting.

[Aggie 99]

If James passes the ball first I will agree. He's better than skip as a scorer, shooter, but skip's probably is better as a playmaker


Agreed.

[Yao4REAL]

I think Rafer start just because he initiate the fastbreak better than anyone else on this team. This type of offense FITS him perfectly...his speed, his passing skills, dribbling, and decision making is like non other. I think he creates more easy scoring opportunities for his teammates than James or Francis.

Now don't get me wrong...i LOVE to start James as well...with his aggressive mentality attacking the basket ect., but i think if THIS IS still the JEFF Van GUNDY's offense....i definitely 100% favor James over Rafer even if Rafer play well...why?? Because Jeff's offense don't really do any fastbreak or required someone with tremendous passing skills...you just got to pass to Yao and watch from the 3pts line and this clearly fit James than Rafer because now you have someone that can penetrate as well. But with Adelman's system...it requires a BIBBYs' PG to play that position. Now if Rafer struggles and James excel..then i will favor James over Rafer.

[A_3PO]

The ROX starters had the biggest plus/minus advantage in the league last year. Why on earth would you change that combination? Our problem last year was lack of scoring off the bench. The second unit of Scola, Wells and James provide that this year. Switching Scola and Hayes in the first unit defeats the whole purpose of having a strong, scoring second unit. Hayes needs to start. We need his defense help.
Because we are a better team when Scola replaces Chuck. Scola moves just as much without the ball and he finishes around the rim 10x better than Chuck. When he gets the ball on the wing, he can put it on the floor and successfully attack the basket or drill a jumper if he isn't contested. To date, Scola is also a better rebounder than I expected. With Bonzi coming off the bench and either Tracy or Yao still in the game, the notion of channeling scoring at PF to the 2nd unit is misguided.

At PG, it will become obvious going forward that MJ is better than Rafer. Put that one in the bank. If Rafer continues his stellar shooting percentage, fine. If he becomes a sinkhole again, bench him and improve the team!

Just because our starting 5 last year was good as a unit doesn't mean we should stand pat. Chuck and Rafer were by far the weakest links of our starters and that's where we must look to improve. Chuck and Rafer have a 2 year head start over MJ, Scola and SF in their familiarity with Yao and Tracy. That gap will narrow.

Some of you act like the entire starting unit will be leaving the game at the same time. Not so. We will have an 8 1/2 player rotation with players usually coming in one at a time in the 1st half. Closely watch the substitution pattern with Yao and Tracy. We will not lack firepower on the floor.

[A00man]

I don't know exactly who will start. Right now it seems like it'll be

Rafer
Tracy
Shane
Hayes/Scola (?)
Yao

But perhaps, what's more important, is what team will most likely be finishing the games? I'd say this is the most probable:

James
Tracy
Shane/Bonzi (just depends on the night)
Scola
Yao

[Yetti]

We made the efoort to finda Power Forward who would compliment Yao Ming and generally take away the extra defence played on both Tracy and Yao!
So why would be not have him starting with Yao & Tracy? Chuck causes the opposite to happen. If Chuck starts then Coach 'A' is saying one thing but doing the opposite!
Scola plays best with the best, not with the second wave! Battier play much better offensively when he plays with the second wave :p

[Aggie 99]

We made the efoort to finda Power Forward who would compliment Yao Ming and generally take away the extra defence played on both Tracy and Yao!
So why would be not have him starting with Yao & Tracy? Chuck causes the opposite to happen. If Chuck starts then Coach 'A' is saying one thing but doing the opposite!
Scola plays best with the best, not with the second wave! Battier play much better offensively when he plays with the second wave :p

I think you make a good point. Also look at who may play better with Deke. Deke is not the top of the lane type of passing center we need, so does Hayes fit better there? Deke playes in the middle and clogs the lane. Hayes may be a better fit for a higher energy D role too.

[Matt78777]

Judging from the preseason, I think it'll be

Alston
McGrady
Battier
Hayes
Yao

They've been awesome so far, killing everyone right out of the gate. The first subs off the bench will be Scola for Yao and Wells for McGrady. Yao will then come in for Scola, moving him over to power forward. James will eventually come in for Rafer, McGrady will slide down to small forward eventually and either Wells or Head or Francis will get minutes at the two. Right now it looks like Francis and maybe Head are the odd men out. James and Wells will get most of the minutes off the bench at the guard spots. For nostalgic reasons, I'm a fan of Francis so I hope he starts to figure more prominently into our offense. Also, I think Scola will eventually average more minutes than Hayes. Hayes might eventually come off the bench, or he might just be the nominal starter with Scola getting the lion's share of the minutes. I Don't think we'll see Mutumbo every game, almost never see Butler or Brooks, and everyone else we will never see at all unless there are injuries.

I agree with previous posters though: Far more interesting than who will start, is who will end. I honestly have no idea.

[ParaSolid]

I liked what I saw in Seattle when this lineup was on the court:

PG - James
SG - T-Mac
SF - Shane
PF - Scola
C - Yao

They were so potent offensively, and their defense wasn't anything to scoff at. MJ seems to be good at pressure D, T-Mac can defend almost anyone because of his length, Scola and Battier discourage guys to drive because of their positioning skills, and Yao looms large behind them all.

[davidghall]

My starting lineup with minutes projection...

C Yao 35
PF Scola 30
SF Battier 30
SG McGrady 35
PG Alston 30

Four players off the bench...

PF Hayes 20
SF Wells 20
SG Head 20
PG James 20

Yao can obviously only play the 5, and Hayes can only play the 4. Scola seems more versatile, able to play both positions so those three players will man the 4/5. This way we never have to worry about Deke and Chuck being on the floor at the same time. You might occasionally see Battier, Wells, or even McGrady at the 4 when we go small. Wells will primarily backup the 2/3 and Head should only play the 2, with McGrady sliding over to the 3 at times. James should play primarily the 1 but is very capable of playing the 2 when he and Alston are in the game.

Originally I had Francis in Head's position getting the backup 2 minutes, but he just looks clueless and I am about to give up on him. We always have plenty of ball movement until the ball is in his hands. Usually when he gets it, he will bring it to the top of the key and try to dribble through a double team. This has to be very frustrating for Adelman. Another thing I noticed is that he doesn't really move without the ball. He just picks a spot and stands behind the three point line. Head is a much better shooter, won't turn the ball over quite as much, is a smarter player, and is much more active.

[Plowman]

Yao

Scola

Tracy

Battier

Now at point I'd start the season with James,but it appears that Rafer is going to get the nod.I see him getting dealt and Brooks being the man by midseason though with Mike coming off the bench.Stevie will get some time there initially but I believe he's destined for a majoirity of his minutes at the 2.

[doublehh03]

Yao

Scola

Tracy

Battier

Now at point I'd start the season with James,but it appears that Rafer is going to get the nod.I see him getting dealt and Brooks being the man by midseason though with Mike coming off the bench.Stevie will get some time there initially but I believe he's destined for a majoirity of his minutes at the 2.

brooks is NOT ready. not this year. defensively he will be a HUGE liability. and adelman even said he can't play off the ball. he needs the ball in his hands to be effective primarily.

[t-mac4bigmac]

One thing I'm afraid of is that we'll pick up the reputation of being a high scoring team but plays mediocre defense, much like the Suns or Mavericks.

Therefore I think the starting five should try to set the tone for defense as much as possible...

James- has the quickness and tenacious attitude of a good defender. He and Lindsey Hunter were nicknamed the "pitbulls" in Detroit.
McGrady- has always been a good defender since his days as a defensive specialist in Toronto.
Battier- probably the most versatile and effective defender in the league; he can guard anyone from Kobe Bryant to Dirk Nowitzski.
Scola- he and Battier will lead the "taking the charge" brigade. His low post defense is uncertain now, but I have no worries about it.
Yao- a 7'6 guy...anything to explain?

[rocket3forlife2]

i think scola should come off the bench...his offense when yao go out will be needed.

[nreal2007]

off topic

Doesn't rafer has a court date in december for attempted murder?

[Barkley]

i think scola should come off the bench...his offense when yao go out will be needed.

And that's not stupid thinkin'. We can play with "one scorin' big man in the lineup". So I mean out Yao and Hayes, and then when Yao will be out put Scola and let him score the ball.

[durvasa]

One thing I'm afraid of is that we'll pick up the reputation of being a high scoring team but plays mediocre defense, much like the Suns or Mavericks.

The Mavs have been a good defensive team ever since Nash left.

[nycundaground]

Just to Even out the Offense. Id say:

Rafer
Tracy
Shane
Hayes
Yao

Mike J.
Head
Bonzi
Scola

[paultherad]

obviously the starting 5 will be:

JVG
bob sura
kobe bryant (we're going to trade our entire team for him)
matt bullard
don chaney

just you guys watch

[LAYGO]

obviously the starting 5 will be:

JVG
bob sura
kobe bryant (we're going to trade our entire team for him)
matt bullard
don chaney

just you guys watch

Talk about Left Field™, Sura's getting bought out.

[Dream lover]

It seems like everyone is assuming that Deke will automatically sub for Yao when what we have seen so far in the pre-season is not the case. More times than not, RA has been putting Scola at center when Yao goes out whether Scola starts or not. Now he might not being playing Deke very much since he is old, but saying that Scola should come off the bench because Deke is a liability offensively is really not valid.

Also, I'm sorry but stats mean nothing to me when you can't get out of the first round. People bringing up the Utah series have a valid point. Who cares if you have the best statistical staring 5 in the league, it doesn't mean squat if you can't translate that to playoff wins. Rafer and Chuck are decent players, but to say they should start because of some stupid stat doesn't mean anything to me. The entire offense of our team last year started and ended with T-Mac and Yao, that's what I could see from my view. Even Morey said that they were trying to upgrade the point guard and power forward positions. Every NBA preview I have read so far about the Rockets say that Scola is an upgrade at the power forward spot.

Why would I leave my new Yukon in the garage to save it for later while I drive my old chevy truck around just because I'm used to it. You know the Yukon is better, so why not break it in and save the old chevy for later.

[MR. MEOWGI]

My starting lineup with minutes projection...

C Yao 35
PF Scola 30
SF Battier 30
SG McGrady 35
PG Alston 30

Four players off the bench...

PF Hayes 20
SF Wells 20
SG Head 20
PG James 20

Yao can obviously only play the 5, and Hayes can only play the 4. Scola seems more versatile, able to play both positions so those three players will man the 4/5. This way we never have to worry about Deke and Chuck being on the floor at the same time. You might occasionally see Battier, Wells, or even McGrady at the 4 when we go small. Wells will primarily backup the 2/3 and Head should only play the 2, with McGrady sliding over to the 3 at times. James should play primarily the 1 but is very capable of playing the 2 when he and Alston are in the game.

Originally I had Francis in Head's position getting the backup 2 minutes, but he just looks clueless and I am about to give up on him. We always have plenty of ball movement until the ball is in his hands. Usually when he gets it, he will bring it to the top of the key and try to dribble through a double team. This has to be very frustrating for Adelman. Another thing I noticed is that he doesn't really move without the ball. He just picks a spot and stands behind the three point line. Head is a much better shooter, won't turn the ball over quite as much, is a smarter player, and is much more active.

I agree with this post, except I think James/ Franics / Head will split backup time depending on who is playing well and matchups.

[krockets]

I expect Rafer to be traded once Francis pick up the new system.

Starting: Yao/Scola/Battier/Tmac/James
Bench: Bonzi/Francis/Hayes/Head

* When Yao is out, Scola could move to center, either Hayes or Battier play the PF spot. Tmac could shift to SF

* When Tmac is out/shift, Bonzi, Head or James could play the SG, Francis/Brooks could play the point

* This is a 9 men rotation and I hope Adelman doesn't play anyone more than 32-33 minutes a game.

[bluesinsoul]

I always believe that the starting line-up is not as important as the line-up that coach uses in the last 3 minutes of a close game.

In my mind, Alston might be good to start a game, but when it's on the line, I'd rather have MJ on the court instead of him.

[irlu]

It'll be great to hav the following combination on the court:

Yao+Hayes
Mutombo+Scola

We get both boards and scoring+defense

that's what i'm gonna say :cool:

[A_3PO]

The Mavs have been a good defensive team ever since AJ took over.
Fixed it for you.

[davidghall]

that's what i'm gonna say :cool:

You think Mutombo is going to get consistent minutes??

[durvasa]

Fixed it for you.

Well, their defense was significantly improved that season before he was officially named the coach. But I guess he was controlling things well before that.

[lunaticrocket]

Same starting five as last season. I don't quite agree that should be the case, but that is what it looks like. For me the best five should start:

Tmac
James
Yao
Scola
Battier

But that ain't gonna happen.