[Preseason] Texans @ Cardinals

[gunn]

Game Time: Saturday 18, 2007 - 3:00 pm (ct)

The game will be on local 13 and NFL Network.


Thoughts on what you would like to see more of from the Texans in this game from the Bears game? Expectations? Outcome?

[leroy420]

Game Time: 3:00 pm (ct)

The game will be on local 13 and NFL Network.


Thoughts on what you would like to see more of from the Texans in this game from the Bears game? Expectations? Outcome?

Offensively, it's definitely scoring td's when in the red zone and getting the running game going. Defensively, it's the same old...get to the QB.

[texanskan]

field goals get you beat in the NFL, lets finish drives and on D we have to get to the qb

[gucci888]

1. Definitely want to see us finish in the redzone.
2. Get to the QB (with a weak Cardinals OL, we need to see something).
3. Establish running game.

Players to look for:
1. Jacoby Jones- Pretty impressive vs. the Bears, want to see more of him.

2. Keenan McCardell- Probably won't get too much action, but we need to see where our WR core stands.

3. Mario Williams- Made a pretty weak excuse about his play last week. I know its only preseason, but he needs to show up this season and these games are the best practice for him.

[JaWindex]

I want to see something from the D-line. After all, we've poured tons of money into it.

[gunn]

Players to look for:
1. Jacoby Jones- Pretty impressive vs. the Bears, want to see more of him..

I agree, but I think pretty impressive is an understatement. I came away extremely impressed with his play that game. The tough catch that Sage threw behind him; and the naked boot that he came back for and made an extremely tough catch on the sideline where he had the presense of mind to come back for the ball and was still able to tap two feet down.

The touchdown attempt where he was not able to get both feet in was an off pass that he never really had a chance to bring in inbounds. He was catching everthing. Even the balls that were one hopping too him. Kevin Walter better watch the hell out because I think this kid, who has all the confidence in the world, is going to earn the starting spot opposite Andre.

[Raven Lunatic]

The touchdown attempt where he was not able to get both feet in was an off pass that he never really had a chance to bring in inbounds. He was catching everthing. Even the balls that were one hopping too him. Kevin Walter better watch the hell out because I think this kid, who has all the confidence in the world, is going to earn the starting spot opposite Andre.

Well, I was pretty impressed with Jacoby as well, but I think the out-of-bounds missed TD was very much completable. On the replay, you see he clearly got one foot down, and then the other was placed just barely out of bounds. But if you watch him, he doesn't seem like he is really making an effort to get both feet as inbounds as possible, as if he either thought he was way out of bounds, or completely inbounds. Either way, he needs to get a better feel for where he is on the field. That will come.

He did have a drop in the game too. On a short pass by Rosenfels. The pass was low, but Jones went down on his knees for it and the ball hit his hands and chest and he didn't hold on. Not a terribly big deal, but a mistake. I think we will see fewer and fewer of these for him over the season, though.

And I agree, I have every confidence now that, despite Kubiak's attempt to give Walter his shot at being productive, Jacoby will be in the starting spot opposite Andre by season's end...maybe even by midseason.

And as for what I want to see Saturday, I want to see some backfield penetration by the first string D-line, and I want to see some halfway decent run blocking by the O-line. And of course another look at Schaub.

[ima_drummer2k]

I would like to see Mario not get STOOD UP by the left tackle.

FYI, I watched the Chicago game again and he was not double teamed once.

[Ric]

Well, I was pretty impressed with Jacoby as well, but I think the out-of-bounds missed TD was very much completable. On the replay, you see he clearly got one foot down, and then the other was placed just barely out of bounds. But if you watch him, he doesn't seem like he is really making an effort to get both feet as inbounds as possible, as if he either thought he was way out of bounds, or completely inbounds. Either way, he needs to get a better feel for where he is on the field. That will come.
agree completely; that should have been a touchdown. with more experience, he likely gets both feet down; it wasn't an easy play, per se; but for an elite WR (or elite WR wannabe), it's a play they should make.

[updawg]

I want to see something from the D-line. After all, we've poured tons of money into it.
I'm with you on that. Theres a lot of money in the d-line. they better start playing better

[david_rocket]

They are going to show the texans in HD in the NFL Network

[VooDooPope]

I want a sign. Any sign that they are going to be better than 3-13 or 4-12. They have questions at every position on the field other than a handful.

[Jewvenile]

Heres a sign for you... Jacoby Jones Keenan McCardell and Andre Johnson and NO David Carr.... If the defense plays decent i think 9-7 is more likely than an under .500 season

[conquistador#11]

"I think he has found a role in our defense" :eek:

Like most of you, the passing defense is my biggest concern. I just want to see improvements in the coverages and in the line play.

Aug. 17, 2007, 2:42AM
A hammer in search of a nail
DE Babin credits his position coach for helping him realize potential


By MEGAN MANFULL
Copyright 2007 Houston Chronicle

When new defensive line coach Jethro Franklin joined the Texans, he didn't sit down and talk with Jason Babin about the past. He didn't sit down and talk to him about moving forward, either.

Franklin walked in and simply went to work. The approach has helped Babin. The embattled defensive lineman is repaying his new coach by putting together arguably the best preseason of his career.

"Jethro's been instrumental," Babin said. "My style of play at left defensive end, it's kind of scrappy. It's not traditional. You have a guy that's 6-foot-6, 280 pounds, that's not me. He understands the way I play and what I can bring to the table. He's been able to coach me from that aspect."

Babin is entering a critical season with the Texans. Three years after being a first-round draft pick, he has struggled to find his fit. That appears to have changed.

In the first preseason game against Chicago last week, Babin was one of the players who impressed coach Gary Kubiak the most. The 27-year-old veteran has done the same thing in practice almost daily.

"He's really dedicated himself to our program, to Dan (Riley, strength coach), to what Jethro and Frank (Bush, defensive assistant) are trying to do and it shows," Kubiak said. "He stood out last week as much as any guy we had up front, so I'm looking forward to Jason having a good year."

When the Texans paid a hefty price on draft day to select Babin, members of former coach Dom Capers' staff believed the defensive end from Western Michigan would become a strong outside linebacker in the 3-4. Babin started all 16 games as a rookie but lost his starting job the next season.

Last year, he moved to his natural position of defensive end in the 4-3, but the transition wasn't easy. He struggled with his fundamentals and had problems adjusting to being a situational pass rusher, sharing time with Antwan Peek.

Franklin has worked on improving Babin's technique and his mental approach.

"That's the thing about it, this game is so mental," Franklin said. "Mentally, he was probably all over the place. Hopefully now, he's a little more focused on himself and not other people around him. He's more focused on his body in terms of body mechanics.

"I give them things they can hang their hat on. That's what I try to give them. Try to get them some tools. If you give them some tools, hopefully they can build you a strong bridge."

Franklin isn't trying to overload Babin or the other defensive linemen with talk of too many "tools." Really, he only wants them to carry one.

"A hammer," Franklin said. "All he needs is a hammer. A hammer can destroy pretty much everything. That's what I tell them all; we need to be the hammer, not the nail. We want to go out and pound, hit."

The approach is sinking in with Babin, who is looking to see significantly more playing time this season as a pass rusher now that Peek is gone.

Babin, who has 13 career sacks, couldn't be more ready. He said he feels more comfortable than ever when he is on the football field.

"The best way to describe it is I feel like Jason Babin at Western Michigan," he said.

Kubiak saw that Babin in 2004 when the Denver Broncos were analyzing draft prospects. That's the Babin he looks forward to seeing on the field this year.

"I remember him coming out," Kubiak said. "I know in Denver how much we liked him as an undersized end who could rush the passer. I think he's found his role in our defense."

[redgoose]

Our secondary is my biggest concern right now. :( That's what i'll be trying to focus on. We've been throwing money and top draft picks at the D-Line left and right (ignoring the O-Line), so they do need to prove themselves this year with some sacks and solid run defense. Teams like the Cardinals, Chargers, Colts, etc, could pick our secondary apart if their O-Line plays close to average.

I'd love to see us address next year's off-season on the secondary and O-Line via FA's and drafting. That's the next step to having a solid core to build off of.

[Groogrux]

I want a sign. Any sign that they are going to be better than 3-13 or 4-12. They have questions at every position on the field other than a handful.

How about last year's 6-10? They definitely didn't get worse, at least on paper, during the offseason.

[Chance]

Can I tell you guys...I am pumped for this game tonight. I was excited about the first game against the Cowboys (19-10). After that my interest went down. I was a Julius Peppers guy and they went with Carr. I saw the writing on the wall very early yet they stuck with Carr. I could go into that but I won't.

Then the VY debacle...that made it VERY hard to even remotely like this team. And I worked for them. I traveled with them. But I was disgusted by their arrogance and ignorance. So I could not root for them or feel the joy of victory on those few occasions.

But now, tonight...I am feeling it. For the first time in a long time I am excited about a Houston professional football team. I will always root for whatever team Vince is on. But with JZ taking the field tonight in the 3rd or 4th I gotta tell you...I am pumped.

Last time this kid was on this field it was in the greatest football game ever played. Now he is back and he is in Texans gear. When he makes the team I will cheer for them completely.

Still not sure what to do during Titans games.

[DonnyMost]

i want to see matt leinart eat dirt

[MadMax]

I want to see something from the D-line. After all, we've poured tons of money into it.

amen!

looking forward to seeing schaub for a full half.

[MadMax]

I saw the writing on the wall very early yet they stuck with Carr. I could go into that but I won't.

.

no...please go into it! enquiring minds want to know!!!! seriously!

[Chance]

no...please go into it! enquiring minds want to know!!!! seriously!


OK. Here's my theory. In a fantasy world a good ol' boy billionaire that just secured his first professional franchise decides he is going to build it to be THE BEST. From jump street he wants the team to be:

- winners
- profitable
- full of good character guys
- envied by other NFL franchises
- first-class
- absolutely void of any Oilers ties
- clean (drug free)
- marketable
- unoffensive (mass-appeal is very important)

So that is what his vision was and what his people told him. Obviously this is my theory so I will stop qualifying that.

In reality his triage of that list was:

1. Profitable
2. Marketable
3. Unoffensive
4. Winners
5. full of good character guys
6. first class
7. envied
8. no Oiler ties
9. clean

His decisions since being awarded the franchise support this. Profitability is obviously number 1 as it is with every professional franchise. After that he focused on Marketability tied hand in hand with being Unoffensive. Everything about this franchise from the beginning is as vanilla, ordinary, safe, politically correct as it could conceivably be. The Name? Texans. Plain. The colors? Red, White, and Blue. Are you kidding? The logo? A red, white and blue bull - hell the bull worked for the Bulls no sense in going out on a limb there. The mascot? Let's go with a bull and call him Toro. That'll play well with the growing Latino population and plus all the blacks and whites know that toro means bull in espanol.

The 2002 Draft. Great teams are made by great players. The first few years of the Texans were never going to be great. Expansion teams rarely are. So The Texans knew that they would have a grace period with the fans pretty much no matter what they did. It is my opinion that The Texans rolled the dice on Carr because they wanted the story book franchise. And the story book franchise would be led by a strong handsome marketable quarterback with no character issues and a skill set that contained all of the measurables. He would be surrounded by capable teammates (eventually some great ones) and the whole lot of them would live happily ever after. They would be competing for the playoffs by year 3 and make some good runs after that. Based on Their triage of "THE BEST" David Carr fit the bill perfectly. The problem was their Triage. I'll grant them Profitability needed to be number 1. But number 2 should have been Winning. And it was my opinion that Peppers was the best player on the board and when you are starting with a completely blank canvas you MUST take the best player.

But I got over that. I, too was swept up in the emotion of 2002. We had a team! But as that year and all of the subsequent years passed by that triage never changed. That vision of a story book team was never surrendered to reality. They hired and fired accordingly. They drafted accordingly.

All of the major decisions fit this model. Kubiak. Vince or Reggie. Schaub. Mario.

The reason why I am starting to support the team now is because of some of the more minor decisions that have broken the fantasy mold. Jared Zabransky. The silent knowledge that Mario was the wrong pick and the emergence...and acceptance...that this is DeMeco's defense. The patience with Jerome Mathis. The draft of Amobi Okoye. They have started to do things that I like. So now I will start to have allegiance.

I am sure if I reread this there will be parts that I got wrong but for just spitting my thoughts out...there you have it.

[MadMax]

all good. i don't disagree. was just wondering if you knew something from being around the team so often...something you specifically heard.

i was baffled by the decision, too. but, as you said, it's over.

[rocketteen]

Disagree somewhat Chance. I do agree Peppers should have been taken first and maybe he would have been......had Dom Capers run a traditional 4-3 defense. Since he was a 3-4 guru and Peppers was your traditional 4-3 end, he didn't fit us, so he wasn't going to be considered for the #1 pick that year.

Same thing w/ Vince Young. I went to A&M and saw a bunch of him and had to hear it as well :mad: , but I think Kubiak wasn't going to consider Young at QB b/c he wanted a more traditional drop-back passer, which is y they gave Carr another chance and ended up going after Schaub.

When it should be all about talent, it isn't. Many football coaches are creatures of habit and go with what makes them comfortable and therefore successful, after all, they wouldn't be in the NFL without being proficient in something right. So these guys run their systems and try and find the talent who would fit best in those systems. In both scenarios, guys who were automatic takes weren't b/c they didn't fit our respective coaches systems.

With that said, I do think Mario will be a successful pro, but that still may not be enough for those who are Bush and Young fanatics and will always dog that pick. Here's hoping Mario serves a nice dish of crow.

[franchise403]

Does anyone know if the game is going to be televised in Austin?

[RocketFire]

its on nfl network, and on ktrk.

[BigTex]

i hope we get to see some zabransky today

[Ziggy]

i hope we get to see some zabransky today
I don't. Van Pelt is 10X the man Zabransky is. Maybe if Zabransky removed that idiot Z tattoo. Nah even then he has no place in the league.

[Cannonball]

WTF are the Cardinals doing? Reverse WR pass? Going for it on 4th down in the red zone? Do they know this is preseason, right?

[Nick]

WTF are the Cardinals doing? Reverse WR pass? Going for it on 4th down in the red zone? Do they know this is preseason, right?

That's exactly right... wouldn't you rather have your team try out all the gadget plays, and test your 4th down offense in games that don't really count?

I'm more critical of Kubiak's playcalling thus far.

[Nick]

Tremendous pass protection thus far

[macalu]

now THAT is an NFL football drive!

[MadMax]

Nice little drive.

Schaub is good at hitting guys across the middle. But it's the 2nd week in a row he's missed a receiver who had his man beat in the end zone down the sideline.

[MR. MEOWGI]

Go Texans.

Matt looks great.

[macalu]

Nice little drive.

Schaub is good at hitting guys across the middle. But it's the 2nd week in a row he's missed a receiver who had his man beat in the end zone down the sideline.

maybe just a great defensive play?

[MadMax]

maybe just a great defensive play?

partly, for sure. but it looked like andre had to slow down to come back to the ball. thrown over his shoulder it's 6. at least it looked that way to me. i'm not DVR'ing the game, so I can't rewind it.

[Nick]

But it's the 2nd week in a row he's missed a receiver who had his man beat in the end zone down the sideline.

Eh... it was more of a great play by the DB than a terrible throw. It could have been better... hopefully they'll work on the timing for that play (because AJ is virtually unguardable in jump-ball situations).

[MadMax]

Eh... it was more of a great play by the DB than a terrible throw. It could have been better... hopefully they'll work on the timing for that play (because AJ is virtually unguardable in jump-ball situations).

i need to see it again, frankly. but what i thought i saw was andre having to come back to the ball (or at least slow down) when he had his guy beat. that throw was not over Andre's shoulder.

[CometsWin]

They look like a real offense!

[MadMax]

They look like a real offense!

definitely. much, much improved from what we've seen in the past.

[Nick]

They look like a real offense!

Indeed... if they can keep pass protection like that, and allow Schaub to actually go thru multiple reads, good things can happen.

[Nick]

i need to see it again, frankly. but what i thought i saw was andre having to come back to the ball (or at least slow down) when he had his guy beat. that throw was not over Andre's shoulder.

The way Schaub lobbed it up there, it seemed like it was a designed jump-ball play... which you'd likely want any time AJ is matched up against a tiny CB.

[Nick]

Meanwhile, the Texans (like the Cardinals) have ZERO pass rush... you can't give any QB in this league that much time to throw the ball.

[MadMax]

Meanwhile, the Texans (like the Cardinals) have ZERO pass rush... you can't give any QB in this league that much time to throw the ball.

yeah, that's killing me. absolutely inexplicable. i'm realing trying hard to not say anything about mario until the regular season. he was taken to the ground on that TD play.

[MadMax]

The way Schaub lobbed it up there, it seemed like it was a designed jump-ball play... which you'd likely want any time AJ is matched up against a tiny CB.

that could be it. i would appreciate some replays of the plays. but they only do that on channel 13 when someone scores, it seems. as opposed to after nearly every play in the regular season.

[King1]

I think everyone is aware it's preseason but it's nice to finally see something on the field to get excited about for me.

1) No matter what, Schaub for two straight weeks has demonstrated poise, pocket presence, and great touch on the ball. He also looks very comfortable in the offense.

2) Dunta Robinson is a real leader. Probably the best tackling CB I've seen since Charles Woodson in his prime.

3) Ryans is no fluke. He's a star in the making

4) Our team seems to have an attitude towards it.

5) Owen Daniels , Jacobey Jones and the timing between Johnson and Schaub.

Negatives:

1) Our defense still needs to step up more. There's an hige gap between our playmakers and the next line. There needs to be more middle ground

2) mario Williams is just a non factor. I'm starting to completely give up on the guy much like he does on numerous plays.

3) The big play is still there for teams. We must take that away

[MadMax]

I think everyone is aware it's preseason but it's nice to finally see something on the field to get excited about for me.

1) No matter what, Schaub for two straight weeks has demonstrated poise, pocket presence, and great touch on the ball. He also looks very comfortable in the offense.

2) Dunta Robinson is a real leader. Probably the best tackling CB I've seen since Charles Woodson in his prime.

3) Ryans is no fluke. He's a star in the making

4) Our team seems to have an attitude towards it.

5) Owen Daniels , Jacobey Jones and the timing between Johnson and Schaub.

Negatives:

1) Our defense still needs to step up more. There's an hige gap between our playmakers and the next line. There needs to be more middle ground

2) mario Williams is just a non factor. I'm starting to completely give up on the guy much like he does on numerous plays.

3) The big play is still there for teams. We must take that away


I agree with everything you just said. Great first post!

[MadMax]

There's your big play :)

OL looks TONS better.

[Harrisment]

Love what I'm seeing from the offensive line, the protection has looked solid. Maybe there was some truth to Carr being a big part of the problem with all those sacks?

Mario on the other hand continues to look lost. Very disappointed.

[RocketFan007]

Mario has gotten dominated one on one by rookie Levi Brown this far.

[BMoney]

The Texans may not get the top pick right, but they sure are striking gold with everybody else under Smith. Jones seems to be an impact player already.

[King1]

I agree with everything you just said. Great first post!


Thanks

[macalu]

what's going on with Putzier? why has he been relegated to 2nd string?

[King1]

Mario has gotten dominated one on one by rookie Levi Brown this far.


The dissapointing thing about mario is not that I think he's being dominated by Levi Jones because Levi Jones is that much better then him. It's because he simply shows no emotion and doesn't seem to care at all. You see guys flying all over the field and getting excited while Mario goes through the motions. Someone with his speed and size should on pure athletic talent alone make plays. He doesn't. Last yeart it was the foot and I gave him the benefit of the doubt because I wanted to. This year, I'm just going to to hope he proves me wrong.

[King1]

The Texans may not get the top pick right, but they sure are striking gold with everybody else under Smith. Jones seems to be an impact player already.


That's the second guy we've drafted as a kick returner and had show potential to make a difference (Davis). I like Jones a lot. I realy don't want to see them dump Mathis quite yet though. He's got injury problems but he's made huge plays when healthy

[Harrisment]

what's going on with Putzier? why has he been relegated to 2nd string?

Cause Owen Daniels was great last year, so he's the starting TE.

[King1]

Love what I'm seeing from the offensive line, the protection has looked solid. Maybe there was some truth to Carr being a big part of the problem with all those sacks?

Mario on the other hand continues to look lost. Very disappointed.


Carr held the ball too long. He lost confidence in himself and didn't trust anything in my opinion. Unless something was wide open, he wasn't interested (hence the ridiculous amount of dump downs for 2-3 yard gains).

Mario was just a bad decision. That's what happens when you draft players based on the combine and signability. That should never be the criteria for selecting a number 1 pick (unless they are a real problem pre draft and you can't even get close). We had two better options and passed. However, that's the past, no need to worry about it now as we can't change it. I will continue to be dissapointed in Mario's lack of effort

[AzCkR]

Good first half for Schaub and the Texans.

Schaub just seems to be a great decision-maker and seems to have an accurate arm. I especially liked the throw where he put the ball just over an LB's reach and then right into the arms of a receiver cutting through the middle of the field. I think the one pass he threw to AJ in the end zone could've been put in front of AJ for an easy TD, but Hood still had to make a great effort to knock the ball down.

The run game started out kind of slow, but by the second series, when the offense started using the play-action, we opened up the run game a little bit. The second team looked solid, with Sage and Jacoby leading the way. Jacoby really looks like a player.

On the defensive side still no pass rush as others have mentioned. Demarcus looks solid, but the rest of the secondary seems to prone to giving up the big play.

[MadMax]

On the defensive side still no pass rush as others have mentioned. Demarcus looks solid, but the rest of the secondary seems to prone to giving up the big play.

Yeah, I have to say..I didn't expect the first team offense to look better than the first team defense this early.

[WhoMikeJames]

OMG, Who saw the doctor pop it back into place?

[MadMax]

Rosenfels is impressive. He seems to put the ball where it needs to be very consistently.

[DonnyMost]

awesome throw by sage

[RocketFan007]

Jacoby Jones is a football player.

[DonnyMost]

between mathis and jones, we are going to get some kickass field posititon this year

[candlegreen]

wow! What breakaway speed JACOBY!

[redgoose]

Jones just might actually make last year's draft look pretty good if Mario steps it up this year. The guy looks like the perfect break away slot reciever.

[SamFisher]

Rosenfels is impressive. He seems to put the ball where it needs to be very consistently.

you love him so much why don't you marry him you sage loving sage lover

[macalu]

LMAO@Killings running right into his own man. :D

[arkoe]

Jones just might actually make last year's draft look pretty good if Mario steps it up this year. The guy looks like the perfect break away slot reciever.

Jones was the third round pick this year.

[Chance]

I was most impressed with:

Schaub: Great poise, great passes, great timing. This guy sis going to be awesome. Not Vince but great nonetheless.

Jones: This guy is SICK. What a find!

The O-Line: These guys, along with the backside help from the FB or RB...are doing a great job.

Sssssage: That guy is as smooth as yacht rock.

Zabransky: His pass to Mathis that did not get caught. Ok So I am biased...At least he is not Van Pelt. I just hope he is on the roster, not just the practice squad.

Dunta: He seems to be back, no?

Turk: Stanley, my fellow lumberjack, it was a nice run.
Kris Brown: He may spell his name like a girl but he is rock-steady in the preseason.

Unimpressed with:

The pressure-less emotionless hapless D-Line: We're gonna need to use another 1st round pick next year on a defensive lineman.

Dreessen: Scrub tight end that dropped Z's 4th down conversion sure thing game wrapper.

[percicles]

Mario Williams sux big donkey balls.

$54 million Sam Bowie. r

[CometsWin]

They're just going to have to move Mario inside and have him bulk up. He is not a speed rusher and it's fairly obvious at this point. He's one of these guys who is incredibly gifted physically but just doesn't have the talent to fit his body.

[htownbball]

mario doesnt get off the line as quick as he should. he's a split second behind everyone else on the DLine.

[Bobblehead]

Turk: Stanley, my fellow lumberjack, it was a nice run.


Yeah...it sucks. I'm an SFA grad also and it was always kinda cool having an Ex-Jack on the Texans. At least their first signing was a Jack, Mike Quinn.

[RocketFire]

I am very disappointed in Mario. He wasn't even being double team, no excuses. What a worthless player.

[conquistador#11]

I am very disappointed in Mario. He wasn't even being double team, no excuses. What a worthless player.

Don't look at it that way, you will give yourself a headache. Let us just pretend that Demeco and owens were the first picks of each round :)

grrr...I swear, if the texans select another D-linemen, with 22nd pick in this upcoming draft, I will jump off the Alamo!

[A_3PO]

I have some hope in the offense. Our top two QBs are BOTH better than the starter last year (kinda like the Rockets are at PG). That is a huge leap by itself. Both guys have better pocket presence and accuracy. The O-line did OK but I have a sinking feeling we are an injury away from having major pass-protection problems. Then again, maybe Carr really was responsible for a lot of sacks. Jacoby Jones and Mathis will make games more fun to watch.

On defense, Dunta looked good, our safeties looked bad and Mario Williams is looking more and more like a bust. He doesn't have the burst and intensity to be a pass rushing defensive end. He just ain't wired for it. I agree he should eventually bulk up and move inside. What huge mistake. :(

[MadMax]

Don't look at it that way, you will give yourself a headache.!

i'd love to look at it another way. but he's costing us quite a bit, and we're not getting much of a return.

[tulexan]

I love that our starting QB can get 100 yards passing in under 20 pass attempts.

[Icehouse]

I'm glad the new QB is working out so far. Mario sucks donkey balls but oh well.

[Kam]

I can't wait for the return trip to Glendale in Februrary.

[dream34shake]

I am very disappointed in Mario. He wasn't even being double team, no excuses. What a worthless player.

And the thing that's even more disappointing, besides passing on the big 2 which is a matter of the past, but looking at guys like Manny Lawson, Mathias Kiwanuka (Besides letting go of VY on that one play), Tamba Hali, and Mark Anderson who just racked up the sacks last year and play with such high motors but they're not even as physically gifted as Mario, and were ALL in the same draft. We could have gotten ANY single one of them and be better off. I don't like being a pessimist but until he shows me effort I have lost hope in him.

[King1]

It's a complete lack of effort. God Bush would look great in this offense. I would love to have VY too but i don't want to slight Schaub since he has looked good. What's funny is it actually seems we have depth at the QB position.

[A-Train]

How long have ads been digitally placed on the field? I walked by the TV while my friend was watching the game, and there's a freaking Taco Cabana logo on the field. WTF?! Screw the NFL...

I'll bet anything that they put ads in the uprights when somebody is about to kick a field goal

[LonghornFan]

It's so ****ing nice to have a QB who can actually read the field and not fall into a ball when a finger comes near his body. I cannot wait for the regular season to start. This offense has promise thanks to our new and very much improved "leader".

So damn glad I'll never have to watch Carr again. SO damn glad.

[JeopardE]

Jacoby Jones: this year's Devin Hester?

I'm just looking forward to seeing opposing teams try to make up their minds whether to kick to Mathis or Jones.

[JeopardE]

what's going on with Putzier? why has he been relegated to 2nd string?

Because Owen Daniels is probably one of the 10 best tight ends in the league?

[BigM]

what can you say about mario williams other than thank goodness for demeco ryans.

has he done anything more than occupy a position on the field? at this point i'm pretty confident you could pluck nearly any half-ass defensive end out of college and get the same production. he hasn't played in a real game in his second season yet, so i'm not going to be silly and call him a bust, but he's shockingly bad right now.

[Rocket River]

So damn glad I'll never have to watch Carr again. SO damn glad.

Well Carolin comes here. . . and the General McCain says Carr could be starting by then
So . . .. . . Yuo might be happy to watch Carr then

Rocket RIver

[rockmanslim]

just saw on sportscenter, merrill hodge compared schaub to leinart. in his opinion schaub has more upside than leinart, more poised under pressure than leinart, and he predicted schaub will have a better year than leinart.

i haven't seen schaub play at all. has he really looked that good so far? :eek:

[SWTsig]

how odd that i actually find myself anxiously anticipating this season.... just not having carr on the roster is reason enough for me.

[No Worries]

has he really looked that good so far?
No but he is NOT Carr, which is all that really matters.

[KingCheetah]

Offense looked sharp yesterday -- def made some big plays, but the Cards marched down the field pretty easy.

Mario...ug.

[Raven Lunatic]

In the first game, the pass to Walters that Walters dropped got me excited because it was a throw made with pressure right in Schaub's face.

In this game I got excited on the screen pass that Schaub threw to Dayne, I believe. Had it been any of our other RBs than him, it would be a big gain and maybe even 6. But the key thing was, Carr wouldn't have done it. He never could sell the screen well. It pretty much hasn't been a part of our offense for 5 years now.

[KingCheetah]

In this game I got excited on the screen pass that Schaub threw to Dayne, I believe.

There was one nice little screen to Gado for a big first down... oh wait Schaub was already out. NM.

[tulexan]

I think if our defense can be average or better, we are going to surprise a lot of people this year.

[solid]

Forty million dollars of Texans money is devoted to Mario Williams; what a waste of resources. Instead of two of the most exciting players in the NFL, the Texans picked Mario Williams. I told you they will NEVER live it down, a NFL-wide joke for many, many years to come.

[The Cat]

Forty million dollars of Texans money is devoted to Mario Williams; what a waste of resources. Instead of two of the most exciting players in the NFL, the Texans picked Mario Williams. I told you they will NEVER live it down, a NFL-wide joke for many, many years to come.

Yeah, who cares about actually being productive... they're exciting!!!!!!!!!! :rolleyes:

Mario hasn't looked good, but it's preseason, for one. Second, it's an absolutely absurd "joke" until those two players you speak of do something besides post a QB rating in the 60s and a YPC of higher than a meager 3.6.

It's so funny... when VY goes 5-for-17 and is sacked four times, it's irrelevant because it's "just the preseason." When Mario has a poor preseason game, it automatically makes him the biggest bust in the history of sports.

[Groogrux]

Forty million dollars of Texans money is devoted to Mario Williams; what a waste of resources. Instead of two of the most exciting players in the NFL, the Texans picked Mario Williams. I told you they will NEVER live it down, a NFL-wide joke for many, many years to come.

Dude, we know it was a bad pick, but if they win, they'll live it down. Quit being so melodramatic.

[SamFisher]

Quit being so melodramatic.


LOL.

For further examples of melodrama search "Rocketman95" and "Sage"

[VesceySux]

It's so funny... when VY goes 5-for-17 and is sacked four times, it's irrelevant because it's "just the preseason." When Mario has a poor preseason game, it automatically makes him the biggest bust in the history of sports.

Bad example. VY had what could be considered a successful rookie season, even going as far as winning ROY honors. Mario, despite nagging health issues, did not have a good year. Thus, VY is afforded more slack in the preseason, and Mario is dogged constantly.

[The Cat]

Bad example. VY had what could be considered a successful rookie season, even going as far as winning ROY honors. Mario, despite nagging health issues, did not have a good year. Thus, VY is afforded more slack in the preseason, and Mario is dogged constantly.

I don't care if Vince had a QB rating of over 100+ and Mario had zero sacks. That shouldn't affect the general principle of it. Either preseason can be used to make realistic evaluations, or it can't; and it shouldn't depend on who the player is (unless you're comparing a starter to a second or third string, or something like that).

[Mr. Clutch]

Yeah, who cares about actually being productive... they're exciting!!!!!!!!!! :rolleyes:

Mario hasn't looked good, but it's preseason, for one. Second, it's an absolutely absurd "joke" until those two players you speak of do something besides post a QB rating in the 60s and a YPC of higher than a meager 3.6.

It's so funny... when VY goes 5-for-17 and is sacked four times, it's irrelevant because it's "just the preseason." When Mario has a poor preseason game, it automatically makes him the biggest bust in the history of sports.

No one said VY performance was irrelevant, no one said Mario is the biggest bust in the history of sports because of one game.

Your arguing style is curious, to say the least. It must be hard to knock down all those straw men you put up.

Both VY and Bush have shown way more than Mario, will you argue with that?

[The Cat]

Both VY and Bush have shown way more than Mario, will you argue with that?

Absolutely not. But they're all a work in progress. I think it's fair to wait until VY and/or Bush have even a very good season (much less a great one) before declaring it "a joke" and that the Texans will "NEVER live it down."

[MadMax]

Absolutely not. But they're all a work in progress. I think it's fair to wait until VY and/or Bush have even a very good season (much less a great one) before declaring it "a joke" and that the Texans will "NEVER live it down."

Cat --

bottom line is, when you're #1 overall pick, much more is expected of you than mario has shown to date. we can all cross our fingers and hope it changes. but what we've seen so far ain't real good.

[The Cat]

Cat --

bottom line is, when you're #1 overall pick, much more is expected of you than mario has shown to date. we can all cross our fingers and hope it changes. but what we've seen so far ain't real good.

I agree. But the reality is that he played while very hurt for 75 percent of last season, so there's reason for at least guarded optimism. And I'm not going to throw that out the window and give up on him after a meaningless exhibition game. I'll agree that if he doesn't break through with a solid season, it will start to look real bad... but I'll wait until the games matter to say for sure.

[MadMax]

I agree. But the reality is that he played while very hurt for 75 percent of last season, so there's reason for at least guarded optimism. And I'm not going to throw that out the window and give up on him after a meaningless exhibition game. I'll agree that if he doesn't break through with a solid season, it will start to look real bad... but I'll wait until the games matter to say for sure.

even in an exhibition game...we're not talking rocket science. we're talking about the ability to beat your man...or at least look like you're close to beating your man. i'm not sure when the switch gets flipped.

[The Cat]

even in an exhibition game...we're not talking rocket science. we're talking about the ability to beat your man...or at least look like you're close to beating your man. i'm not sure when the switch gets flipped.

Players guaranteed starting roles aren't going anywhere close to full intensity in these games... it's more about avoiding injury.

[MadMax]

Players guaranteed starting roles aren't going anywhere close to full intensity in these games... it's more about avoiding injury.

someone on one side of the ball is winning each matchup on each play. someone somewhere is making plays. i'd like to see it be mario at some point. i don't think that's asking a whole lot.

[VesceySux]

I don't care if Vince had a QB rating of over 100+ and Mario had zero sacks. That shouldn't affect the general principle of it. Either preseason can be used to make realistic evaluations, or it can't; and it shouldn't depend on who the player is (unless you're comparing a starter to a second or third string, or something like that).

Once again, VY has shown something in the regular season; Mario has not. Thus, VY, although certainly not immune to criticism, is given more slack this preseason than Mario is, as he has less to prove. No, it may not be fair, but that's life. There are plenty of NFL players sucking it up in the preseason who are being treated the same way as VY, so it's not just some sort of "Jesus Vince Bias", either.

[Ottomaton]

Once again, VY has shown something in the regular season; Mario has not.

IMO this statement is not correct. There was a 5 game strech after an initial period of adjustment and before the plantar fasciitis (from MIA on Oct. 1 to NYG on Nov. 5) where Mario played very well.

[gucci888]

Players guaranteed starting roles aren't going anywhere close to full intensity in these games... it's more about avoiding injury.

I like your optomism but there is a reason why many of us have been extremely disappointed with Mario. We all understand that it is only the preseason...but he has yet to even make the stat sheet. Even worse, he isn't even getting close to the QB.

Bush and VY aren't great yet...but we've seen it from them. The same can't be said for Mario (yet).

[King1]

Bad example. VY had what could be considered a successful rookie season, even going as far as winning ROY honors. Mario, despite nagging health issues, did not have a good year. Thus, VY is afforded more slack in the preseason, and Mario is dogged constantly.


cosign on VY and he was a rookie QB. Plus, Bush caught 88 balls. He also looks like he knows how to play the game and actually tries on the field. I'm yet to see that out of mario. He hasn't even given us aa hint of enthusiasm on defense from his position.

[The Cat]

cosign on VY and he was a rookie QB. Plus, Bush caught 88 balls. He also looks like he knows how to play the game and actually tries on the field. I'm yet to see that out of mario. He hasn't even given us aa hint of enthusiasm on defense from his position.

I think it's a little silly for any of us to pass judgment on someone's enthusiasm when we're not on the practice field, not in the huddle and not on the sidelines. Tim Duncan doesn't exactly give much hints of enthusiasm, yet he's a pretty decent player at his sport. Trying doesn't always equate with pounding your chest.

[MadMax]

I think it's a little silly for any of us to pass judgment on someone's enthusiasm when we're not on the practice field, not in the huddle and not on the sidelines. Tim Duncan doesn't exactly give much hints of enthusiasm, yet he's a pretty decent player at his sport. Trying doesn't always equate with pounding your chest.

ok...i quit. he's awesome! :D

or, in the alterative...

i haven't seen enough...i need to give the #1 overall pick a full 3 years before I can have any sort of opinion about him at all.

[The Cat]

ok...i quit. he's awesome! :D

or, in the alterative...

i haven't seen enough...i need to give the #1 overall pick a full 3 years before I can have any sort of opinion about him at all.

hahaha. I'm definitely disappointed with him too, don't get me wrong. It's just the "he's not trying" argument is a pet peeve of mine, because none of us are really in a position to tell. Whatever the reason, he is absolutely the catalyst for how this defense will perform, and he needs to step it up from where he was a season ago. No question about it.

[JeopardE]

Actually, there are a lot of experts right now who think that Vince has serious issues and is probably going to suffer a nasty sophomore slump this year. Talk from Titans officials about how there's no point signing star receivers in Tennessee because VY isn't going to get them the ball in the right spots anyway, his style of play is still way too improvisational, and he lacks pocket presence. It's true he was OROY last year, and he does have those leadership qualities and all that, but his completion pct. last year is the same as this preseason ... barely above 50%, way too poor for a "superstar" quarterback. I saw that lick Harrison put on him in the NE game -- he actually looked like David Carr. Didn't even see the hit coming. If you asked me, I'm still disappointed that we haven't seen production from Mario, but I'd rather have Schaub at QB than Vince right now.

What's even more surprising is that it seems the success has gotten to his head already, and his head coach is making excuses for him publicly.

[A_3PO]

Actually, there are a lot of experts right now who think that Vince has serious issues and is probably going to suffer a nasty sophomore slump this year. Talk from Titans officials about how there's no point signing star receivers in Tennessee because VY isn't going to get them the ball in the right spots anyway, his style of play is still way too improvisational, and he lacks pocket presence. It's true he was OROY last year, and he does have those leadership qualities and all that, but his completion pct. last year is the same as this preseason ... barely above 50%, way too poor for a "superstar" quarterback. I saw that lick Harrison put on him in the NE game -- he actually looked like David Carr. Didn't even see the hit coming. If you asked me, I'm still disappointed that we haven't seen production from Mario, but I'd rather have Schaub at QB than Vince right now.

What's even more surprising is that it seems the success has gotten to his head already, and his head coach is making excuses for him publicly.
Ever since last season ended I thought the Titans would have a tough act to follow. They would have been better off with fewer wins because the expectations have been built too high. Their weak offseason has further conVINCEd me they will have a down year and Vince will have a very rough time. If he doesn't develop into a better passer, Vince won't even be as good as Michael Vick was because Vick's athleticism blows Vince's away. How much you wanna bet NFL defenses blitz him more, adjust tighter on his scrambling and reveal just how poor a passer and decision-maker he really (is at this point)? If last year's success has gone to VY's head, I overestimated him.

[King1]

I think it's a little silly for any of us to pass judgment on someone's enthusiasm when we're not on the practice field, not in the huddle and not on the sidelines. Tim Duncan doesn't exactly give much hints of enthusiasm, yet he's a pretty decent player at his sport. Trying doesn't always equate with pounding your chest.


I've watched him in college (as many highlights as I could find), last years entire preseason, entire season, and this years preseason and I've seen nothing. Tim Duncan came into the league and dominated from the start while mario has been a huge dissapointment. He had a rep for taking plays off in college and if you watch him play with us I noticed the same thing last year. i understand it's preseason but I'd like to see something other then him overrunning a play, just getting pushed back or simply standing up with an OL when he's gettign single covered. I mean the guy doesn't even get QB hurries

[King1]

I understand Schaub because he has looked good. I have heard a few negatives about VY but none of that. In fact, his teammates always rave about what a great leader he is. The point is Mario sucks so far.

[gucci888]

Actually, there are a lot of experts right now who think that Vince has serious issues and is probably going to suffer a nasty sophomore slump this year. Talk from Titans officials about how there's no point signing star receivers in Tennessee because VY isn't going to get them the ball in the right spots anyway, his style of play is still way too improvisational, and he lacks pocket presence. It's true he was OROY last year, and he does have those leadership qualities and all that, but his completion pct. last year is the same as this preseason ... barely above 50%, way too poor for a "superstar" quarterback. I saw that lick Harrison put on him in the NE game -- he actually looked like David Carr. Didn't even see the hit coming. If you asked me, I'm still disappointed that we haven't seen production from Mario, but I'd rather have Schaub at QB than Vince right now.

What's even more surprising is that it seems the success has gotten to his head already, and his head coach is making excuses for him publicly.

Where did you hear Titan officials talk about there not being a point to sign star receivers because of VY?

[SamFisher]

Ever since last season ended I thought the Titans would have a tough act to follow. They would have been better off with fewer wins because the expectations have been built too high. Their weak offseason has further conVINCEd me they will have a down year and Vince will have a very rough time.

Agreed, their weak offseason will lead to a weak real season and fisher's firing, I bet. They will probably have the same season as the Texans, about.

[A_3PO]

Agreed, their weak offseason will lead to a weak real season and fisher's firing, I bet. They will probably have the same season as the Texans, about.
OK, I'll go out on a limb and say the Texans will have a better record than the Titans. The two losses to them last year were two of the most senseless losses I've ever seen. I thought our talent was better but we gave them both games. This season, David Carr is replaced by two better QBs plus we had a good draft. The Titans talent level seems to be worse, especially without Pacman's big plays. Fisher is a goner.

BTW, I say this as someone who wants the Titans to do well because I want VY to succeed. But I'm a realist and it doesn't look good.

[ThePrivate]

OK, I'll go out on a limb and say the Texans will have a better record than the Titans. The two losses to them last year were two of the most senseless losses I've ever seen. I thought our talent was better but we gave them both games. This season, David Carr is replaced by two better QBs plus we had a good draft. The Titans talent level seems to be worse, especially without Pacman's big plays. Fisher is a goner.

BTW, I say this as someone who wants the Titans to do well because I want VY to succeed. But I'm a realist and it doesn't look good.

Not that difficult to predict since cheap azz Bud Adams didn't spend any money to sign quality free agents in the offseason! Same ole Bud.

You can take the cheap Bud out of Houston, but you can't take the cheap out of Bud!

[JeopardE]

Where did you hear Titan officials talk about there not being a point to sign star receivers because of VY?

I typed that offhand; should be "league officials". Here's the actual quote from SI:

Young's passing accuracy was another Achilles that we might be talking plenty about this year. It's hard to be precise when you're under so much pressure, but 5 of 17 won't cut it no matter what league you're playing in. And you can't claim that it was an aberration. He completed only 51.5 percent as a rookie, and a source within the league told me recently that one reason the Titans don't really need great receivers on their roster is because Young can't be counted on to put the ball in their hands anyway.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/writers/don_banks/08/18/snap.judgments/index.html

[VesceySux]

Ugh. This thread has gotten off-track. Sorry for even bringing up Vince's name (in an analogy, no less).

[Ric]

hahaha. I'm definitely disappointed with him too, don't get me wrong. It's just the "he's not trying" argument is a pet peeve of mine, because none of us are really in a position to tell. Whatever the reason, he is absolutely the catalyst for how this defense will perform, and he needs to step it up from where he was a season ago. No question about it.
the biggest concern with mario is that a lot of the whispers we heard leading up to the draft - engine idled too often, lacked definitive moves, too often a non-factor - are, at least from afar, looking ominously accurate.

but, it is the preseason. and this regime has hit on so many other players in their two drafts that i'm willing to give mario a much longer leash. i still think he's going to be a beast once okoye gets comfortable, etc.