Suns next face luxury-tax issues

[hooroo]

http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/sports/articles/0519sunslose0519.html
Suns next face luxury-tax issues

Paul Coro
The Arizona Republic
May. 19, 2007 12:00 AM

SAN ANTONIO - The Suns say goodbye to each other today without knowing what type of goodbye each player is receiving.

Anything less than a championship was painted as a disappointment since October's training camp in Italy.

Regular-season success is not so palatable anymore for the three-time defending Pacific Division champions because this was expected to be Phoenix's best shot at attaining the team's first NBA title.

After two Western Conference finals visits, the Suns exited a round earlier this year. They left the playoffs Friday as the top remaining seed and now face an off-season of decisions.

The Suns are facing a luxury-tax hit estimated at $12 million if they return all of their core players and draft and sign three first-round picks. To avoid the luxury tax or at least lessen the burden, the Suns don't have to act this summer.

The luxury tax is levied based on teams' payrolls at the close of the February trade deadline so Phoenix could keep things largely intact and make a call based on a half-season's performance.

Feeling like they were wronged in missing Amaré Stoudemire and Boris Diaw because of suspensions in a Game 5 loss against San Antonio, the Suns may not believe payroll slashing has to take place.

Shawn Marion's name regularly surfaces in off-season trade talks - not just in rumors. Marion has two years worth $33.6 million on his contract.

Kurt Thomas is expected to pick up his player option, which is worth $8.1 million for next season.

The future of Marcus Banks will be considered after he failed to establish himself as the Steve Nash backup the Suns envisioned when they gave him a five-year, $21 million contract last summer.

Phoenix leaps over the luxury tax threshold, a dollar-for-dollar tax on teams, this year because contract extensions for Diaw ($9 million next season) and Leandro Barbosa ($5.6 million) kick in on a team paying maximum deals to Marion and Stoudemire and a near-maximum deal for Steve Nash.

Next up for the Suns is Tuesday's draft lottery. If Atlanta does not land one of the top three picks, Phoenix will acquire the Hawks' choice to complete the Diaw-Joe Johnson deal. Phoenix also gets Cleveland's pick at No. 21 and its own at No. 29.

Suns assistant coach Marc Iavaroni will also be in the mix for coaching openings in Memphis and Sacramento.

[thumbs]

I wonder how the Rockets can "help" them out by taking a player or draft pick off their hands. Hmmmmm. How do our trade exceptions look?

[Rocket River]

Maybe the Rockets can get in on some of this

Rocket River
GET THOSE DRAFT PICKS!!

[BroadwayBelm]

Welllll if they land that number 4 pick, next year will be there best chance.



Stupid made up rumor. They land the number 4 pick, and say CHarlotte or someone gets the number 2 and Durant. PHX trades number 4, Marion, and a future 1st round pick, hell 2 of them maybe, for Kevin Durant.

Marion can play his ass of on defense, but in one year, KD will already be more potent on offense.

[A_3PO]

Other teams will want those picks. Other teams have assets the Suns want, unlike the Rockets.

[ghettocheeze]

Don't worry Phoenix has many option this offseason and they could be legitimate suitors for a KG trade if they offer Marion and 4th pick. Same goes for Jermaine O'Neal. They have some good players they can package in trades and get one blockbuster type player to put them over them hump. I don't know why but I would really like to see KG get out of that frozen hell in Minnesota and salvage his career with someone like Nash it would be feel good story to see two great team players get a championship together.

[c1utchfan925]

i agree with you, i really want KG to succeed. still tracy getting over his own hump would be more of a feat. man hopefully this offseason won't be as bad as the playoff series was.. 5-6 more months.. ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

[sbyang]

I don't get the KG thing, the whole reason Phoenix is considering trading players is to avoid the tax, KG's huge salary would push them well into tax land.

It would be a shame if Marion/STAT gets traded for 50 cents on the dollar just because their owner is cheap.

[Ziggy]

They should bite the bullet and go all out. Screw the luxury tax. At least for 1 season.

[hooroo]

Don't worry Phoenix has many option this offseason and they could be legitimate suitors for a KG trade if they offer Marion and 4th pick. Same goes for Jermaine O'Neal. They have some good players they can package in trades and get one blockbuster type player to put them over them hump. I don't know why but I would really like to see KG get out of that frozen hell in Minnesota and salvage his career with someone like Nash it would be feel good story to see two great team players get a championship together.

Those guys would only add to their salary problem. Robert Sarver has said he doesn't want to pay the luxury tax. Though more recently D'Antonio has mentioned they can go over but will be looking to minimise the lux tax damage. I don't think it's a change of heart on Sarver's part just a more realistic option of what the front office Suns can do.

The Suns could dump Kurt Thomas to a under the salary cap for nothing or Diaw for a pick and they would still be paying luxury tax.

Could the Rockets get in on this? They could exchange Sura & Lucas's contracts who could save a team up to 4.2m. They might hold an advantage over teams with trade exceptions cause those can't be packaged and no team has one over 3m I think. So it's possible they could get in as a third team in a 3-way trade to pick up the crumbs in a bigger deal.

[ghettocheeze]

Those guys would only add to their salary problem. Robert Sarver has said he doesn't want to pay the luxury tax. Though more recently D'Antonio has mentioned they can go over but will be looking to minimise the lux tax damage. I don't think it's a change of heart on Sarver's part just a more realistic option of what the front office Suns can do.

The Suns could dump Kurt Thomas to a under the salary cap for nothing or Diaw for a pick and they would still be paying luxury tax.

Could the Rockets get in on this? They could exchange Sura & Lucas's contracts who could save a team up to 4.2m. They might hold an advantage over teams with trade exceptions cause those can't be packaged and no team has one over 3m I think. So it's possible they could get in as a third team in a 3-way trade to pick up the crumbs in a bigger deal.

Minnesota
KG - 22 million

Phoenix
Marion - 15 mil

So to make up the difference Phoenix might dump a contract like Kurt Thomas 8 million total 23 milllion close enough.

Remember KG could become a free agent at the end of next summer and any such trade would be on condition that KG takes a pay cut to play for a championship contender.

I think KG might actually take a pay cut especially since he wants to win badly and he already has banked in over 200 million.

This would clear a lot of room for Phoenix salary wise. They would have to pay the tax for only one year and get a dominant player for 3-4 years to come.

[hooroo]

Minny have lux tax problems of their own. Besides what your proposing is that they take on Marion as their franchise player instead.

[ghettocheeze]

Minny have lux tax problems of their own. Besides what your proposing is that they take on Marion as their franchise player instead.

Plus the 4th overall pick from the Hawks which could be another solid player like Al Halford or Brandon Wright. Again I don't see many teams in the NBA with enough quality players to package a deal for KG. Remember KG could just walk away in 2008 and leave the Wolves with nothing in return.

You tell me would you say no to a possible rebuilding process which includes

1) Shawn Marion
2) Randy Foye
3) 4th pick (Wright or Halford)
4) 7th Pick (Minesota's own pick maybe Jeff Green or Corey Brewer)

Those are some nice pieces to rebuild with and quickly do so. Again factor in KG's possible departure in 08 and it would be hard for Minnesota to say no.

[BroadwayBelm]

Shawn Marion + #4 pic + the other 1st round pics + a future #1


for


Kevin Durant aka the #2 pic.

[ghettocheeze]

Shawn Marion + #4 pic + the other 1st round pics + a future #1


for


Kevin Durant aka the #2 pic.

Sorry but no one will take such a trade no matter hoe many picks you add. Kevin Durant and Greg Oden are untouchable at this point. They are the top prospects to come out in a decade. Franchise players don't get traded on draft day especially one who has been so publicized and hyped. Durant at this point is a better talent than Lebron was back in 2003. He has a better shooting game and low post ability. Oden is once in a lifetime kind of players both will not be traded no matter what.

[Steve_Francis_rules]

They are the top prospects to come out in a decade.

What about Lebron?

[Nice Rollin]

i wish somehow we could get Shawn De Glass...aka Shawn Marion

[ghettocheeze]

What about Lebron?

True centers are very hard to find these days especially one like Oden who I would put behind Shaq and Hakeem as the best center prospect in the past 20 years.

Lebron was a huge prospect before he ever declared for the draft. But there have been guys like him before like Kobe. Kevin Durant is perhaps the most polished 6-10 wingman I have ever seen. He is a shooting guard in the body of a PF and the speed and agility of a PG. Lebron was more of PG type, most scouts said he resembled Magic Johnson with more athleticism and size. Durant is one of those freakish hybrid types like Garnett who are redefining their positions.

Durant's jumpshot and range is what separates him from Lebron at the time.

[BroadwayBelm]

True centers are very hard to find these days especially one like Oden who I would put behind Shaq and Hakeem as the best center prospect in the past 20 years.

Lebron was a huge prospect before he ever declared for the draft. But there have been guys like him before like Kobe. Kevin Durant is perhaps the most polished 6-10 wingman I have ever seen. He is a shooting guard in the body of a PF and the speed and agility of a PG. Lebron was more of PG type, most scouts said he resembled Magic Johnson with more athleticism and size. Durant is one of those freakish hybrid types like Garnett who are redefining their positions.

Durant's jumpshot and range is what separates him from Lebron at the time.


No. No sir. No one has ever had as much hype coming out of HS as LeBron. No one. And you would put Oden ahead of Ewing as a prospect? I mean hind sight's 20/20, but Ewing might of been the greatest Center prospect since Wilt.

If LeBron was in this year's class as a HS. He would still go ahead of Oden and Durant imo.

[Desert Scar]

I don't get the KG thing, the whole reason Phoenix is considering trading players is to avoid the tax, KG's huge salary would push them well into tax land.


Do they care about championship shots, or lux tax?


It would be a shame if Marion/STAT gets traded for 50 cents on the dollar just because their owner is cheap.

They would not trade them just because they are pricey, they would trade them because the combination doesn't work in the playoffs. Marion excells in many areas but is a half court offensive non-factor. Amare is an individual defensive non-factor and really gets his half court offense, though it is efficient, off of others. This combo hasn't worked. Nash is gettign older, they need another big time option to turn to when he isn't on the floor. Another creator and dominant player.

KG makes a lot of sense to me. I'll have the think about what would be fair. I'd start with Amare (about even on his own given age difference OR Marion + Atl pick (if 4 or 5) + filler.

[ghettocheeze]

No. No sir. No one has ever had as much hype coming out of HS as LeBron. No one. And you would put Oden ahead of Ewing as a prospect? I mean hind sight's 20/20, but Ewing might of been the greatest Center prospect since Wilt.

If LeBron was in this year's class as a HS. He would still go ahead of Oden and Durant imo.

We are not typing about HYPE here.

Yes Lebron was HYPED beyond any athlete ever. But that was the result of his media machine which put him on ESPN for high school games.

I was talking about skill set and pure raw talent. Scouts would still put Greg Oden ahead of Lebron in my opinion even teams would have him ranked higher. It's the same reason Hakeem went ahead of Jordan back in the day.

Again Ewing was HYPED because of the NY media when the Knicks had the 1st pick. Shaq to me was probably the most complete center prospect ever. See in the era of Wilt there wasn't this kind of scrutiny on player scouting and watching ever single tape and hiring dozens of scouts.

I still believe a team will go for a center like Oden over a wingman like Lebron almost every time.

Lebron is pure HYPE and Oden is RARE in the history basketball.

[BroadwayBelm]

Lebron is pure HYPE and Oden is RARE in the history basketball.


i agree on the Oden part and that has been my philosophy as well. But LeBron was not just HYPE; he didn't have a NY media hyping him up, the whole nation hyped him up. He had all that hype because of the unreal amount of talent he had in HS.

It is a fair argument, who would go first if they were in the same draft, LeBron or Oden? I understand the rare center thing, but I don't think there has ever been a wing prospect, or a prospect in general, ever as hyped up as LeBron, thus I think he would go ahead of Oden.

I mean some teams are "considering" Durant over Oden...if some teams are doing that, imagine how many would consider LeBron over Oden. Durant's got a sweet jumper though lol.

[ghettocheeze]

i agree on the Oden part and that has been my philosophy as well. But LeBron was not just HYPE; he didn't have a NY media hyping him up, the whole nation hyped him up. He had all that hype because of the unreal amount of talent he had in HS.

It is a fair argument, who would go first if they were in the same draft, LeBron or Oden? I understand the rare center thing, but I don't think there has ever been a wing prospect, or a prospect in general, ever as hyped up as LeBron, thus I think he would go ahead of Oden.

I mean some teams are "considering" Durant over Oden...if some teams are doing that, imagine how many would consider LeBron over Oden. Durant's got a sweet jumper though lol.

I think Lebron getting some much hype was because he was the clear cut favorite. I mean there was nobody close to him in the draft.

Darko Milicic - was unknown at the time and nobody thought we would go second to Lebron.

Carmelo Anthony - He had a big NCAA tournament and but people still doubted that he could carry it over to the next level.

Dwayne Wade - The steal of the draft but he was again not that polished and relied too much on his explosive 1st step. Lacked mid range game and scouts thought he was undersized a wingman trapped in a pg type body.

All these factors made Lebron that much more appealing. If Kevin Durant was alone in this year's draft then he would probably get the same hype.

I think we can both agree Oden may not be the better player compared to Lebron or Durant but again in terms of prospects Oden is too good to give up and so if all 3 were in the draft they would go like Oden, Lebron and Durant.

All 30 teams would take Oden 1st but some teams might switch Lebron and Durant as they are very similar and interchangeable. Centers are the most the valuable commodity in the league.

[Steve_Francis_rules]

I think Lebron getting some much hype was because he was the clear cut favorite. I mean there was nobody close to him in the draft.


I have to disagree here. Lebron didn't start getting hyped up right before the draft. He was on the cover of SI as a HS junior. Lebron is the bigger prospect by far.

And you compared him to Kobe in an earlier post. Kobe wasn't even close as he lasted until the double digits in the draft.

[ubigred]

Suns will never win a championship or even go to the Finals!

Their best chance was in 05 with joe johnson and quitten richardson.

Its all down hill from here!

Suns = Kings

[ubigred]

I have to disagree here. Lebron didn't start getting hyped up right before the draft. He was on the cover of SI as a HS junior. Lebron is the bigger prospect by far.

And you compared him to Kobe in an earlier post. Kobe wasn't even close as he lasted until the double digits in the draft.

I agree.


"King James" = the next MJ. Case closed.

[ghettocheeze]

I agree.


"King James" = the next MJ. Case closed.

People I am amazed how soon this turned into "Who is the next MJ?" contest. I thought we were just talking about DRAFT PROSPECTS. No one was debating LBJ's future or how good he is. All I was trying to say is that if you put Lebron and Greg Oden in the same draft as PROSPECTS then it is my opinion that Oden goes off the board first no matter who is drafting. People is that so hard to understand without turning this into a pissing contest?

[Rocket River]

I think Lebron getting some much hype was because he was the clear cut favorite. I mean there was nobody close to him in the draft.

Carmelo Anthony - He had a big NCAA tournament and but people still doubted that he could carry it over to the next level.



Carmelo PROVED it against College talent
while Lebron was dominating kids

Rocket River
that was my take. . . i guess i was wrong

[hooroo]

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/basketball/bulls/cs-070520smith,1,3557632.column?coll=cs-bulls-headlines
The Suns wanted to get together to commiserate following their controversial playoff loss to the Spurs, and Amare Stoudemire missed the Saturday meeting. Coach Mike D'Antoni dismissed his absence with a joke, but D'Antoni and star point guard Steve Nash concede the Suns have chemistry issues. In addition, managing partner Robert Sarver soon will take complete control of the franchise from Jerry Colangelo, and D'Antoni knows Sarver is concerned about being in luxury tax territory.

"We have to be careful tinkering with this too much," D'Antoni told Phoenix reporters. "You can get an All-Star out of the draft. I don't want to think we've got to go crazy."

[pirc1]

Could Rocket get Marion from the Suns? That would be very helpful. or Barbosa!

[BroadwayBelm]

I think we can both agree Oden may not be the better player compared to Lebron or Durant but again in terms of prospects Oden is too good to give up and so if all 3 were in the draft they would go like Oden, Lebron and Durant.



lol after reading this article I might agree and digress, but it's one hell of a toss up imo.

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/draft2007/insider/columns/story?columnist=ford_chad&page=DraftWatch-Oden


INDIANAPOLIS -- Greg Oden's been called many things: the next Tim Duncan, a future Hall of Famer, a dead ringer for Grandpa LeBron.

But "exciting" and "explosive" aren't usually the first words that come to mind. When we're talking about this year's draft, those adjectives are more commonly applied to Oden's primary competition for the No. 1 pick in the draft -- Texas forward Kevin Durant.


Brian Spurlock/US Presswire

Oden will soon be roaming the paint in an NBA arena near you.

Oden is usually thought of as the big guy with the back-to-the-basket game, the guy who will be a stalwart on the defensive end of the floor. He's regarded as primarily a shot-blocker, a rebounder.

So as I walked into an Indiana gym that looks like a barn in the middle of a cornfield to see Oden, my expectations weren't that great.

I assumed Oden would dunk the ball. Show his improving post game. Maybe flex a little bit. And we'd all go home.

The big surprise


Oden has been spending his afternoons at the St. Vincent Sports Performance Center to work on strength and conditioning.

When Oden walks through the door, he fills the door frame, briefly blocking out the light from the outside world. He is enormous.

Joakim Noah told me in Los Angeles that you always know when Oden is on the floor. He doesn't have to be doing much. His size changes everything.

Oden measures 6-foot-11½ in socks and 7-1 in shoes, and he weighs around 260. His wingspan is an impressive 7-5, and his standing reach nearly 9-3. Those measurements provide the biggest reason most scouts think Oden should be the No. 1 pick. In a league devoid of big, traditional centers -- Oden's numbers add up to a perfect 10.

Everything else is supposed to be gravy.

But when St. Vincent director Ralph Reiff warned that I was in for a surprise, he wasn't kidding.

Oden's agility, flexibility, balance and explosiveness are remarkable for a player his size. He's a 2 guard in a center's body.

Clearly Oden is more than a big stiff who's learned how to play basketball. He's an athlete who happens to be 7 feet tall.

In the span of an hour, there wasn't a drill point guard Mike Conley could do that Oden couldn't do. In the strength department, we'd expect that and more. But in terms of athleticism and agility, you have to see it to believe it.

Remember that ridiculous dunk he tried against Georgetown -- the one when he took off from a little inside the free-throw line? That type of play should be a staple of his NBA game.

Five weeks ago when he started workouts, Oden measured a 38-inch vertical jump with three steps. That's a number just below what guys like Tyrus Thomas and Rudy Gay produced last year. Since then, he's been working on his explosiveness every day, so that number might even improve by the time he's tested in Orlando.

Combine Oden's height, reach and jumping ability, and you have a guy who can touch the 12-3 mark on the backboard -- 2 feet, 3 inches above the rim.

All that and a handle

Oden's basketball training is being handled by former Nets assistant coach Ed Schilling of the Champions Academy. Schilling has coached in high school, at college (as an assistant at UMass and Memphis and as a head coach at Wright State) and as an assistant in the NBA. He ran Kobe Bryant's workout for the Nets when Bryant was coming into the league.

"I think I have a certain empathy with where these guys are right now," Schilling said. "I've coached where they were last year as high school players. I've coached where they are this year as college players. And I've coached where they'll be next year, the NBA. Each league produces its own set of challenges. I'm trying to get them to be able to meet the next one in the NBA."


Win McNamee/Getty Images

Mike Conley Jr.'s not the only Buckeye prospect with handle.

Schilling spends the first half of the workout doing dribbling drills involving two basketballs. They're the type of drills you expect point guards to excel at. But for big guys like Oden? It's usually more like a loose-ball drill, with the player chasing the basketballs around the gym.

Schilling starts the timer and goes. Conley looks amazing, with excellent speed and control as he moves through a series of drills that test both his left and right hands. Oden nearly matches him, though. He doesn't have the speed of Conley, but he has impressive control of the basketball.

Right hand. Left hand. Behind the back. Between the legs. Oden handles the ball with amazing dexterity for a big guy.

"No one is expecting the guy to bring the ball up the floor or run the offense," Schilling said. "But it does show what a great athlete the kid is. Many guards struggle with these drills. What he can do at his size is amazing."

From there, Schilling has Oden and company running full-court drills. They take the ball, weave through dummies, cross over and then finish with a dunk or layup. Then Oden sprints to the other end of the floor, posts up one of Schilling's assistants and finishes with a baby hook.

As they run the drill over and over again, we get our first chance to check out one of Oden's biggest weaknesses in college -- his stamina.

Oden explains that his wrist injury suffered last summer kept him from getting into playing shape until the end of the season.

"I don't really think people saw the real Greg Oden," he says. "I really just went out there and played the first chance I got. I didn't get time to really practice with the team or get my legs back. They needed me and I rushed back. It wasn't until the end of the season that I really felt like I was getting into the flow and had the legs I needed to help carry the team."

Oden and Schilling say the injury also gave people the wrong idea about Oden's skill level around the basket. He was finally cleared on Monday by doctors for the full range of motion in his right wrist.

"It's feeling good," Oden said. "It's not a hundred percent, but I can do most of the things I used to be able to do with it."

As the workout continues, Oden plants down low alongside Purdue's Carl Landry and works on a number of post moves around the basket. His hands are soft. His hook shot is smooth. And most everything Oden lobs up finds its way in the basket. While he's been working on a midrange jumper to increase his arsenal, it's his work down on the post that is most impressive.

"He really has great footwork," Schilling said. "I know people say he's raw, but his footwork is pretty advanced for a big guy. He has great balance and quickness and he knows where he is. He still needs work, but I think too many people jumped to conclusions about his basketball skill. Defense may be his main staple in the NBA, but he's pretty impressive offensively too."

Schilling runs the workout for almost two hours, and Oden, tired and soaked with sweat, finishes it.

"His stamina still isn't what it needs to be," Schilling admits. "But it's greatly improved. I think by the time of the draft, he'll be in great shape for the summer league."

Is Oden the real Mr. Upside?


Andy Lyons/Getty Images

There's a lot more to Greg Oden's game than dunking the ball.

For the most part, the soft-spoken Oden deflects most of my questions about the draft. He says he doesn't care who wins the lottery. Doesn't care if he goes No. 1. Doesn't care if he and Conley finally have to part ways after spending the last six years as teammates.

Which raises this question, a big one in the minds of many NBA scouts: Does Greg Oden care about basketball?

The workouts suggest that he does.

Like Yao Ming and LeBron James before him, Oden won't have to work out for teams. He doesn't have to prepare for a job interview like most other prospects. Even if he were holed up in a dorm somewhere watching DVDs all day, he would still go No. 1 or No. 2 in the draft.

Instead he's here every day, four to five days a week, working like crazy on his game.

"I don't have any hobbies," Oden says with a smile when I ask him what else he likes to do besides playing basketball. "I like to watch movies, I guess. Movies, basketball and sleep. That's it."

But is he ready for that to be his life?

According to the training and coaching staff, yes. Oden has shown them he's a dedicated worker, someone who goes nonstop. He carries six basketballs with him wherever he goes.

"He doesn't want to just be good at this," Schilling says. "He wants to be the best. I see no reason he can't be."

Sunday night, after I described Oden's workout to a respected NBA general manager who stands a pretty good chance at getting the No. 1 pick in Tuesday's lottery, the GM had four words for me:

"I told you so."

He continued, "Oden is not just a big guy. He's a big guy with great athleticism and skill. It's what I've been telling you all year. This guy is a lock as the No. 1 pick.

"If Kevin Durant had broken his wrist and come back way early with a cast on his shooting hand, I don't think he would've dominated the Big 12.

"We haven't seen the real Greg Oden yet. What we've seen is 50 percent. That's enough to make him the No. 1 pick.

"If we saw it all, we'd laugh about the Durant comparisons. Don't get me wrong, Durant can play. He may be great. But I'm taking Greg Oden. My guess is every GM in the league will too once they see him up close."

As someone who was more impressed with Durant's college play, I hate to admit it, but the GM may be right. I still have questions about Oden's motor, and I still wonder whether he loves the game like Durant does. I don't know for sure if those skills he shows in workouts will show up in NBA games.

The Durant-Oden debate usually supposes that Durant has the bigger "upside" and Oden is the "safer" pick.

But after watching Oden on Sunday, I have to say that his upside may be bigger than that of anyone else in the draft.

Chad Ford covers the NBA for ESPN Insider.

[BroadwayBelm]

I agree.


"King James" = the next MJ. Case closed.


As long as the Rox aren't winning the championship, I hope King James wins 8 titles, but here is something I read a few days ago that makes sense and stopped me from making the "MJ comparison."


UPDATE: Kelly Dwyer of SI.com emailed a great response to this post:

I grew up in and out of Chicago and never really knew anything besides all-out, borderline-scary effort because of Mike. I never understood why Barkley, Robinson, or even Magic (in his later years) never seemed to be able to dominate in the same, cruel, way. Never got it. To me, for a while, it was the only way to think -- you get out of bed thinking "win," and screw anyone who wants to get in your way.

But you'll never see me trashing someone in comparison to Michael. Nobody came close to him. Nobody was that psychotic, really, and it's not fair to expect other humans to act as dysfunctional as Mike. That dysfunction brought championships to my favorite team, it made me proud to be a Chicagoan, it colored my winters and springs with memories of championship runs and near-misses, and it was the most fun I'll ever have as a basketball fan.

But I'd be a fool to expect any player, no matter how talented, no matter how determined, to act in the same way he did.

Because nobody's ever acted like that. Russell's the closest, but even he was breaking bread with Wilt the night before. So, when I trash LeBron for not rebounding more and going coast-to-coast, or Vince Carter for shooting fadeaways, or Dirk for acting as he did in that first round -- it's mainly because I want them to be more like Dwyane Wade. Not like Mike. Not even Kobe (who still shoots too many perimeter jumpers). Be like Wade -- put your head down and get to the front of that rim. Expecting anyone to be like Mike, on or off the court, that's just too damn much.


If you want to check out the entry its referring to, its the one dated May 18, 2007 "What, exactly, did MJ teach us" http://myespn.go.com/nba/truehoop

[RocketForever]

The Suns could dump Kurt Thomas to a under the salary cap for nothing or Diaw for a pick and they would still be paying luxury tax.

I don't think they will dump Kurt Thomas. He is their only legitimate defender in the paint. If you have read the Suns boards lately, Amare has scored a bunch of points in the playoff but he is being bashed left and right by the Suns fans for being a liability in defense. They will let Kurt Thomas go only if they can get another low post defender.

[Desert Scar]

Carmelo PROVED it against College talent
while Lebron was dominating kids

Rocket River
that was my take. . . i guess i was wrong

I was with you too. Not that Melo is a bad player. He is still close to a top 10 player in the league.


Suns will never win a championship or even go to the Finals!

Their best chance was in 05 with joe johnson and quitten richardson.

Its all down hill from here!

Suns = Kings

This Suns team is built better for the playoffs. With Bell and Thomas (along with Marion) they have much better defense. The Suns were very close to beating SA and probably winning the title. Had Amare or Diaw kept their butts on the bench or had Barbosa not got worked into a funk where he misses his normal shots--the Suns probably win. They were not that close before even with Johnson.

How about some trades:

Marion + Thomas + their 3 first rounders for KG (probably 4/5, 24, 29)
Minny could then look to dump Marion for picks and expiring contracts.

OR

Amare + Diaw + pick 24 for KG

or this one with Minnesotta getting all 1st round picks from both teams plus another from us down the line...I think we could sub Snyder for VS is that is what Minny wanted, 1 less contract year

Phoenix Trade Breakdown
Outgoing
Shawn Marion
6-7 PF from UNLV
17.5 ppg, 9.8 rpg, 1.7 apg in 37.6 minutes
Kurt Thomas
6-9 C from Texas Christian
4.6 ppg, 5.7 rpg, 0.4 apg in 18.1 minutes
Marcus Banks
6-2 PG from UNLV
4.9 ppg, 0.8 rpg, 1.3 apg in 11.1 minutes
Incoming
Rafer Alston
6-2 PG from Frenso State
13.3 ppg, 3.4 rpg, 5.4 apg in 37.0 minutes
Kevin Garnett
6-11 PF from Farragut Academy (HS)
22.4 ppg, 12.8 rpg, 4.1 apg in 39.5 minutes
Change in team outlook: +8.7 ppg, -0.1 rpg, and +6.1 apg.


Houston Trade Breakdown
Outgoing
Shane Battier
6-8 SF from Duke
10.1 ppg, 4.1 rpg, 2.1 apg in 36.5 minutes
Rafer Alston
6-2 PG from Frenso State
13.3 ppg, 3.4 rpg, 5.4 apg in 37.0 minutes
Bob Sura
6-5 from Florida State
No games yet played in 2006/07
Vassilis Spanoulis
6-3 PG from Greece (Foreign)
2.7 ppg, 0.7 rpg, 0.9 apg in 8.7 minutes
Incoming
Shawn Marion
6-7 PF from UNLV
17.5 ppg, 9.8 rpg, 1.7 apg in 37.6 minutes
Marcus Banks
6-2 PG from UNLV
4.9 ppg, 0.8 rpg, 1.3 apg in 11.1 minutes
Change in team outlook: -3.7 ppg, +2.4 rpg, and -5.4 apg.


Minnesota Trade Breakdown
Outgoing
Kevin Garnett
6-11 PF from Farragut Academy (HS)
22.4 ppg, 12.8 rpg, 4.1 apg in 39.5 minutes
Incoming
Kurt Thomas
6-9 C from Texas Christian
4.6 ppg, 5.7 rpg, 0.4 apg in 18.1 minutes
Shane Battier
6-8 SF from Duke
10.1 ppg, 4.1 rpg, 2.1 apg in 36.5 minutes
Bob Sura
6-5 from Florida State
No games yet played in 2006/07
Vassilis Spanoulis
6-3 PG from Greece (Foreign)
2.7 ppg, 0.7 rpg, 0.9 apg in 8.7 minutes
Change in team outlook: -5.0 ppg, -2.3 rpg, and -0.7 apg.

Successful Scenario
Due to Phoenix, Houston, and Minnesota being over the cap, the 25% trade rule is invoked. Phoenix, Houston, and Minnesota had to be no more than 125% plus $100,000 of the salary given out for the trade to be accepted, which did happen here. This trade satisfies the provisions of the Collective Bargaining Agreement.

[/b]

Phx gets KG and upgrades the back-up 1 (Banks for Alston) for Marion, Thomas (expiring contract)

Houston gets Marion and takes on Banks for Battier, Alston and mostly expiring contracts and picks.

Minny gets Battier + mostly expiring contracts (Thomas, Sura, etc) and gains five 1st round picks (4 this year, 1 future one from us).

Minny this year would have probably the 4th pick (Phx/Atl), 7th pick (own), 24 (Phx/Cle), 26 (Hou), 29 (Phx), 41 (own) for this deep draft. Lots of talent to build on (could try to land Oden/Durant via trade of 4 + 7, or just stand pat) and be in great cap shape for 08/09 and thereafter.

[Icehouse]

Can't we just give cash for one of the Suns picks? Haven't teams done that in the past?

[xiki]

'Simple' :D ... offer Phoenix Sura and Juwann for Banks and Diaw and Atlanta's #5 (if that is the one) and voila, Suns' lux tax problems end and the Rox are on the precipice.