[Official] Cardinals @ Astros

[Cannonball]

Since Castor hasn't made one yet, I will.

All series talk goes in here. DO NOT GIVE PLAY-BY-PLAY! If you need PBP try Yahoo, ESPN, or Sportsline.

4-6 -- Adam Wainwright, RHP (0-0, -.--) vs. Wandy Rodriguez, RHP (0-0, -.--) 7:05 on FSN

4-7 -- Anthony Reyes, RHP (0-0, -.--) vs. Roy Oswalt, RHP (0-0, 1.17) 6:05 on FSN

4-8 -- Kip Wells, RHP (0-1, 3.00) vs. Jason Jennings, RHP (0-0, 1.50) 1:05 on FSN

[The Cat]

That was a strike three right down the plate to Duncan. If Wandy gets squeezed like this all night, this team will be in trouble.

[codell]

Did anyone just catch that?

Wandy walked off the mound and blew a snot rocket right there on national TV.

:eek: :eek:

[Cannonball]

Did anyone just catch that?

Wandy walked off the mound and blew a snot rocket right there on national TV.

:eek: :eek:

Well, local TV anyways. But yeah, I saw it. Nice spray. 7 out of 10.

[The Cat]

Well, local TV anyways. But yeah, I saw it. Nice spray. 7 out of 10.

It was on FSN Midwest too. I saw it. :D

[codell]

That was a first.

I've seen crotch grabbing, nose picking, etc.

It was incredible that you could actually see the spray. Thank god it wasn't in HD!

[Nick]

Baggy would be a better broadcaster than Drexler.

[Nick]

Adam Wainwright teeing off... bad Wandy about to emerge?

[russian88]

Willy T would have had that. Our offense SUCKS!

[The Cat]

Willie would have had that. Our offense SUCKS!

Willy would also be a black hole offensively. There's only so many of those you can have.

Also, there are a lot of offenses that would look terrible against Adam Wainwright.

[Nick]

Willy T would have had that. Our offense SUCKS!

It still would have been close... Willy T plays a close CF, and he would have been in for the pitcher's AB. Even still, the ball was hit on the screws... a HR at most parks.

[Nick]

Yep... its Bad Wandy.

But Garner will probably point to his first 2 innings of solid shutout ball and say, "He got us off to a good start."

[WhoMikeJames]

Wandy off to his usual start.

[russian88]

Wandy sucks too.

[rocketfat]

keep startin wandy phil! he's young, and more importantly, he's a LEFTY!

just give him like 20 more starts this season. he's bound to get his stuff together.

[dockerland]

Another great start for the Stro's

[russian88]

0-4 here we come. Looks like 2000 all over again.

[Nick]

0-4 here we come. Looks like 2000 all over again.

We started off 2000 2-1, then 3-3.

[sammy]

what a depressing night for Houston sports

[The Cat]

How many balls has Wandy had out at the track or narrowly foul? It could be much, much worse... hope Garner is noticing.

[Nick]

How many balls has Wandy had out at the track or narrowly foul? It could be much, much worse... hope Garner is noticing.

He won't... he'll notice how Wandy hit his spots early in the game, got some outs, and just made one bad pitch (so far).

Garner reminds me of V-span fans, when it comes to Wandy.

[Nick]

Does Carlos Lee always swing at the first pitch? For a guy that strikes out as little has he does, that's a disturbing trait.

Then again, he does do something we needed more of last year (getting a runner home from 3rd with less than 2 outs).

[WhoMikeJames]

Please let this be a sign of offense.

[NIKEstrad]

Nick - Yeah. He got that one pretty solid, but it seemed like he was just trying to put it in the outfield for a sac fly than for a hit.

Scott just smoked that single. Hope we can nab a few more runs.

[Nick]

Please let this be a sign of offense.

Wainwright could also be starting to tire a little... first MLB start, never gone 3 times through an order before, beginning of the season.

[Nick]

Nick - Yeah. He got that one pretty solid, but it seemed like he was just trying to put it in the outfield for a sac fly than for a hit.

Well, how many times have our hitters (namely Lane, Ensberg, Biggio) failed in that situation trying to hit a HR, than just getting the sac fly?

I know we're not paying him to hit loads of sac flys... but its still a productive out.

[Uprising]

Wow Adam, that was one of the most pathetic hits I've ever seen. 2 men stranded.

at least we scored I guess.

GO STROS!

[Cannonball]

This ump and his delayed calls are pissing me off. It's not that they're bad calls. They're all borderline that could go either way. But he waits three seconds, making me think it's a ball, then he calls the strike.

[WhoMikeJames]

Nice bunt Wandy...

[Uprising]

LAMB!!!!!!!!!!!!!>...............OH NOES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :o :mad: :mad: :mad:

[Nick]

Nice bunt Wandy...

Its the little things... Oswalt failed to get a huge bunt down in the first game as well.

[NIKEstrad]

You know, if Wandy doesn't screw up at the bottom of the order, this would be a real nice game for him.

Overall, I'll take 6 innings and 3 runs from Wandy.

[Uprising]

Yep minus that HR, he has pitched a very good game.

That was a quick 1 2 3 through the Astros heart of the batting order. Lance, Lee, and Scott.

[rhino17]

Wandy is pitching a pretty good game. You couldn't ask for more from a 4th pitcher

[Nick]

Wandy is pitching a pretty good game. You couldn't ask for more from a 4th pitcher

Yep... too bad he didn't bring his magic powers to get the bats going like usual in his starts.

But, I'd rather have games like these for him than the other ones (where the bats roll, but so does his head).

[Uprising]

Great call on that 0 outs squeez play!!! worked perfectly! DOUBLE PLAY! :mad: :mad: :mad:

[Nick]

WTF kind of call was that Garner?!?

Pathetic... nobody out, 1st and 3rd, down by two runs... it would have been a bad play even if the squeeze had worked.

The fact that it was a DP should erase that thinking from Garner's mind forever if that situation ever comes up again.

[BenignDMD]

WTH?????????

[NIKEstrad]

That's called finding new ways to screw up.

[francis 4 prez]

i can't remember ever seeing anyone thrown out on a successfully executed squeeze. only us.

and only we could even turn it into a double play.

1st and 3rd, no outs, into 2nd w/ 2 outs. 1st and 3rd w/ no outs is pretty close to bases loaded and no outs so we continue to suck at turning possible big innings into big innings. if you could squeeze w/ the bases loaded, we could probably make it a triple play.

[sammy]

Fire Garner! :o :eek: maybe not yet, but if we continue playing like this...

[Uprising]

Typical astros offense. 2 men on the corners and NO OUTS. We get...NOTHING. :mad: :(

[francis 4 prez]

between the rockets' and astros' last game and now no yao and tmac and this atrocimissy, it's been a rough few days for houston sports.

[Cannonball]

What's funny (not really) is that I'll bet you the reason Garner did that is because he didn't want Bradley hitting into a conventional double play.

Did the Astros even work on bunting in spring training? Wandy and now Bradley. If he hadn't bunted it directly to Wainwright, Burke scores.

[Uprising]

between the rockets' and astros' last game and now no yao and tmac and this atrocimissy, it's been a rough few days for houston sports.


It's been one really ****ty week. I thought it was going to be an awesome week too. :(

[Uprising]

ROFL this game is over. Ugh.

I think the Cardinals have got their hands on a new Astro killer. HR, Double, Double. Good game by Duncan. :o

[Smokey]

Will Purpura speak after the game?

[Mr. Clutch]

Will Purpura speak after the game?

No but I'm sure he will eat. :rolleyes:

We have too many holes on offense. I don't really feel confident in Everett, Ausmus, or Biggio coming through when needed. So when our big bats struggle it's going to be ugly.

I agree with RyanED- bring up GUNTHER PENSE, he is the Astros TOP PROSPECTOR. :cool: :cool:

[russian88]

Adam Neverhits and Brad Alwaysmisses are not the only problem.

[Uprising]

How many games do we have to lose in a row before you think something will be done? Pence called up? Is it legal in MLB rules? ANYTHING?!

[Uprising]

DAMN! Luke just missed that 2 run bomb! :eek:

Please come back Stros! PLEaSE!

Nevermind. Burked strikes out.

Ugh. ASTROS YOU'RE KILLING ME!!!! :(

[russian88]

If we get swept again......

[Uprising]

At least Orlando continues to prove he's a kick ass PH.

[Cannonball]

Congratulations 2007 Houston Astros! You are the only winless team in the major league.

[Surfguy]

The Year of the Lastros?

I hope not.

[Cannonball]

Worst start in 17 years!

[Uprising]

http://www.1976design.com/blog/images/364k.jpg <-----------ME

http://www.silverspiderforge.com/images/knife.jpg <---------Astros


:( :( :( :(

[email2003]

WTF!? "The Return of the good guys!!?" More like the "Return of the no offense again!"

THIS TEAM PLAINLY SUCKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Uprising]

They'll go on their historic/annual summer run again this season, but I just wish they could play good ball ALL season. :(

[Mr. Clutch]

They'll go on their historic/annual summer run again this season, but I just wish they could play good ball ALL season. :(

Will they without Clemens and Pettitte? :(

[redefined]

Congratulations 2007 Houston Astros! You are the only winless team in the major league.

It's OK. Mavs lost their first 4 games. I'm not worried yet.

[Bobblehead]

http://img58.imageshack.us/img58/8771/astrosfan6lt.jpg
http://img180.imageshack.us/img180/2732/suicideastrosfancopyte0.jpg

[WhoMikeJames]

Jason Hirsh had a hell of a game tonight.

[DaDakota]

Bobblehead that 2nd picture from the Vietnam war is really disturbing.

Jason Hirsh had a hell of a game tonight.

Can he hit?


DD

[kaleidosky]

Jason Hirsh had a hell of a game tonight.

And Willy continued his spectacular, i mean horrendous, hitting from the top spot. Lucky for him he got hit in the head... not too many guys would rather be hit in the head than not in order to improve their OBP since it's so damn low.

[TMac640]

http://www.1976design.com/blog/images/364k.jpg <-----------ME

http://www.silverspiderforge.com/images/knife.jpg <---------Astros


:( :( :( :(


an ab knife? (yes, an ab knife)

[ThreePointShot]

Biggio two-run double makes it 3-0!

[dockerland]

Now thats what we wanna see from Lee :D

[ThreePointShot]

About time Lee! Nice dinger!

[TMac640]

what the ****?

how come the astros aren't on any of the stations?

i thought the astros only blacked out occasional homegames..

astros.com says fsn, but none of the fsn stations show anything but the "direct tv" logo

[ThreePointShot]

Berkman smokes it!
Win number 1, here we come.

[TMac640]

can't .... see... ****ing game...

[arkoe]

can't .... see... ****ing game...

Where are you?

[JunkyardDwg]

That's what I like to see...let your ace finish the game.

[ThreePointShot]

Good thing this isn't a save opportunity. :rolleyes:

[TMac640]

Where are you?

Houston.

It's weird, because usually it's on 639 (the fsn alternate since the mavs or some other crap's usually on 643) or the other alternate, 646.

Now, I'm just getting the big directv logo with elevator music on both stations.

Is it my package all the sudden that's messed up or the Astros blocking out games?

[arkoe]

It's the satellite. I'm getting it fine through Time Warner/Comcast.

[ThreePointShot]

Scott Rolen grounds out, we win.
1-4 baby, whoo!

[NIKEstrad]

Complete game Roy O on 94 pitches!!

Carlos and Berkman go deep. Not bad at all.

[BrieflySpeaking]

yea, i couldnt find it on satellite, then switched to cable and found it :cool:

[Roxfan73]

Well, we won with Roy going the distance. I don't think anyone was ready to see Garner hand this game over to the bullpen - we had to get a W under our belt.

[NIKEstrad]

Well, we won with Roy going the distance. I don't think anyone was ready to see Garner hand this game over to the bullpen - we had to get a W under our belt.

I think it was more a reward for Roy being both awesome and efficient. He was an absolute buzzsaw tonight; he deserved to go the distance.

[rezdawg]

Roy O should be 2-0 and on his way to his first Cy Young...stupid Lidge.

[Aceshigh7]

Roy O should be 2-0 and on his way to his first Cy Young...stupid Lidge.

Gee. Instead he's 1-0 and on his way to his first Cy Young. Big deal.

And by the way, Lidge hasn't pitched any worse than Qualls or Wheeler.

[RocketManJosh]

Nice win! Time to take the series tomorrow.

Glad to see Lance and 'Los get it going.

[msn]

Gee. Instead he's 1-0 and on his way to his first Cy Young. Big deal.

And by the way, Lidge hasn't pitched any worse than Qualls or Wheeler.
Well said.

[msn]

I think it was more a reward for Roy being both awesome and efficient. He was an absolute buzzsaw tonight; he deserved to go the distance.
No freaking kidding -- 86 pitches in 9 innings! Holy crap!

[DOMINATOR]

No freaking kidding -- 86 pitches in 9 innings! Holy crap!
you mean 94 right

[tigermission1]

Roy O has been the best pitcher in the league the last four seasons combined, IMO.

We're watching greatness right in front of us, ladies and gentlemen. The kid has that elusive 'it' factor.

Oh, and he deserves better offense and a better closer.

[Major]

Roy O has been the best pitcher in the league the last four seasons combined, IMO.


National league, definitely. Major leagues, Johan Santana runs circles around everybody. What he's done over the last 5 years is absurd.

[SWTsig]

Gee. Instead he's 1-0 and on his way to his first Cy Young. Big deal.

And by the way, Lidge hasn't pitched any worse than Qualls or Wheeler.

doesn't take away fron the fact that lidge is a washed-up has been.

sorry.

[wrath_of_khan]

Roy O has been the best pitcher in the league the last four seasons combined, IMO.

We're watching greatness right in front of us, ladies and gentlemen. The kid has that elusive 'it' factor.

Oh, and he deserves better offense and a better closer.

And he added a changeup this year and used it several times this game for outs. Amazing when you're the best pitcher in the NL and you're still striving to improve.

Look forward to 08 after he adds the gyroball! ;)

[MadMax]

It's the satellite. I'm getting it fine through Time Warner/Comcast.

i have Dish Network...we got the game.

[rezdawg]

Gee. Instead he's 1-0 and on his way to his first Cy Young. Big deal.

And by the way, Lidge hasn't pitched any worse than Qualls or Wheeler.

If Roy had a couple more victories last year, he may have won the Cy...every win counts, specially when you have the kind of offense the Astros throw out there.

Yeah, Lidge hasnt pitched any worse than Qualls or Wheeler...lol. Thats not a good thing buddy...Lidge is supposed to crap all over those guys, not be on par with them.

[Nick]

Roy O has been the best pitcher in the league the last four seasons combined, IMO.

We're watching greatness right in front of us, ladies and gentlemen. The kid has that elusive 'it' factor.

Oh, and he deserves better offense and a better closer.

The most amazing thing about Roy is his ability to reinvent himself as a completely DIFFERENT pitcher than when he came up.

From 2001-2004, he was strictly fastball/curveball, going for the big K numbers... and hitters started catching on to his patterns (resulting in a career-high ERA in 2004). Ausmus starts catching him again after a 1/4th of 2005, and they both agree to start changing some of his patterns, resulting in lower pitch counts/faster outs/less K's. Then, in the 2005 NLCS, with the Cardinals doing nothing but sitting on his off-speed stuff, Roy decides to give them nothing but fastballs... 90% fastballs, all in pin-point location. The results spoke for themesleves.

Now, he's almost a Maddux (in his prime) clone... a guy who's super effeicient, works both sides of the plate, pin-point control, movement on EVERY pitch, but yet he still has a strong enough arm to rear back and throw the heater whenever he wants (which Maddux never had). Roy's comment about how that first pitch changeup (which got a ton of first pitch outs last night) is going to help him speaks volumes to how much he's bought into the system.

You see so many "flamethrowers" dominate for a few years, but inevitbly start succumbing to injury around year 8-9... Pedro, Randy, Kevin Brown, Smoltz. Roy clearly knows what's better for him (and his team)... stay healthy, but eat up innings. Its why Maddux is still around today.


Yeah, Lidge hasnt pitched any worse than Qualls or Wheeler...lol. Thats not a good thing buddy...Lidge is supposed to crap all over those guys, not be on par with them.

Jesus... these guys have all thrown only 1 or 2 (Qualls) innings so far this season. I'm going to wait till I see more appearences before I declare this the biggest problem of the team. Right now, its not even close... the offense needs to be more consistent, and with Lee/Berkman just getting out of their struggles, I'm more optimistic that they can bring it on any given night as opposed to the last 2 years.

[MadMax]

Jesus... these guys have all thrown only 1 or 2 (Qualls) innings so far this season. .

to be fair, I think Jesus still believes in the Astros bullpen. it was rezdawg who had a problem with them. ;)

[mateo]

so glad the MLB Extra innings is back

[Nick]

Loretta in at SS today for Everett... only ONE automatic out in the lineup today (and its not the pitcher).

Officially the best Astros offensive lineup since game 7 of 2004 NLCS.

[NIKEstrad]

Surprising that Everett gets the day off before Biggio, especially day game after night game.

My guess is, Biggio will get pretty much every home start until 3K.

Jennings stuff had a lot of action on it in the first, hope he keeps it up.

[Nick]

Freakin ump better give us that inside "corner" call... unhittable pitch.

[Nick]

Everett would have been all over Wilson's "hit" to SS... in fact, it was suprising to NOT see somebody at that position when they cut the camera shot.

Garner should put Loretta out there for Wandy's starts... he's pretty much a flyball pitcher. Everett's defense helps Jennings' sinkers more than anybody else on this staff.

[NIKEstrad]

Everett would have been all over Wilson's "hit" to SS... in fact, it was suprising to NOT see somebody at that position when they cut the camera shot.


I was thinking the same thing. Loretta wasn't even really close to it -- it's amazing how much we take AE for granted.

Well, we found a new way to give up a run. How often does Ausmus NOT block that pitch?

[Nick]

I was thinking the same thing. Loretta wasn't even really close to it -- it's amazing how much we take AE for granted.

I agree... the difference between Everett and any other SS (especially on THIS club) is astounding.

The reason why you never see him have to make many diving stops (and hence get a "web gem") is because he's ALREADY THERE most of the time. Its like the ball off the bat moves in slow motion for him to position himself, and his first instinctual step is always where the ball ends up.

I guess Loretta's bat will be needed in the longrun, thus its important to get him an early start.

[Nick]

I guess Wade Miller no longer owns "Miller Park". A 5 hit, 4 run, 2HR second for the Brew-Crew.

[NIKEstrad]

Umm, I think someone just woke up Albert.

Uh oh.

[Nick]

Umm, I think someone just woke up Albert.

Uh oh.

It was just a matter of time.... but JJ didn't need to walk Duncan, nor serve up a pitch right in the heart of Pujols' power either.

[russian88]

Stros could have 5 cy-young's and still lose with this pathetic offense.

[desihooper]

Someone tell the Astros this is Kip Freaking Wells and not Chris Carpenter!

[ruddy]

Stros could have 5 cy-young's and still lose with this pathetic offense.


Very pathetic, this is just disgusting how they make the opposing pitcher look like a Roger Clemens in his prime...

[russian88]

Wells cant do right wrong

[TMac640]

http://www.geocities.com/ts5818/captainmorgan.JPG

[Bobblehead]

Astros offense sux!!!!!

[NIKEstrad]

Lidge v. Pujols coming up...

Edit: That's an inning ending DP if Everett is playing.

[lost_elephant]

we made kip wells look like cy young.

[email2003]

Lidge just showed us again that he still sucks!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[desihooper]

Lidge would've been out of the inning if Loretta didn't boot that ball.

[RocketManJosh]

Yeah I think this team is ready to hit the road

[email2003]

Good job Houston fans! Keep boooooooing him out of the game.

LIDGE IS TRASH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :mad:

[kaleidosky]

Lidge would've been out of the inning if Loretta didn't boot that ball.

that would've been out #2. can't assume he still would've gotten the 3rd.

and regardless...bad pitch to rolen. bad location to molina.

i'm done watching this for the day finally..

[Zac D]

I'm really interested to know what Lidge is feeling at times like these. It's got to make you sick at heart to hear 40,000 bloodthirsty Romans giving you the thumbs down, and to wonder, even in the tiniest way at the back of your mind, if maybe you deserve it.

I have a feeling that maybe a year or two after Lidge retires, we're going to see a really good, long, tell-all article on the subject.

[rocketfat]

I'm really interested to know what Lidge is feeling at times like these. It's got to make you sick at heart to hear 40,000 bloodthirsty Romans giving you the thumbs down, and to wonder, even in the tiniest way at the back of your mind, if maybe you deserve it.

I have a feeling that maybe a year or two after Lidge retires, we're going to see a really good, long, tell-all article on the subject.


i can tell you exactly how he's feeling....he felt great out there today. the cards really made some great swings against some great pitches, but he felt really great, and really thought his stuff was excellent today.

[Zac D]

i can tell you exactly how he's feeling....he felt great out there today. the cards really made some great swings against some great pitches, but he felt really great, and really thought his stuff was excellent today.

****ing zing.

[ruddy]

i can tell you exactly how he's feeling....he felt great out there today. the cards really made some great swings against some great pitches, but he felt really great, and really thought his stuff was excellent today.
Are you being sarcastic or what????????????? He coudn't even finish a inning. Jesus!!!!!!!!!!

[Aceshigh7]

Good job Houston fans! Keep boooooooing him out of the game.

LIDGE IS TRASH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :mad:

Actually, booing him is the worst thing the so-called 'fans' can do. Houston fans should strive to be more like Cardinals fans. Izzy was struggling and worse than Lidge a couple of years ago, but he didn't get the classless treatment from Cards' fans that Lidge is getting now.

Unfortunately, Astros 'fans' seem to be leaning towards acting like Yankees fans. The lack of class shown by booing Kent, Viz, and now a struggling Lidge is disturbing. It IS possible to show your passion without acting completely baseball ignorant. Unfortunately alot of these boobirds haven't learned that yet.

[Zac D]

Are you being sarcastic or what????????????? He coudn't even finish a inning. Jesus!!!!!!!!!!

You're bad at this, aren't you?

[desihooper]

I'm thinking they would've turned two on that hit to short...that's all. An utterly disappointing start to this season.

[Kam]

boo Viz?


PEOPLE BOO VIZ?

man **** that ****.

He can play for alqaeda, and you can't boo Viz,

thank you.

[ruddy]

You're bad at this, aren't you?


Yes, lol :D :mad: :mad: :mad:

[JunkyardDwg]

Actually, booing him is the worst thing the so-called 'fans' can do. Houston fans should strive to be more like Cardinals fans. Izzy was struggling and worse than Lidge a couple of years ago, but he didn't get the classless treatment from Cards' fans that Lidge is getting now.

Unfortunately, Astros 'fans' seem to be leaning towards acting like Yankees fans. The lack of class shown by booing Kent, Viz, and now a struggling Lidge is disturbing. It IS possible to show your passion without acting completely baseball ignorant. Unfortunately alot of these boobirds haven't learned that yet.


Stop apologizing for the man; it's not like the fans turned on him the moment he started having struggles a few seasons back. I'm not one to boo against my own team, just not my nature. But frankly, Lidge is deserving of it.

[TMac640]

Stop apologizing for the man; it's not like the fans turned on him the moment he started having struggles a few seasons back. I'm not one to boo against my own team, just not my nature. But frankly, Lidge is deserving of it.


No joke. If there's anyone deserving of boos, it's Lidge right now.

Aceshigh, where do you get off preaching about being a fan when you're "closer" hasn't gotten it done for a while now?

[JunkyardDwg]

I dunno what it is, but this team just does not have "it" that I've seen in the past; outside of some pretty solid starting pitching I see no fire. I'm watching Garner's interview right now and I see the same thing...like nobody seems to care too much that they've started out 1-5. Someone needs to let these guys know that Spring Training ended a week ago.

[texanskan]

Wells wanted to sign here but Purpura had no spot in the rotation with left hand star Wandy holding down a spot

[SWTsig]

Are you being sarcastic or what????????????? He coudn't even finish a inning. Jesus!!!!!!!!!!

you need interweb lessons.

[macalu]

i think Aceshigh is Lidge's brother.

[SWTsig]

Actually, booing him is the worst thing the so-called 'fans' can do. Houston fans should strive to be more like Cardinals fans. Izzy was struggling and worse than Lidge a couple of years ago, but he didn't get the classless treatment from Cards' fans that Lidge is getting now.

Unfortunately, Astros 'fans' seem to be leaning towards acting like Yankees fans. The lack of class shown by booing Kent, Viz, and now a struggling Lidge is disturbing. It IS possible to show your passion without acting completely baseball ignorant. Unfortunately alot of these boobirds haven't learned that yet.

nobody cares, ace. lidge f*cking sucks and consistently loses games for this team... he deserves all of it.

give it a rest.

[Gene the PIG]

Lidge may be puke, but so is Ensberg! Watta COMPLETELY worthless dolt! & those bums sure as ESSSS didn't do anything to help Lidge out with their lazy, crappy play in the field.


It's pretty sad that after everything that's gone down in the last three years, we're STILL just a two-man team.

If they get bagled, ain't nobody going to step it up. :o

[Uprising]

YAY FOR LIDGE AND THE ASTROS BATS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :mad: :mad: :mad:

If you want to win....YOU HAVE TO PITCH A COMPLETE GAME! SORRY STARTERS!@ !!!!! :o

[russian88]

If u want to win, FIRE purpura, and trade Lidge.

[leroy420]

nobody cares, ace. lidge f*cking sucks and consistently loses games for this team... he deserves all of it.

give it a rest.

YAY FOR LIDGE AND THE ASTROS BATS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If you want to win....YOU HAVE TO PITCH A COMPLETE GAME! SORRY STARTERS!@ !!!!!

If u want to win, FIRE purpura, and trade Lidge.

Would one of you please explain how Brad Lidge lost this game? He's out of the inning with no runs if Loretta turns that double play.

We couldn't hit Kip freaking Wells today. This game is on no one but the offense. 3 hits and 1 run ain't gonna beat anyone.

[email2003]

Lidge - 16.50 ERA.

Garner: "Lidge is still my closer. He's my closer!"

OH MY GOD!!!!!!!!!!!! :eek:

GARNER, WAKE UP!!!!!!!!!!!! Get pissed with your players!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[russian88]

Garner is just covering his ass. He will be fired if this crap keeps up.

[Major]

Lidge - 16.50 ERA.

Garner: "Lidge is still my closer. He's my closer!"

OH MY GOD!!!!!!!!!!!! :eek:

GARNER, WAKE UP!!!!!!!!!!!! Get pissed with your players!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yes, if only he got pissed then his players would realize "hey, he's angry so I should start playing better!" I'm sure they don't want to win for themselves or for each other or anything.

[SWTsig]

Would one of you please explain how Brad Lidge lost this game? He's out of the inning with no runs if Loretta turns that double play.

We couldn't hit Kip freaking Wells today. This game is on no one but the offense. 3 hits and 1 run ain't gonna beat anyone.

i never said he lost this particular game.... just that he consistently loses them.

the guy is a has-been. why garner insists on using him is beyond explanation.... how many times does a guy have to blow it before you show him the door? the houston media needs to start ripping into garner during interviews... enough with this "he's my guy" bullsh!t.

but yes, our offense is what's killing us.

[email2003]

i never said he lost this particular game.... just that he consistently loses them.

the guy is a has-been. why garner insists on using him is beyond explanation.... how many times does a guy have to blow it before you show him the door? the houston media needs to start ripping into garner during interviews... enough with this "he's my guy" bullsh!t.

but yes, our offense is what's killing us.
Until Lidge pulls off a David Carr like season. Then we have to ship him off. :rolleyes:

[rezdawg]

Jesus... these guys have all thrown only 1 or 2 (Qualls) innings so far this season. I'm going to wait till I see more appearences before I declare this the biggest problem of the team.

Lidge has been throwing crap for over a year...whether he's pitched an inning or more this year is irrelevant. The guy is no where near what he was and he will never again reach that level.

[Howyalikemenow]

It's funny... the offense can completely suck beyond belief, and somehow the threads always turn into Lidge haters. Yeah, he played bad, but the entire offense was a disgrace again. Focus on what's losing the games for us... our offense is terrible! They need to wake up. :mad:

[email2003]

Once again:

Lidge - 16.50 ERA as of today. :eek: :mad:

[Aceshigh7]

Lidge has been throwing crap for over a year...whether he's pitched an inning or more this year is irrelevant. The guy is no where near what he was and he will never again reach that level.

Either you have selective memory, or you just weren't watching last August/September.

[russian88]

Lidge is crap, but so is the entire offense. If we cant score more than 1 run a game, why even show up to play? We need to score at least 5 runs just to feel comfortable because the bullpen sucks and will give up at least 2 runs every game.

[rezdawg]

Either you have selective memory, or you just weren't watching last August/September.

No, I remember quite nicely.

Since you asked, his August/September numbers are as follows:

15.2 IP
24 hits allowed
13 ER
11 Walks

Thats a WHIP of 2.23 and an ERA of 7.47. INCREDIBLE!!!

Or wait, were you just talking about that 6 game stretch where he didnt give up a run? Because, yes, in those 6 games, he was real good. Thats awesome.

[Uprising]

The sad numbers through 6 games of 2007:

M Ensberg .188 AVG

BRAD LIDGE: 16.20 ERA
Brian Moehler: 18.00 ERA

[HillBoy]

Stop apologizing for the man; it's not like the fans turned on him the moment he started having struggles a few seasons back. I'm not one to boo against my own team, just not my nature. But frankly, Lidge is deserving of it.
Sheesh! I mean come on, this guy blew his first save earlier in the week and cost them the game and today he gave up 5 freaking runs in a no pressure situation. He also ended up throwing 30 something pitches IN ONE INNING. Exactly what were the fans who were still there supposed to do? Stand up and congratulate the Cardinals for further inflating Lidge's ERA? The guy is done and if Garner keeps trotting him out there to keep giving up runs, then Garner's ass should be fired on the spot and Tim Purpura's ass should be right out of the door with him. And whatever clowns they have evaluating talent should get their collective asses canned as well. I am not kneejerking here: this team looks like it did not go through spring training at all. And all of this "It's only been [fill in the blank] games smacks of loser talk which they appear to have mastered quite well. You know, for once before I die, I would like to be able to engage in the fantasy that the Astros actually have a legitimate shot at winning it all. Just once is all I ask.

[russian88]

The really sad thing is, Garner will trot his 5 million dollar man out there in the 9th. Mclane's gotta get his money worth.

[Major]

You know, for once before I die, I would like to be able to engage in the fantasy that the Astros actually have a legitimate shot at winning it all. Just once is all I ask.

1998? 2004? 2005? You don't think they had a shot to win it those years?

[macalu]

1998? 2004? 2005? You don't think they had a shot to win it those years?
well, they ONLY made it to the World Series. talk about underachieving.

[Smokey]

Garner should clean out his office tomorrow morning.

[Cannonball]

Yes, if only he got pissed then his players would realize "hey, he's angry so I should start playing better!" I'm sure they don't want to win for themselves or for each other or anything.

Different players need different motivation. You can't bitch at every player and you can't coddle every player. The Astros have stuck by Lidge and have shown nothing but confidence in him. It's obviously not working. Maybe an ass chewing and a demotion will turn the tide. Who knows? At this point, it really couldn't hurt.

[Mr. Clutch]

Can't really blame Garner here. He doesn't have much to work with, really.

I guess the bright spot to point at are the starters. Once Lee and Berkman get going they will start winning some games.

[SWTsig]

Either you have selective memory, or you just weren't watching last August/September.

...

No, I remember quite nicely.

Since you asked, his August/September numbers are as follows:

15.2 IP
24 hits allowed
13 ER
11 Walks

Thats a WHIP of 2.23 and an ERA of 7.47. INCREDIBLE!!!

Or wait, were you just talking about that 6 game stretch where he didnt give up a run? Because, yes, in those 6 games, he was real good. Thats awesome.

and your streak of resident idiot continues.

keep up the good work, ace!

[Baqui99]

If I were Brad Lidge, I would just walk my ass into oncoming traffic.

[BrieflySpeaking]

i dont get it, i mean, not like lidge has a sub par fast ball, he has a 96+ mph fastball, and a pretty damn good slider!! either he fixes his control or hes outta the league in a hurry.

[Cannonball]

i dont get it, i mean, not like lidge has a sub par fast ball, he has a 96+ mph fastball, and a pretty damn good slider!! either he fixes his control or hes outta the league in a hurry.

Even though he has good velocity. There must be something about his fastball that makes it extremely hittable. Maybe it's extremely straight and has no movement at all. Maybe he doesn't hide the ball well during his delivery and the batter gets a longer look at the ball. That would negate the velocity. I can't tell you exacly why his mid-90's fastball isn't effective. I just know it isn't.

[Aceshigh7]

No, I remember quite nicely.

Since you asked, his August/September numbers are as follows:

15.2 IP
24 hits allowed
13 ER
11 Walks

Thats a WHIP of 2.23 and an ERA of 7.47. INCREDIBLE!!!

Or wait, were you just talking about that 6 game stretch where he didnt give up a run? Because, yes, in those 6 games, he was real good. Thats awesome.

Actually, I didn't ask. And if you are going to throw out numbers, how bout getting them right? Or can you just not do simple arithmetic? How you get 15.2 innings pitched is beyond me.

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/gamelog?statsId=6913&year=2006

Converting 11 out of 13 save opportunities down the stretch. In September he was a bit shaky but still getting the job done. And in August, he was pretty much the lights out of old. I was at each home game. There was a marked change in Lidge's performance.

You can remove your head from your ass now.

[Aceshigh7]

...



and your streak of resident idiot continues.

keep up the good work, ace!

And while you're at it, how bout removing your head from rezdawg's ass also?

[Cannonball]

Actually, I didn't ask. And if you are going to throw out numbers, how bout getting them right? Or can you just not do simple arithmetic? How you get 15.2 innings pitched is beyond me.

Typo? 25.2 v 15.2

Converting 11 out of 13 save opportunities down the stretch. In September he was a bit shaky but still getting the job done. And in August, he was pretty much the lights out of old. I was at each home game. There was a marked change in Lidge's performance.

August was pretty good. He pitched so well that he almost got his ERA down to 5.00! But he absolutely sucked in September. A 6.75 ERA and giving up runs in 7 of his 12 appearances ins't good. In his 5 save ops in September, he gave up runs in 3 of them. He also gave up runs in 2 of the 3 holds he recorded.

One good month out of 6 doesn't cut it. And pitching well in August only to suck again in September doesn't equate to being good down the stretch.

You may now remove your lips from Lidge's bunghole.

[Rule0001]

Even though he has good velocity. There must be something about his fastball that makes it extremely hittable. Maybe it's extremely straight and has no movement at all. Maybe he doesn't hide the ball well during his delivery and the batter gets a longer look at the ball. That would negate the velocity. I can't tell you exacly why his mid-90's fastball isn't effective. I just know it isn't.

Maybe he should start throwing a 2-seam fastball like I've been saying for the last 2 years. It has to be the ball is too straight, it shouldn't be his delivery, hitters don't get to see him enough because he's in the bullpen.

[Cannonball]

Maybe he should start throwing a 2-seam fastball like I've been saying for the last 2 years. It has to be the ball is too straight, it shouldn't be his delivery, hitters don't get to see him enough because he's in the bullpen.

He is.

[Rule0001]

He is.

Nope.

If he is, then he just sucks and should kill himself.

-Phil Garner

[HillBoy]

1998? 2004? 2005? You don't think they had a shot to win it those years?
No and the reason I didn't then is the reason I don't now: poor hitting. I just don't know what it is with the Astros - before it was the fact they played in the cavernous Astrodome which was not conductive to offense so they trotted out a group of guys who lacked superior offensive skills. But MM Park is not the Astrodome so that should no longer be a reason for what we are seeing. Whatever it is for some time now the lack of hitting has been a consistent theme that has extracted a big burden on this club. It has to weigh on the pitchers who are under all sorts of pressure not to make mistakes and give up any runs because this is not a team that has the hitting to come from behind. Yesterday, even though they were only 3 runs down, by the time the 6th inning rolled around, you could sense that the game was over as batter after batter was retired without much effort. And I don't need to go into what has happened to Clemens during his last 2 years here.

They have become the poster boys for offensive futility. This season they have a lopsided lineup in the middle, 2 black holes aka automatic outs at C & SS and Biggio is a shaky at bat no matter where he hits. I guess that I wish it wasn't so for once - I'd like things to be different for a change. I do expect them to eventually start hitting - it's just that I hope they aren't buried in the division behind several teams by that time. Of course with their luck by then their starting pitching will be in trouble.

[HillBoy]

well, they ONLY made it to the World Series. talk about underachieving.
Where they got swept if memory serves. But it was really nice to see them in the Big Show. It would be MUCH nicer to see them win it all but if just making it there is satisfying for you then I am pleased that it made you happy.

[MadMax]

Where they got swept if memory serves. But it was really nice to see them in the Big Show. It would be MUCH nicer to see them win it all but if just making it there is satisfying for you then I am pleased that it made you happy.

come on. in baseball, this kind of thinking falls woefully short.

did the cardinals really put together such a better team last year than the tigers that would make you think their organization isn't fielding a championship team? that they didn't give their fans a shot??

are the yankees really not trying hard enough?? are they not giving their fans a shot?

baseball doesn't work that way. a bounce of the ball this way or that changes everything. a bad start by an otherwise reliable pitcher costs you a series, sometimes. the mariners finish with a record for regular season wins...a great team, without question...and then get bounced in the divisional series.

this isn't basketball...the hard part of baseball is GETTING to the playoffs. after that, it's a crap shoot. it's who is hot at the right time.

by the way...did you seriously just say the Astros were a poor hitting team in 2004 and 1998??? that's an absolute joke.

[rrj_gamz]

My two cents, but the Stros' always start off slow and come back with a vengence...I suspect that yes, it'll be a long year, but we'll be stumbling into the playoffs...It's early...

[MadMax]

by the way:

Carpenter will be missing his next start...his 2nd missed start of the season...he's having an MRI on his elbow today.

[Major]

No and the reason I didn't then is the reason I don't now: poor hitting. I just don't know what it is with the Astros - before it was the fact they played in the cavernous Astrodome which was not conductive to offense so they trotted out a group of guys who lacked superior offensive skills. But MM Park is not the Astrodome so that should no longer be a reason for what we are seeing. Whatever it is for some time now the lack of hitting has been a consistent theme that has extracted a big burden on this club.

Umm, did you even watch the 1998 or 2004 teams? The 1998 team certainly struggled offensively in the postseason, but they were a fantastic offensive team. That was probably the best all-around team in the NL that year, and was considered to be the one team that could beat the 120 win Yankees.

The 2004 team featured an offense that included Kent, Berkman, Beltran, and Bagwell. It had the best closer in baseball, and a starting duo better than any in baseball. It mashed the crap out of the ball in the postseason.

If those teams didn't have a legitimate chance to win the World Series, then no team outside of New York in the last decade ever has. Oddly, some of them did, so I'm not sure how that works.