View Full Version : Rate the following people based on entire body of work
bchapman101
04-05-2007, 04:29 PM
On a scale from 1 to 5, 5 being excellent, rate Tim Purpura, Phil Garner, Gary Kubiak, Bob McNair, Jeff Van Gundy
bchapman101
04-05-2007, 05:22 PM
allright I'll start
Purpura-1
Garner-1
Kubiak-3.2
McNair-1
JVG-3.78
The Cat
04-05-2007, 05:25 PM
This is hilarious. Tim Purpura and Phil Garner, two guys that have kept the team consistently one of the best in the NL and directed a team that won the city's first pennant, lose three games out of 162 and suddenly they're worse than Bob McNair and Gary Kubiak and the Texans, who haven't as much as had a winning season in five years.
I'm not even sure what to say. Wow.
dntrwl
04-05-2007, 05:31 PM
Tim Purpura, 3
Phil Garner,3
Gary Kubiak,2
Bob McNair,1.5
Jeff Van Gundy, 4
Carrol Dawson, 4.75!
Hakeem06
04-05-2007, 06:51 PM
This is hilarious. Tim Purpura and Phil Garner, two guys that have kept the team consistently one of the best in the NL and directed a team that won the city's first pennant, lose three games out of 162 and suddenly they're worse than Bob McNair and Gary Kubiak and the Texans, who haven't as much as had a winning season in five years.
I'm not even sure what to say. Wow.
beat me to it.
I am bewildered at times at Garner's decisions and Purprura's indecisions, BUT they have shown that they can WIN.
McNair has an embarrassment so far. I know an expansion franchise can take some time but you would have thought they would have been at the very least a solid football team by now, not one of the NFL cellar dwellars.
Purpura - 3.5
Garner - 4
Kubiak - 2.5
McNair - 1
Van Gundy - 4
The negativity in Houston sports is at an all-time low... this is still the epitome of bandwagon towns.
The negativity in Houston sports is at an all-time low... this is still the epitome of bandwagon towns.
a/k/a the 'Sunbelt Syndrome'...
a/k/a the 'Sunbelt Syndrome'...
Yes, and no. Houston teams have been around for some time now... more so than other sun-belt cities.
Uprising
04-05-2007, 08:34 PM
Tim Purpura 2.5
Phil Garner,4
Gary Kubiak 4
Bob McNair 5
Jeff Van Gundy 4.5
Carrol Dawson 4
bchapman101
04-05-2007, 08:42 PM
This is hilarious. Tim Purpura and Phil Garner, two guys that have kept the team consistently one of the best in the NL and directed a team that won the city's first pennant, lose three games out of 162 and suddenly they're worse than Bob McNair and Gary Kubiak and the Texans, who haven't as much as had a winning season in five years.
I'm not even sure what to say. Wow.
Purpura took over after Hunsicker. Hunsicker had already built a heck of a team. The team that went to the World Series was Hunsickers. Bagwell, Berkman, Oswalt, Biggio, Ausmus, Everett, ad so on were here already. In my opinion Garner cost the team several victories last year, and we missed the playoffs by one game. The Astros have done well because they have had good players. It is possible to have a good team and a bad manager.
The Astros have done well because they have had good players. It is possible to have a good team and a bad manager.
Newsflash... name a team that does well without good players. Do bad teams have good managers?
bchapman101
04-05-2007, 09:11 PM
Newsflash... name a team that does well without good players. Do bad teams have good managers?
in baseball a team with good players or bad players is affected equally by the manager. If the manager is good, they will win more games than they would have if he was bad. I think a good manager can win roughly 12 more games than a bad one with the same team.
Smokey
04-05-2007, 09:17 PM
McNair - 0
Kubiak - 1
Jimy Garner (as in he will be joining Jimy if the Astros don't win) - 2
Purpura - 2 or 3
Van Gundy - 4
kaleidosky
04-05-2007, 09:19 PM
Purpura took over after Hunsicker. Hunsicker had already built a heck of a team. The team that went to the World Series was Hunsickers. Bagwell, Berkman, Oswalt, Biggio, Ausmus, Everett, ad so on were here already. In my opinion Garner cost the team several victories last year, and we missed the playoffs by one game. The Astros have done well because they have had good players. It is possible to have a good team and a bad manager.
So when is the team NOT Hunsicker's? When every single player from his era is gone? Or maybe it's when we lose or perform beneath expectations, because obviously that would be Purpura's fault.
You can't give credit to Hunsicker but make Purpura take the blame. Either he's had an impact (take the good and the bad) or he hasn't (which means he's unrated until you decide "Hunsicker's guys" are gone)
bchapman101
04-05-2007, 09:31 PM
So when is the team NOT Hunsicker's? When every single player from his era is gone? Or maybe it's when we lose or perform beneath expectations, because obviously that would be Purpura's fault.
You can't give credit to Hunsicker but make Purpura take the blame. Either he's had an impact (take the good and the bad) or he hasn't (which means he's unrated until you decide "Hunsicker's guys" are gone)
Well I would say it ceases to be Hunsickers when the majority of the starting nine was brought in by Purpura, at least 5-4. And you are right about blaming Purpura for bad things and giving credit to Hunsicker for good things. But time and time again Hunsicker made great moves. By that I mean, something that made you say, "wow that was brilliant!". The Jennings trade may turn out to be that way. I liked it when it happened, and it may turn out to be brilliant. If it does, then my rating for Purpura will go up. Other than the Jennings trade though he hasnt done much. Singing Carlos Lee would have been done by any Astro GM because Lee wanted to come here. I want to see Purpura make some moves that are all his doing.
Well I would say it ceases to be Hunsickers when the majority of the starting nine was brought in by Purpura, at least 5-4. And you are right about blaming Purpura for bad things and giving credit to Hunsicker for good things. But time and time again Hunsicker made great moves. By that I mean, something that made you say, "wow that was brilliant!". The Jennings trade may turn out to be that way. I liked it when it happened, and it may turn out to be brilliant. If it does, then my rating for Purpura will go up. Other than the Jennings trade though he hasnt done much. Singing Carlos Lee would have been done by any Astro GM because Lee wanted to come here. I want to see Purpura make some moves that are all his doing.
You're acting like Pupura just came here from some other team, and Hunsicker made every move on his own for every player the Astros had till 2004.
The reality is, Pupura was VERY involved in the drafting of Oswalt, Berkman, Lidge, Pence, Patton, Nieve, and Burke. Likewise, Hunsicker wasn't the one who drafted Biggio, he didn't trade for Bagwell... and like you said, any Astro GM would have signed Kent, Pettite, and Clemens because they all wanted to come here.
So in reality, we're debating Mike Lamb/Brandon Backe vs. Mark Loretta/Jason Jennings. Wow, that's pretty riveting stuff.
bchapman101
04-05-2007, 09:43 PM
You're acting like Pupura just came here from some other team, and Hunsicker made every move on his own for every player the Astros had till 2004.
The reality is, Pupura was VERY involved in the drafting of Oswalt, Berkman, Lidge, Pence, Patton, Nieve, and Burke. Likewise, Hunsicker wasn't the one who drafted Biggio, he didn't trade for Bagwell... and like you said, any Astro GM would have signed Kent, Pettite, and Clemens because they all wanted to come here.
So in reality, we're debating Mike Lamb/Brandon Backe vs. Mark Loretta/Jason Jennings. Wow, that's pretty riveting stuff.
yea, guess we're arguing over nothing then
how about this-lets see what happens this year, fair enough?
rhino17
04-05-2007, 10:12 PM
Tim Purpura:3.5
Phil Garner:2.5
Gary Kubiak:4
Bob McNair:-3
Jeff Van Gundy:2.5
Lil Francis
04-05-2007, 10:59 PM
Purpura- 2.5
Garner- 3
Kubiak- 2.5
Van Gundy 3.5
McNair- 1.5
MadMax
04-06-2007, 07:38 AM
This is hilarious. Tim Purpura and Phil Garner, two guys that have kept the team consistently one of the best in the NL and directed a team that won the city's first pennant, lose three games out of 162 and suddenly they're worse than Bob McNair and Gary Kubiak and the Texans, who haven't as much as had a winning season in five years.
I'm not even sure what to say. Wow.
see my sig.
Achilleus
04-06-2007, 07:48 AM
Purpura-4
Garner-4
Kubiak-4
McNair-3
JVG-5
how about this-lets see what happens this year, fair enough?
No. No, it's not "fair enough".
One of the things that made the Astros so consistently competitive is the farm system and scouting, which was considered by many the deepest and best in baseball until Hunsicker depleted it with trades towards the end of his tenure. Guess who oversaw that award-winning, league-renowned system?
To judge Tim Purpura by his "whole body of work" and then only consider two or three years as GM is to be ignorant of his "whole body of work". To then discount those first two or three years as "Hunsicker's" work is to amazingly ignorant of Purpura's "whole body of work".
Hunsicker is still the gold standard of Houston GMs--but, one thing that made him so good is the people he surrounded himself with. And, chief among those that made Hun successful is Tim Purpura.
Long term, we may see that he's best suited as a director of player development overseeing all the minor leagues and all the scouting (where he really made his hay). And, boy, did he do a damn good job at it. Those players he developed, and those free agents his department scouted and Gerry signed, took us to our first World Series--with Tim as the GM, no less.
Timmy gets a 5, bro. A 5.
The Cat
04-06-2007, 10:04 AM
No. No, it's not "fair enough".
One of the things that made the Astros so consistently competitive is the farm system and scouting, which was considered by many the deepest and best in baseball until Hunsicker depleted it with trades towards the end of his tenure. Guess who oversaw that award-winning, league-renowned system?
To judge Tim Purpura by his "whole body of work" and then only consider two or three years as GM is to be ignorant of his "whole body of work". To then discount those first two or three years as "Hunsicker's" work is to amazingly ignorant of Purpura's "whole body of work".
Hunsicker is still the gold standard of Houston GMs--but, one thing that made him so good is the people he surrounded himself with. And, chief among those that made Hun successful is Tim Purpura.
Long term, we may see that he's best suited as a director of player development overseeing all the minor leagues and all the scouting (where he really made his hay). And, boy, did he do a damn good job at it. Those players he developed, and those free agents his department scouted and Gerry signed, took us to our first World Series--with Tim as the GM, no less.
Timmy gets a 5, bro. A 5.
But Timmy couldn't have done any of that. He's fat. Sorry.
bchapman101
04-06-2007, 11:33 AM
No. No, it's not "fair enough".
One of the things that made the Astros so consistently competitive is the farm system and scouting, which was considered by many the deepest and best in baseball until Hunsicker depleted it with trades towards the end of his tenure. Guess who oversaw that award-winning, league-renowned system?
To judge Tim Purpura by his "whole body of work" and then only consider two or three years as GM is to be ignorant of his "whole body of work". To then discount those first two or three years as "Hunsicker's" work is to amazingly ignorant of Purpura's "whole body of work".
Hunsicker is still the gold standard of Houston GMs--but, one thing that made him so good is the people he surrounded himself with. And, chief among those that made Hun successful is Tim Purpura.
Long term, we may see that he's best suited as a director of player development overseeing all the minor leagues and all the scouting (where he really made his hay). And, boy, did he do a damn good job at it. Those players he developed, and those free agents his department scouted and Gerry signed, took us to our first World Series--with Tim as the GM, no less.
Timmy gets a 5, bro. A 5.
I see your point. I just said "let's see what happen this year" because even thought Purpura did all that with the minor league system before, last year and this year are his only years at the head. Now he makes trades. Now he signs free agents. (yes I know Drayton McLane has final say but you know what I mean) You are arguing for Purpura before he was GM, which I can understand. What I should have stated earlier is rate him on his work as a GM. So to see what he does this year would be very significant. Now isnt that fair enough?
So to see what he does this year would be very significant. Now isnt that fair enough?
As a GM? Well, OK, but it seems I put more stock into the first two years than you do, right or wrong. He hasn't overwhelmed me, but neither did Gerry in his first two years. I think the Astros have a good thing going. I think Timmy P will be a good GM for a long time. I could be wrong; we'll see.
bchapman101
04-06-2007, 11:45 AM
As a GM? Well, OK, but it seems I put more stock into the first two years than you do, right or wrong. He hasn't overwhelmed me, but neither did Gerry in his first two years. I think the Astros have a good thing going. I think Timmy P will be a good GM for a long time. I could be wrong; we'll see.
ok well see, anyway we both want to see good results, as we are both Astro fans (even if they got swept at home by the Pirates, haha)
whag00
04-06-2007, 12:38 PM
Bob McNair 5
Well at least somebody here appreciates Mr. McNair for all he has done.
DaDakota
04-06-2007, 01:52 PM
On a scale from 1 to 5, 5 being excellent, rate Tim Purpura, Phil Garner, Gary Kubiak, Bob McNair, Jeff Van Gundy
Purpura 2
Garner 4
Kubiak 3
McNair 1
JVG 3
C. Dawson 3
DD
ac in austin
04-07-2007, 12:19 AM
Purpura 2
Garner 4
Kubiak 3
McNair 1
JVG 3
C. Dawson 3
DD
Anybody who gives McNair a 1 after he spent a billion dollars to bring the NFL back to Houston is a complete moron. By the way Garner has done the worst job of anybody on this list. If anybody is the polar opposite of me as a sports fan its got to be DD. I am very happy about this fact.
bchapman101
04-07-2007, 01:42 AM
OK the results are in. I simply totalled all the numbers. Here they are:
1) JVG - 34.28
2) Garner - 27.5
3) Kubiak - 26.2
4) Purpura - 24.5
5) McNair - 14
Bob McNair was by far the least popular of all, while JVG was by far the most popular. There was also a write in vote. CD received 11.75 points on just 3 votes! He almost beat McNair!
Well there you have it clutchfans. That is how you voted. (Yes I know the sample was very small)
Realjad
04-07-2007, 03:10 AM
This thread - 0
TheFreak
04-07-2007, 04:24 PM
I have to question anyone that doesn't have Garner rated ahead of everyone mentioned.
Smokey
04-07-2007, 05:00 PM
Anybody who gives McNair a 1 after he spent a billion dollars to bring the NFL back to Houston is a complete moron.
Anyone who puts up with his incompetence is a moron too :rolleyes:
I have calmed down...
dsnow23
04-09-2007, 12:14 PM
Tim Purpura - 3
Phil Garner - 4
Gary Kubiak - 4
Bob McNair - 1
Jeff Van Gundy - 4
Anyone who puts up with his incompetence is a moron too :rolleyes:
I have calmed down...
Anyone who calls someone a "moron" based on an opinion over something as subjective as sports is a "moron".
There; got you both covered.
Both points of view have merit: McNair deserves massive kudos for bringing the NFL back to H-Town; he is also not given a free pass for taking so long to identify how utterly stupid the previous regime's actions were.
Groogrux
04-09-2007, 12:40 PM
Anyone who calls someone a "moron" based on an opinion over something as subjective as sports is a "moron".
Chris Dudley was a better overall center than Hakeem Olajuwon.
Chris Dudley was a better overall center than Hakeem Olajuwon.
Hyperbole is a logical fallacy.
Groogrux
04-09-2007, 01:24 PM
Hyperbole is a logical fallacy.
I know. :)
texanskan
04-09-2007, 01:57 PM
Purp-2
Garner-3
Uncle D-3
Kubs-INC
Smith-INC-but looking good
McNair-3 (a 5 for his class and open wallet a 1 for trusting CC)
JVG-5
CD-4
Les-4
Now Gerry H I would have rated very very high
solid
04-09-2007, 02:16 PM
Sports management in Houston, you really don't want to talk about this. Far too depressing. Especially, anything to do with the Texans.
dskillz
04-09-2007, 02:28 PM
The negativity in Houston sports is at an all-time low... this is still the epitome of bandwagon towns.
Yeah, because there is NO negativity in northern cities like Philly or NYC.
Joe Joe
04-09-2007, 03:06 PM
Tim Purpura - Inc. Very difficult to judge Timmy at the moment as I don't know what to attribute to him while not the GM and he hasn't had enough flexibilty to make many changes until this season.
Phil Garner - 2 Better than Williams, but still tend to think the Astros are not always put in the best position to win.
Gary Kubiak - Inc. One season. Not enough time.
Bob McNair - 1. CC was a bad hire.
Jeff Van Gundy - 4. Done well with the talent available to him. Not the best coach, but the Rockets win more than they should.
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