[Official] Reds @ Astros

[Castor27]

All series talk goes in here. DO NOT GIVE PLAY-BY-PLAY! If you need PBP try Yahoo, ESPN, or Sportsline.


7-25 Aaron Harang, RHP (10-6, 3.72) vs. Roger Clemens, RHP (2-3, 2.43) 7:05 on FSSW

7-26 Bronson Arroyo, RHP (9-6, 2.92) vs. Andy Pettitte, LHP (8-10, 5.08) 7:05 on FSSW

7-27 Elizardo Ramirez, RHP (3-6, 4.43) vs. Taylor Buchholz, RHP (6-8, 5.57) 7:05 on FSSW

[Groogrux]

WLW.

We must win four out of six this week. If not, it's going to be an uphill battle, IMO.

[MadMax]

sweep. this is the turn-around.

[Buck Turgidson]

sweep. this is the turn-around.
Word.

[Burzmali]

Time to turn this season around. Home field advantage, let's do this thing.

[rrj_gamz]

Home Field, what else can you ask for...This is the week to turn it around and kick some Reds Arse...

WWL...

[rocketfat]

WWW, with tejada hitting walk-off homer on thurs. :D

[weakfromtoday]

Huff's first game at MMP in an Astro's uniform. Hope he has a good showing and we put some runs on the board early for Rocket.

WWW

[RocketManJosh]

Gotta Be Week For the Astros!

WWW!!

[rikesh316]

LLW. Astros offense sucks.

[Hakeem's Dream]

LLW. Astros offense sucks.
How do you really feel? LOL

I have to say we will W-L-W. I don't think home field is an advantage to the team at this point. I know we have won more at home then on the road but we still aren't doing all that well at home either. I think this home stand will benefit us fans more than anyone. We get to go to our favorite park and cheer on our boys.

[Zac D]

7-26 Bronson Arroyo, RHP (9-6, 2.92) vs. Andy Pettitte, LHP (8-10, 5.08) 7:05 on FSSW

These numbers make me cry because they're so very, very wrong and backwards. I feel like Haven must have felt the year the Patriots beat the Rams.

BRONSON ARROYO IS NOT GOOD.

[rikesh316]

These numbers make me cry because they're so very, very wrong and backwards. I feel like Haven must have felt the year the Patriots beat the Rams.

BRONSON ARROYO IS NOT GOOD.

Arroyo used to pitch in a offensive monster of a division in the AL East. Now he comes to a division with the Astros, Cubs, and Pirates.

[macalu]

this is the defining series of the season. unfortunately, i see us losing 2 out 3.

[Nick]

No Berkman tonight... Lance feels like he can play, but Garner doesn't want to chance the groin.

Believe in the power of the hairdoo...

[dc rock]

Would it be melodramatic to say this is the most important series of the season ? Because I think it is...up to this point. Nevermind...

[BigM]

No Berkman tonight... Lance feels like he can play, but Garner doesn't want to chance the groin.

Believe in the power of the hairdoo...

wow that completely sucks. probably couldn't be a worse time to lose our best bat. we need to atleast take 2 out of 3.

[Hakeem's Dream]

No Berkman tonight... Lance feels like he can play, but Garner doesn't want to chance the groin.

Believe in the power of the hairdoo...
Thank heavens for that. I was hoping he would rest.

[Groogrux]

No Berkman tonight... Lance feels like he can play, but Garner doesn't want to chance the groin.

Believe in the power of the hairdoo...

Link?

I'm sure I'll hear it in the car in 11 minutes, though.

[NJRocket]

This series could really determine a lot about our season....we need a sweep imo.

[shawn786]

this is the defining series of the season.

Bingo!

[Stack24]

Bingo!

Dammit i lose again..i needed B-5

[Buck Turgidson]

Link?

I'm sure I'll hear it in the car in 11 minutes, though.
I'm guessing it was 790, they're regularly the first to report the lineups.

[rocketfat]

I'm guessing it was 790, they're regularly the first to report the lineups.

biggio, lamb, burke, huff, wilson, scott, ausmus, everett, rocket

[desihooper]

I think roger puts the team on his broad shoulders and carrys (i.e. wills) them to a victory tonight. Andy has got to give the team a real strong quality start tomorrow night, and hopefully Taylor will follow suit. Calling this series big a week before the trade deadline would be an understatement.

Tonight's starting line-up is pretty weak, but I think 2-4 could spark us just enough to get some runs for the Rocket and hopefully the bully can hold the lead.

[Rule0001]

The fake throw to second on the steal. Why i hate the NL, how do you fall for that? You have Adam Dunn at the plate, and you try to squeeze a run with a cheap steal? Some of these decisions just boggle my mind.

[Groogrux]

This ump is terrible.

[Major]

The fake throw to second on the steal. Why i hate the NL, how do you fall for that? You have Adam Dunn at the plate, and you try to squeeze a run with a cheap steal? Some of these decisions just boggle my mind.

What does this have to do with the NL?

[rocketfat]

What does this have to do with the NL?

lol. good question.

anybody think we are scoring a run tonight?

[AB]

lol. good question.

anybody think we are scoring a run tonight?

I thought we would get something here...

[Rox Addict]

I think roger puts the team on his broad shoulders and carrys (i.e. wills) them to a victory tonight. Andy has got to give the team a real strong quality start tomorrow night, and hopefully Taylor will follow suit. Calling this series big a week before the trade deadline would be an understatement.

Tonight's starting line-up is pretty weak, but I think 2-4 could spark us just enough to get some runs for the Rocket and hopefully the bully can hold the lead.



So much for the runs....and I just called it I said "Wilson is going to hit into a DP," and sure enough he did :mad: Can he be that slow or is he just LAZY !!!!!

[Blake]

So much for the runs....and I just called it I said "Wilson is going to hit into a DP," and sure enough he did :mad: Can he be that slow or is he just LAZY !!!!!

I said the exact same thing to my fiance right before he did it.

Watching the Stros bat these days is like getting your teeth pulled out one by one. Too bad I still watch most of the games... :mad:

[Rox Addict]

lol. good question.

anybody think we are scoring a run tonight?

I like that joke " Score a Run with the Rocket on the mound " :D :D :D :D
I'm going to tell that joke at work tomorrow it will go something like this:
Me: " hey guys you wanna hear a good joke ?"
Them: " yeah sure !!"
Me: " The Astros scored a run for Roger Clemens !! "
Them: [ falling on the ground laughing hestericly ] " oh my that is hillarious I have tears coming out of my eyes that is so funny !! " :D :D
One of them : " I just **** my pants " :D

[Rox Addict]

I said the exact same thing to my fiance right before he did it.

Watching the Stros bat these days is like getting your teeth pulled out one by one. Too bad I still watch most of the games... :mad:

Yeah I'm just like you !! People used to not think much about it when I would guess what a batter would do, pop out, hit into the DP, etc....But now I'm like watch this " Pujols is about to hit a HR to win this game, " " Ausmus is going to hit into a DP," " Wilson is going to strike out" now they think I'm psychic ... :D I'm like you bro...I keep coming back every night hopeing for a miracle...Love them Stros...

[arkoe]

Is it just me, or does Mansolino look just like Garner?

[sammy]

Im really irritated with Everett but who isnt?

[RocketManJosh]

Im really irritated with Everett but who isnt?

Yeah too bad we don't have even a decent replacement for him. I'd love to trade him this offseason and get a decent fielding/hitting SS. Don't need to be great at anything, but they need to be decent.

[Gene the PIG]

Jim Rome needs to call Adam Everett, Chrissy Everitt, right to his face. :rolleyes:

[Rox Addict]

Is it just me, or does Mansolino look just like Garner?
I was just thinking that :D They both look like Luigi ( Mario Brothers )

[sammy]

Yeah too bad we don't have even a decent replacement for him. I'd love to trade him this offseason and get a decent fielding/hitting SS. Don't need to be great at anything, but they need to be decent.

Shouldn't we have thought about this in the offseason?

[Rox Addict]

If I'm Roger Clemens and the Astros lose this game 1-0 , I walk straight into the locker room, take off my uniform, and walk right out and say " Screw ya'll " while I'm shooting them the bird :mad: :mad:

[jojobabbu]

Why can't Tim PooPoora get some dang hitter on this club. Until we make a move for the offense this team is going no where. I miss GH.

[jojobabbu]

If I'm Roger Clemens and the Astros lose this game 1-0 , I walk straight into the locker room, take off my uniform, and walk right out and say " Screw ya'll " while I'm shooting them the bird :mad: :mad:
can't agree with you more. The offense on this team flat out blows

[Rox Addict]

Shouldn't we have thought about this in the offseason?
Tejada ? Looks pretty good now...JD or Brownie said earlier that Hirsch is tearing up Triple- ball. He's 10-0 in his last start with a 1.09 ERA....What are we waiting for ?

[SamCassell]

Everett's failure to field that grounder by Clayton cleanly can't be scored as an error, but he's directly responsible for that 2nd run scoring if Clemens can't weave some magic here.

[arkoe]

In all fairness to the Astros, Aaron Harang's not a scrub. Neither is Arroyo who we get tomorrow.

[Zac D]

Why can't Tim PooPoora get some dang hitter on this club. Until we make a move for the offense this team is going no where. I miss GH.

It's actually spelled Purpura, and he very recently made a trade for a player named Aubrey Huff, a historically very good hitter.

It is not Purpura's fault that the players we have are not hitting. Furthermore, he KNOWS that the players we have are not hitting, and he's trying to get new ones who CAN hit, as evidenced by the Huff trade, the Tejada speculation, the (possibly desperation) Scott call-up...

[TMac#1]

2-0 game over :(

[sammy]

2-0 game over :(
Exactly what I was thinking. :(

[jojobabbu]

It's actually spelled Purpura, and he very recently made a trade for a player named Aubrey Huff, a historically very good hitter.

It is not Purpura's fault that the players we have are not hitting. Furthermore, he KNOWS that the players we have are not hitting, and he's trying to get new ones who CAN hit, as evidenced by the Huff trade, the Tejada speculation, the (possibly desperation) Scott call-up...

yea I know how to spell his name.....And yea he is to blame. He's had 2 seasons to put a decent lineup together and has failed ridiculously at it. The longer he waits to get another hitter the more this team will lose and the more Roger Clemens will get lose 1-0 well 2-0 now. Might as well be 10000000000000000 - 0

[Burzmali]

It really is strange how they can't score for Roger.

Is Berkman available to pinch hit?

[rcoleman15]

2-0 game over :(

Agreed

[rocketfat]

Exactly what I was thinking. :(

i think most of us were thinking that 1 run ago.

[Rox Addict]

Thats pathetic..Lamb didn't even try to hold Phillips at 3rd and he easily scored. That just goes to show you that this team just SUCKS !!!! They can't even play fundamental baseball.....When can we start a Fire Garner Thread ? :D Just Kidding I don't want to get killed on this board :)

[jojobabbu]

i think most of us were thinking that 1 run ago.

2-0 huh game oooooooooover

[Gene the PIG]

I hate us.

[Rox Addict]

It's actually spelled Purpura, and he very recently made a trade for a player named Aubrey Huff, a historically very good hitter.

It is not Purpura's fault that the players we have are not hitting. Furthermore, he KNOWS that the players we have are not hitting, and he's trying to get new ones who CAN hit, as evidenced by the Huff trade, the Tejada speculation, the (possibly desperation) Scott call-up...

No I think its POO-POO Ra :D

[Rox Addict]

2-0 game over :(
Yeah I know we just need Oswalt to say it :D

[Rox Addict]

yea I know how to spell his name.....And yea he is to blame. He's had 2 seasons to put a decent lineup together and has failed ridiculously at it. The longer he waits to get another hitter the more this team will lose and the more Roger Clemens will get lose 1-0 well 2-0 now. Might as well be 10000000000000000 - 0
Hey for a guy with 4 posts your pretty smart..I Like your Style . Welcome aboard... :)

[TMac#1]

2-0 is bad enough, now we're gonna bring in Trever Miller? :(

[JunkyardDwg]

The inability to score is no longer exclusive to a Clemens start...it's pretty much infected the entire rotation.

Whens the last time you heard the home crowd boo like this...the one thing the Astros have had going for them the past few seasons is a clear home field advantage; they always played better at home. And that ain't even happening anymore.

:mad: :(

[liamrock]

I'm pretty sure Purpura is not wavering from his opinion that the Astros lineup is more than adequate....the offseason acquisition of Preston Wilson was the "big bat we've been looking for..." and Huff was a "major announcement" McLane is happy b/c regardless of the way this team finishes, he'll turn a profit....don't let the $106 million payroll figure fool you...they will get some relief on Bagwell's deal....and the rest of the games will be near sell outs anyways.....

Oh well, at least we went to the Big Show last year!

[WhoMikeJames]

Boooooooooooooooo

[jojobabbu]

2-0 huh game oooooooooover

Biggio - Oldie
Burke - Inconsistent
Berkman - Doesnt stretch before games and gets a groin pulled
Lamb - Defense liability
Everett - Flat out sucks at offense
Taveras - Everett hits for more power
Wilson - ......
Ausmus - Well he's Ausmus
Huff - Solid 5 or 6 hitter

[TMac#1]

Wilson - Private Punchout
Ausmus - Captain Doubleplay
Everett - Whiffie McPopup


Insted of booing maybe they could a "we want tejada" chant going at minute maid

[Shaji]

Everett - Whiffie McPopup

i dont know why but i find this HILARIOUS

[jojobabbu]

Wilson - Private Punchout
Ausmus - Captain Doubleplay
Everett - Whiffie McPopup


Insted of booing maybe they could a "we want tejada" chant going at minute maid

lol!!!!!

[jojobabbu]

Biggio - Oldie
Burke - Inconsistent
Berkman - Doesnt stretch before games and gets a groin pulled
Lamb - Defense liability
Everett - Flat out sucks at offense
Taveras - Everett hits for more power
Wilson - ......
Ausmus - Well he's Ausmus
Huff - Solid 5 or 6 hitter

YEA GO ASTROS!!!!!!!!

[desihooper]

I was looking at the splits before the game today, and Berkman has pretty good numbers against Harang... please save the day!!

[liamrock]

I heard on 790 that David Delatti spoke with McLane and was told the payroll would NOT be increased one iota for this season....if that's the case, why in the heck would we even talk to Baltimore about Tejada? I'm guessing that it might be the Astros' wish to float rumors about it to make their fans think that they "gave it their best" but the the deal was unattainable...maybe I'm thinking irrationally...maybe it's the pathetic team I waste my evenings watching....I don't expect this team to win every game...but play good baseball...move runners over, look runners back to 3rd....a HS ball player could tell you that the runner on 3rd (Phillips) was the most important variable at that juncture...by NO means can he score right there.....getting Harang out is academic...

[liamrock]

I think it was Phil Garner who, when asked to describe how his hitters performed in the clutch, said..."strikeout, pop up, double play..."

[JunkyardDwg]

I'm pretty sure Purpura is not wavering from his opinion that the Astros lineup is more than adequate....the offseason acquisition of Preston Wilson was the "big bat we've been looking for..." and Huff was a "major announcement" McLane is happy b/c regardless of the way this team finishes, he'll turn a profit....don't let the $106 million payroll figure fool you...they will get some relief on Bagwell's deal....and the rest of the games will be near sell outs anyways.....

Oh well, at least we went to the Big Show last year!

Have you like not read/heard anything about the Astros over the past few weeks. Mcclane and Purpura are definitely NOT happy with the perfomance of this team. Why do you think they got Huff? WHy do you think they're rumblings of Preston Wilson being traded or acquiring Tejada? They both expect results, ESPECIALLY from a 100+ million dollar payroll. And if this team does not make the postseason, they will lose money, make no mistake.

[jojobabbu]

Whatever happened to Sammy Sosa after the corked bat incident

[liamrock]

Have you like not read/heard anything about the Astros over the past few weeks. Mcclane and Purpura are definitely NOT happy with the perfomance of this team. Why do you think they got Huff? WHy do you think they're rumblings of Preston Wilson being traded or acquiring Tejada? They both expect results, ESPECIALLY from a 100+ million dollar payroll. And if this team does not make the postseason, they will lose money, make no mistake.


Did you hear what McLane said today? They will NOT raise the payroll anymore this season.

[rocketfat]

Craig Biggio is batting .088 since the Allstar break.

Is that good? I don't really know...never been one of those numbers guys.

[Rox Addict]

I'm pretty sure Purpura is not wavering from his opinion that the Astros lineup is more than adequate....the offseason acquisition of Preston Wilson was the "big bat we've been looking for..." and Huff was a "major announcement" McLane is happy b/c regardless of the way this team finishes, he'll turn a profit....don't let the $106 million payroll figure fool you...they will get some relief on Bagwell's deal....and the rest of the games will be near sell outs anyways.....

Oh well, at least we went to the Big Show last year!

You know I made a similiar post the other day and I really thought that people were going to come through my computer and kill me. Heres how it goes. Drayton is not a baseball person, never even played the game. He lives in a Mansion in my hometown. I actually lived like two blocks from him, No I'm not rich he just built a Mansion in a middle class neighborhood. I also went to high school with one of his sons. so back to my point, Timmy the Hut...not a baseball player either or does he know a thing about it. What they are though are buisness men. To them its about making money not winning games. Now they might have the 3rd highest payroll in baseball but looked how they spent their money..ugh..!!!..Houston has good fans and will show up even if the Astros were 0-182 ( thats a good thing period but even better thing for McClane.). Drayton knows that the fans will always come and he will make his profits. Hell everytime I go to a game It costs me $100 for two people. A damn beer is $7, ice cream $7, bottled ****in water $5...So do you think they care ? If your not a baseball player and you don't have it in your heart and blood to win then " SO WHAT IF WE LOSE !!, I'M STILL GETTIN PAID." Bash me all you want but they do not care and please,please, do not come back with the " We have the 3rd Highest payroll," that doesn't mean jack !!

[Shaji]

i think im gonna cry.

[desihooper]

Very, very depressing to see this team play after what we've had the pleasure of viewing the past two seasons. Reality bites!

[rikesh316]

Biggio sucks!

[WhoMikeJames]

yaaa matt albers

[sammy]

Im pissed cuz I forgot to start Harang today.

[liamrock]

Geez...is Aaron Harang being mentioned as a Cy Young contender? He looks like the best pitcher aside from Liriano we've faced this year. Well, maybe that was John Maine or Sean Marshall.

[Austin70]

Seems like the last run the Astros scored for Roger was when Burke hit the walk off against the Braves, what the hell is wrong with their bats? :confused: :mad:

[The Cat]

Runner on third with one out. Twice. All this team needed were a couple of run of the mill, routine sacrifice flies combined with Lamb looking the runner back to third and this game is over. It's amazing how a team with so many veterans can lack such basic fundamentals, but it's been the flaw with this team all season long.

Also, not to be outdone, but Phil Garner comes through again. This series is the season right here. Make no mistake about it. I appreciate being "conservative" with injuries in most instances... but in this situation, if Lance says he can play, let him play. There's a time to be conservative, and this isn't one of them.

[desihooper]

That settles it....they're not going to make the playoffs this year. They just gave a rookie Shane Reynolds' old number!!! The curse of the Shaner!!

[IC2000]

That settles it....they're not going to make the playoffs this year. They just gave a rookie Shane Reynolds' old number!!! The curse of the Shaner!!
great time to bring in albers :mad: :rolleyes:

[JunkyardDwg]

Interesting move with Albers in a critical - still winnable - game. And yes realize it's a longshot at this point, but still.

[desihooper]

Don't worry, Albers has the make up of a guy who can succeed out of the pen :rolleyes:

Thanks Timmy!

[arkoe]

Geez...is Aaron Harang being mentioned as a Cy Young contender? He looks like the best pitcher aside from Liriano we've faced this year.

I think at this point he and Webb are at the top of the heap.

[TMac#1]

Interesting move with Albers in a critical - still winnable - game. And yes realize it's a longshot at this point, but still.


winnable :confused: No. 2-0 to the Astros is like 12-2 to a regular team.

[WhoMikeJames]

Albers is really nervous lol

[rikesh316]

WTF do you bring Albers in a close situation? Makes no sense. You still have Qualls, Wheeler and Lidge.

[JunkyardDwg]

Did you hear what McLane said today? They will NOT raise the payroll anymore this season.


Did you hear that from Mclane direct? Cause I specifically recall comments made by Purpura in regards to the payroll for the rest of the season and whether it might be raised and he said basically that nothing's set in stone. Still though, I'm willing to believe that they won't raise it anymore, and can you blame them? Why spend more when the money you've already poured in isn't giving you positive returns.

[Major]

Don't worry, Albers has the make up of a guy who can succeed out of the pen :rolleyes:

Thanks Timmy!

Yup - nothing like judging a rookie pitcher after one batter!

[BigCountry132]

Did you hear that from Mclane direct? Cause I specifically recall comments made by Purpura in regards to the payroll for the rest of the season and whether it might be raised and he said basically that nothing's set in stone. Still though, I'm willing to believe that they won't raise it anymore, and can you blame them? Why spend more when the money you've already poured in isn't giving you positive returns.


No he's right, I heard Dalati talk about it too. McClane supposedly held a meeting a day with the front office and told them that he didn't want to raise the payroll any higher this year.

[liamrock]

Time for "Every day Eddie" Guardado?

[JunkyardDwg]

To them its about making money not winning games. Now they might have the 3rd highest payroll in baseball but looked how they spent their money..ugh..!!!..Houston has good fans and will show up even if the Astros were 0-182 ( thats a good thing period but even better thing for McClane.). Drayton knows that the fans will always come and he will make his profits. Hell everytime I go to a game It costs me $100 for two people. A damn beer is $7, ice cream $7, bottled ****in water $5...So do you think they care ? If your not a baseball player and you don't have it in your heart and blood to win then " SO WHAT IF WE LOSE !!, I'M STILL GETTIN PAID." Bash me all you want but they do not care and please,please, do not come back with the " We have the 3rd Highest payroll," that doesn't mean jack !!

For any owner, the bottom line is making money....even Mark Cuban and Steinbrenner. And winning the ultimate prize birngs in a lot of money; even just making it to the postseason. Drayton realzied that last year when the 'Stros made it to the Big Show...which is why he's poured more money into this team. The best way to make money is to put people in the seats by putting a winning product on the field. And this is Houston...the fans may be suppporting this team now. But I guarantee you, they start losing like the Pirates and the fans will go bye bye. See the Rockets.

And I don't see anyone on this team that is just there to collect a paycheck.

[Rox Addict]

Ya'll are starting to see Garner make some odd moves..I posted a couple of days ago that The Astros are like the Cleveland Indians in that movie " Major League.." they want to lose...Maybe McClane is gonna move the team .. :D

[TMac#1]

this could be 18 straight scoreless for the astros, we have to look at Arroyo tommorow night. Not lookin good. :(

[JunkyardDwg]

No he's right, I heard Dalati talk about it too. McClane supposedly held a meeting a day with the front office and told them that he didn't want to raise the payroll any higher this year.

Just wanted clarification. But even so, I can't blame him one bit for that. If I was Mclane I'd tell Purp and Garner, "if you want me to fork over any more dough, then you better start winning with the 100 mill of talent I've already given you dammmit!"

[TMac#1]

all this talk about the 100mil payroll is old. 1/5 of that is Bagwell, 19 million dollars. We have 80 mil in talent not 100.

[arkoe]

Im pissed cuz I forgot to start Harang today.

I could have really used the points for a complete game shutout. Oh well.

[RocketManJosh]

... We are filling the grave with dirt now

[Major]

all this talk about the 100mil payroll is old. 1/5 of that is Bagwell, 19 million dollars. We have 80 mil in talent not 100.

That doesn't change the fact that the ballclub is paying it.

[SamCassell]

WTP Scott up for the Stros with the game on the line.

[Rox Addict]

For any owner, the bottom line is making money....even Mark Cuban and Steinbrenner. And winning the ultimate prize birngs in a lot of money; even just making it to the postseason. Drayton realzied that last year when the 'Stros made it to the Big Show...which is why he's poured more money into this team. The best way to make money is to put people in the seats by putting a winning product on the field. And this is Houston...the fans may be suppporting this team now. But I guarantee you, they start losing like the Pirates and the fans will go bye bye. See the Rockets.

And I don't see anyone on this team that is just there to collect a paycheck.
JYD,
you uselly make some real good posts so I have respect for you but its obvious you like McClane and what he has done but let me point out something you stated in your post.." Even Mark Cuban and Steinbrenner.." okay those guys are so passionate about winning. Mark Cuban is freakin crazy and I can't stand him but man he doesn't care if he is fined for whatever it takes to get his team motivated. Just Last year Steinbrenner was all over the news and papers bashing his team for playing horribly...Garner and McClane never do anything to get the Stros heads out of their asses..I agree with you on the Rockets because thats my #1 team and I'm a Rocket fan 1st then an Astros 2nd. Its weird because the fans get to all Roxs games late and they will stop coming but its different with the Astros and I think its because its cheaper to go to a Stros game than a Rockets game...just my two cents JYD...

[IC2000]

JYD,
you uselly make some real good posts so I have respect for you but its obvious you like McClane and what he has done but let me point out something you stated in your post.." Even Mark Cuban and Steinbrenner.." okay those guys are so passionate about winning. Mark Cuban is freakin crazy and I can't stand him but man he doesn't care if he is fined for whatever it takes to get his team motivated. Just Last year Steinbrenner was all over the news and papers bashing his team for playing horribly...Garner and McClane never do anything to get the Stros heads out of their asses..I agree with you on the Rockets because thats my #1 team and I'm a Rocket fan 1st then an Astros 2nd. Its weird because the fans get to all Roxs games late and they will stop coming but its different with the Astros and I think its because its cheaper to go to a Stros game than a Rockets game...just my two cents JYD...
I am sure palmeiro will get a hit :rolleyes:

[Rule0001]

i smell a homerun

[Rileydog]

why the hell isn't berkman pinch hitting. we're down to our last out. it's not like we need the guy to run.

[BigSherv]

damn it

[arkoe]

why the hell isn't berkman pinch hitting. we're down to our last out. it's not like we need the guy to run.

Because Garner used him in an RBI pinch hit situation in the 8th.

[Shaji]

why the hell isn't berkman pinch hitting. we're down to our last out. it's not like we need the guy to run.

he pinch hit earlier

[TMac#1]

:( Another shutout, this is a damn joke. Clemens a loss :mad: Maybe this team does need to be taken apart

[The Cat]

Chalk up another one to Phil Garner.

Rest your best player in the biggest game of the season when he says he can play. Then take out a superior pinch-hitter (Palmeiro) for an awful hitter (Bruntlett) simply because he's right-handed.

The only thing more frustrating to watch than this team... is its manager.

[sammy]

why the hell isn't berkman pinch hitting. we're down to our last out. it's not like we need the guy to run.


He already pinch hit. Missed Oppurtinities - story of our season. Lets just face it...We are not clutch - players and Garner

[liamrock]

6 games under .500

[Blake]

pathetic

[rocketfat]

Chalk up another one to Phil Garner.

Rest your best player in the biggest game of the season when he says he can play. Then take out a superior pinch-hitter (Palmeiro) for an awful hitter (Bruntlett) simply because he's right-handed.

The only thing more frustrating to watch than this team... is its manager.

give me a break dude. i'm all for garner bashing, but those are some poor complaints. there really isn't a correct move garner can make with this assemblage of garbage, and you cant fault him for being cautious with our only good player.

[Blake]

That Aubrey Huff deal looks better and better every game. At least he won one for us at first...

[TMac#1]

god damned Miguel Tejada is 4 for 4 tonight with an RBI and run scored and is now batting .329 with 70 RBI , PULL THE F'N TRIGGER BEFORE IT'S TOO LATE :mad :mad:

[The Cat]

give me a break dude. i'm all for garner bashing, but those are some poor complaints. there really isn't a correct move garner can make with this assemblage of garbage, and you cant fault him for being cautious with our only good player.

Yes you can. This series is the season. There's no use saving Lance for tomorrow if there's the possibilty that tomorrow won't exist. And, at some point, you should trust a player's judgment. At least ask the player how they're feeling. To not give Lance the chance to play without even asking or checking his status is incredibly irresponsible and over conservative managing.

Furthermore, while Palmeiro's at-bats have been unlucky thus far this season and he hasn't had the success he had a season ago, you have to consider the sample size. He's still an outstanding situational hitter who gives more quality at-bats than anyone on this team in terms of working counts and understanding the strike zone. I understand that Bray is a lefty, but asking for a contribution from the righties on our bench (Bruntlett and Taveras) is effectively ending the game.

If Palmeiro's up, he doesn't stare at those perfect first two strikes from Bray and doesn't get himself in a hole and swinging too late on the pitch Bruntlett weakly popped to center. (imo of course)

[Blake]

god damned Miguel Tejada is 4 for 4 tonight with an RBI and run scored and is now batting .329 with 70 RBI , PULL THE F'N TRIGGER BEFORE IT'S TOO LATE :mad :mad:

no point. once he spends a week in our clubhouse he will forget how to get clutch at bats...

sometimes I wish our starters would just flip out and scream at our other players in the locker room

[DieHard Rocket]

god damned Miguel Tejada is 4 for 4 tonight with an RBI and run scored and is now batting .329 with 70 RBI , PULL THE F'N TRIGGER BEFORE IT'S TOO LATE :mad :mad:

Yes, since that is exactly how it is. Baltimore is just waiting on the Astros to say yes. They're ready to ship Tejada off and the Astros are the only bidder.

:rolleyes:

[TMac#1]

sometimes I wish our starters would just flip out and scream at our other players in the locker room

Roy O and Rocket should gang up and jump Everett, Ausmus and Wilson in the parking lot.

[rikesh316]

Roy O and Rocket should gang up and jump Everett, Ausmus and Wilson in the parking lot.

And Biggo, Berry, and Garner.

[TMac#1]

they may as well use the bats for something, they surely don't hit baseballs with them.

[JunkyardDwg]

JYD,
you uselly make some real good posts so I have respect for you but its obvious you like McClane and what he has done but let me point out something you stated in your post.." Even Mark Cuban and Steinbrenner.." okay those guys are so passionate about winning. Mark Cuban is freakin crazy and I can't stand him but man he doesn't care if he is fined for whatever it takes to get his team motivated. Just Last year Steinbrenner was all over the news and papers bashing his team for playing horribly...Garner and McClane never do anything to get the Stros heads out of their asses..I agree with you on the Rockets because thats my #1 team and I'm a Rocket fan 1st then an Astros 2nd. Its weird because the fans get to all Roxs games late and they will stop coming but its different with the Astros and I think its because its cheaper to go to a Stros game than a Rockets game...just my two cents JYD...

In the time I've been watching this team, they have always been about keeping things in-house, leading by example...and not resorting to petty comments in the newspapers. I pretty much respect that approach. You have something to say to a coach, to a player, you say it to their faces. And again, you lead by example. Chris Burke hustling to first base the other game; that's the type of play that can provide a spark (though it didn't).

At this point I don't see how Garner or Mclane bashing a team/players when they're already down will do anything but create more friction and frustration in the clubhouse. Perhaps the mistake made is that the Chronicle didn't run a tombstone this year. :p In any case, I've always found it tactless and petty to go on a public rant of your players. Just look at how much flak Garner took last year for some comments (misinterpreted) he made after game 4. And Cuban, he falls into both categories. Clearly the running of his mouth cost the team in some form during their run (even Nowitski has told him to shut it). And his example filtered down to the players, creating a bunch of floppers who b*** and moan when things don't go their way.

I haven't really had any problem with the way the two (Mclane and Garner) have led; they have made moves to try and turn things around (trades and demotions to put players on notice)...the on-field decisions though, yes questionable at times. And as for Mclane, yes I like what he has done the past few years because it's clear he wants this team to win, a point that has been discussed thoroughly.

[Kerfeld]

another night I go to sleep p. o.

[Rox Addict]

The Astros have given Roger clemens 0 runs in 7 of his starts...How he has not broken some arms in the locker room I don't know.
Garner on Foxsports " I just can't explain it.." What a dumb Ass...
Clemens on Foxsports " Its WEIRD.." No Rocket its a bunch of horse ****...thats what it is. Has anyone really stopped and thought about how Clemens really feels ? Yes i know somw of you are going to say " man he got 22 million for a 3rd of a season.." but we are talking about one of the greatest competeters of all time....I mean before we got The Unit we were going to get Clemens and he got MAD at us and whent to New York...I wish he would get mad at his team mates and coach...

[Rox Addict]

god damned Miguel Tejada is 4 for 4 tonight with an RBI and run scored and is now batting .329 with 70 RBI , PULL THE F'N TRIGGER BEFORE IT'S TOO LATE :mad :mad:
Can you imagine Tejadas bat in there instead of Everettes and Berkman batting tonight, we would easily have won....Why can't Wheeler be the closer and we trade Lidge..Wheeler has actually been the closest thing to LIGHTS OUT that we have....

[TMac#1]

Can you imagine Tejadas bat in there instead of Everettes and Berkman batting tonight, we would easily have won....Why can't Wheeler be the closer and we trade Lidge..Wheeler has actually been the closest thing to LIGHTS OUT that we have....


I'd do that but I think Qualls would actually make a better closer. He has closer type stuff. 97 live fastball, and pretty nasty sinker/slider. His ERA has been like 0.59 the last few weeks. He seems to struggle the most when he inherits runners. wagner...dotel...lidge...qualls

I actually think Tejada is underrated to Astros fans. He is a former MVP, good for .320 35 and 120 and plays SS, and just turned 30. Berkman..Tejada..healthy Ensberg...Huff. That's tough
3 4 5 6

[Rox Addict]

I'd do that but I think Qualls would actually make a better closer. He has closer type stuff. 97 live fastball, and pretty nasty sinker/slider. His ERA has been like 0.59 the last few weeks. He seems to struggle the most when he inherits runners. wagner...dotel...lidge...qualls

I actually think Tejada is underrated to Astros fans. He is a former MVP, good for .320 35 and 120 and plays SS, and just turned 30. Berkman..Tejada..healthy Ensberg...Huff. That's tough
3 4 5 6
We think alike and obviously have the same favorite Rocket player # 1

[SamCassell]

Minus Berkman and a healthy Ensberg, this is an offense that doesn't scare anyone. Lamb and Burke are good complimentary pieces, but the rest of the lineup to date lacks punch, doesn't get on base, and strikes out far too often.

[TMac#1]

We think alike and obviously have the same favorite Rocket player # 1


speaking of underrated....Tracy McGrady.....

[gunn]

I'd do that but I think Qualls would actually make a better closer. He has closer type stuff. 97 live fastball......

Qualls does have good "stuff" but he dosen't run it up to 97 mph.

[arkoe]

god damned Miguel Tejada is 4 for 4 tonight with an RBI and run scored and is now batting .329 with 70 RBI , PULL THE F'N TRIGGER BEFORE IT'S TOO LATE :mad :mad:

You do realize they're going to wait until the last minute to see what offers come in right before the deadline, don't you?

[Major]

Can you imagine Tejadas bat in there instead of Everettes and Berkman batting tonight, we would easily have won....

Really? We've been shutout plenty of times with Berkman in the lineup. Yet you think adding him and Tejada would guarantee 3 more runs than we scored?

[Major]

Minus Berkman and a healthy Ensberg, this is an offense that doesn't scare anyone. Lamb and Burke are good complimentary pieces, but the rest of the lineup to date lacks punch, doesn't get on base, and strikes out far too often.

Agreed, but I think if you take out the two best players of most lineups (outside of the Yankees and such), they'd be pretty crappy.

[Major]

Yes you can. This series is the season. There's no use saving Lance for tomorrow if there's the possibilty that tomorrow won't exist. And, at some point, you should trust a player's judgment. At least ask the player how they're feeling. To not give Lance the chance to play without even asking or checking his status is incredibly irresponsible and over conservative managing.


Do you even know what Garner saw? Do you know what the trainers advised? How he was running in pre-game? What Berkman said to Garner? How serious the injury looked post-game on Sunday?

Making an assumption about an injury based on a complete lack of information and then criticizing the manager for it is absolutely ridiculous. A healthy Berkman is crucial to the rest of the season, and one game in July simply doesn't make or break the season. A few days ago you were sitting here asking if anyones really expects Cincinnati to be in it at the end. If you don't, then today's game is no different than any of the other 60 we'll play over the next 2 months.

[Major]

Mark Cuban is freakin crazy and I can't stand him but man he doesn't care if he is fined for whatever it takes to get his team motivated. Just Last year Steinbrenner was all over the news and papers bashing his team for playing horribly...

And that worked so well for those teams. They got no farther than the Astros last year, who's manager and owner never publically attacked them when they were 15-30.

[SamCassell]

Agreed, but I think if you take out the two best players of most lineups (outside of the Yankees and such), they'd be pretty crappy.
And I agree with you. I guess the point is that this lineup is missing those 2 pieces, and the rest of baseball isn't. We need both Ensberg and Berkman to compete, and I have little hope for improved offensive production until they are both available. And I'm not sure when that's going to be.

Roger deserves better than this, 2 years in a row.

[Major]

And I agree with you. I guess the point is that this lineup is missing those 2 pieces, and the rest of baseball isn't. We need both Ensberg and Berkman to compete, and I have little hope for improved offensive production until they are both available. And I'm not sure when that's going to be.

Roger deserves better than this, 2 years in a row.

Have we heard anything on the status of Ensberg? He should be eligible to come off the DL tomorrow, but do we know what his expected timeframe is?

I don't feel sorry for Roger, though. He's had years of great run support in his career too - it all balances out. And he's getting paid an absurd amount to pitch 6 innings a game - over $100,000 per inning, I think. He's won 2 Cy-Youngs as a result of good run support (2004, when Randy Johnson deserved it, and one year with the Yankees when he was like 9th or 10th in ERA but had a ridiculous record due to his run support).

[Shehzad23]

So many bad at bats, every one is hacking at the first pitch. They need to make the pitcher throw more pitches, so many quick innings.

[Uprising]

Wow, this team really can't score for Roger. :(

Bright spot is that Scott is hitting the ball.

[The Cat]

Do you even know what Garner saw? Do you know what the trainers advised? How he was running in pre-game? What Berkman said to Garner? How serious the injury looked post-game on Sunday?

Making an assumption about an injury based on a complete lack of information and then criticizing the manager for it is absolutely ridiculous. A healthy Berkman is crucial to the rest of the season, and one game in July simply doesn't make or break the season. A few days ago you were sitting here asking if anyones really expects Cincinnati to be in it at the end. If you don't, then today's game is no different than any of the other 60 we'll play over the next 2 months.

It was reported on both the radio and television broadcasts that Lance said he was ready to play, but Garner filled out his lineup card without even talking to Lance because he wanted to play it conservative. I also know Lance and Garner both said they expected it to be fine on Sunday night and Lance said he expected to play tonight.

These aren't all assumptions.

[Rox Addict]

Have we heard anything on the status of Ensberg? He should be eligible to come off the DL tomorrow, but do we know what his expected timeframe is?

I don't feel sorry for Roger, though. He's had years of great run support in his career too - it all balances out. And he's getting paid an absurd amount to pitch 6 innings a game - over $100,000 per inning, I think. He's won 2 Cy-Youngs as a result of good run support (2004, when Randy Johnson deserved it, and one year with the Yankees when he was like 9th or 10th in ERA but had a ridiculous record due to his run support).
If you don't feel bad for Roger then why in the world do you have so many posts ? You can't obviously be an Astros fan ....Who cares how much he gets paid he is one of about 3 Stros that works his butt off and in return these guys give him 0 run support...Money doesn't bring happiness...so don't jump on the " he's getting paid this much per inning so I don't feel bad for him.."

[Rox Addict]

Have we heard anything on the status of Ensberg? He should be eligible to come off the DL tomorrow, but do we know what his expected timeframe is?

I don't feel sorry for Roger, though. He's had years of great run support in his career too - it all balances out. And he's getting paid an absurd amount to pitch 6 innings a game - over $100,000 per inning, I think. He's won 2 Cy-Youngs as a result of good run support (2004, when Randy Johnson deserved it, and one year with the Yankees when he was like 9th or 10th in ERA but had a ridiculous record due to his run support).
Yeah we heard something....He was never hurt. He has had two MRI and they can't find anything wrong with Ensberg. He was slumping before he got hurt. I was at that Astros-Braves game and I was sitting right behind the Braves dugout. Mo made a great attempt to get the ball but it wasn't like he did anything serious to harm himself. He even played 2 more innings.. Its all either psychological or in his mechanics. Pictures studied Mo and Lane and they stopped pitching to them but Mo and Lane didn't make the adjustments to the pitching...

[FlyerFanatic]

So many bad at bats, every one is hacking at the first pitch. They need to make the pitcher throw more pitches, so many quick innings.

I didn't see all of the game, but towards the 8th and 9th innings, it looked like they weren't hacking at the first pitch. More so, they would sit and watch the first pitch strike right down the middle.

[rocketfat]

am i still the only person on this board that understands that craig biggio is one of the worst players in the league?

do him and ausmus have ANY pride whatsoever?

[macalu]

am i still the only person on this board that understands that craig biggio is one of the worst players in the league?

do him and ausmus have ANY pride whatsoever?
of course they have pride. otherwise, why would they go out there sucking it up everyday. i guess you meant, why don't they swallow their pride and ride the pine.

[Major]

It was reported on both the radio and television broadcasts that Lance said he was ready to play, but Garner filled out his lineup card without even talking to Lance because he wanted to play it conservative. I also know Lance and Garner both said they expected it to be fine on Sunday night and Lance said he expected to play tonight.

These aren't all assumptions.

I'm sure Lance felt he was ready to play. That doesn't answer any of my questions - was he running ok? Did the trainer think he was ok? Feeling ready to play for an athlete is very, very different from actually being ready to play, especially with a groin injury that can easily get much worse. For example, we've seen Roy try to pitch through that before and aggravate it when he thought he was fine.

[Major]

If you don't feel bad for Roger then why in the world do you have so many posts ? You can't obviously be an Astros fan ....Who cares how much he gets paid he is one of about 3 Stros that works his butt off and in return these guys give him 0 run support...Money doesn't bring happiness...so don't jump on the " he's getting paid this much per inning so I don't feel bad for him.."

I am an Astros fan, not a Roger Clemens fan. He's one member of the team - I feel sorry for him no more than I do everyone else on the team who has to suffer the losing. He's no different than any other player - he didn't take a hometown discount these last two years. He's not pitching for us out of some kind of love for the Houston Astros. He's doing it because he can get paid a huge amount and stay at home with his family - nothing more.

The Astros two years ago got him a Cy Young that he didn't deserve. They've done just as much for him as he's done for them.

[Major]

Yeah we heard something....He was never hurt. He has had two MRI and they can't find anything wrong with Ensberg. He was slumping before he got hurt. I was at that Astros-Braves game and I was sitting right behind the Braves dugout. Mo made a great attempt to get the ball but it wasn't like he did anything serious to harm himself. He even played 2 more innings.. Its all either psychological or in his mechanics. Pictures studied Mo and Lane and they stopped pitching to them but Mo and Lane didn't make the adjustments to the pitching...

Getting an MRI doesn't prove you're not hurt. I have had a knee injury for the last few months - MRI showed nothing. Physical therapy did nothing. No one can figure out what's wrong as of yet. It still exists, though, and it's not mental.

He was certainly slumping before the injury - and we'll see what happens when he gets back. But while he wasn't hitting for average, he was hitting for power before the injury and not after, so it did have some kind of effect.

[Hakeem's Dream]

Biggio sucks!
BLASPHEMY!

[Hakeem's Dream]

WTF do you bring Albers in a close situation? Makes no sense. You still have Qualls, Wheeler and Lidge.
Probably because it wouldn't hurt anything. They game was a loss already. He has to get out there some time so I think that was a great time to pitch, it was only to 1 batter anyway. Garner's not stupid.

[macalu]

BLASPHEMY!
too bad it's true. :o

[rikesh316]

Luke Scott has been hitting the ball hard everytime including outs. He has looked like the best Astros hitter since the break other than Berkman and I bet you he won't get a start again.

[Hakeem's Dream]

too bad it's true. :o
How can you say he sucks? What has he done wrong? I am just curiuos because I thought he's always been a dedicated, hardworking great player.

[Hakeem's Dream]

Luke Scott has been hitting the ball hard everytime including outs. He has looked like the best Astros hitter since the break other than Berkman and I bet you he won't get a start again.
I think he will. He's proving that he can do better in the majors then what was expected.

[Buck Turgidson]

Who let all these dumbasses out of the GARM?

Cat: if Berkman plays, Lamb - one of the 2 guys who looked like they had a clue in the box last night - sits. How's that help, really?

[Buck Turgidson]

I bet you he won't get a start again.
I'm yer huckleberry. Tipjar bet, name the price.

[Zac D]

Want an all-out offensive lineup?

C: Munson
1B: Berkman
2B: Lamb
SS: Burke
3B: Huff
LF: Palmeiro
CF: Wilson
RF: Scott

We'd still lose, but boy howdy, we'd lose differently.

[The Cat]

Who let all these dumbasses out of the GARM?

Cat: if Berkman plays, Lamb - one of the 2 guys who looked like they had a clue in the box last night - sits. How's that help, really?

Berkman has significantly more power potential than Lamb, and one shot last night could've completely changed the tone of the game.

[rrj_gamz]

This is bs and this insn't justice for Roger...Yeah, I know berkman is out, but still, someone make a play...

However, Roger knew of this coming into the season...

[Buck Turgidson]

Berkman has significantly more power potential than Lamb, and one shot last night could've completely changed the tone of the game.
And he had a chance to do that. Popped up, like everybody else.

He could have just as easily torn his groin as hit a homer, who the hell knows? We *do* know that the guy he would have replaced had 2 of their 6 hits. You're acting like this is some no-brainer that Berkman plays. Nobody else, on the broadcast or in print, seems to feel that way. Nor does Berkman.

"You don't want it to be a long, drawn out process, and the next thing you know, you have to go on the [disabled list]," Berkman said.

Also...OP's had all of 2 ABs against lhp this season, Bruntlett's had about 40, and is hitting .380 against them. '03-05 OPS vs LHP: OP - .444 Bruntlett - .808

Stros had their chances to win, poor fundamentals & a bit of luck put the kaibosh on that. Trying to pin this loss on Garner is a bit silly, dontchathink?

[MadMax]

i don't wanna turn this into another AE thread....but i found it hilarious that after the 'stros put up a goose egg last night, all the guys on the morning show could talk about was AE at the plate.

[Groogrux]

i don't wanna turn this into another AE thread....but i found it hilarious that after the 'stros put up a goose egg last night, all the guys on the morning show could talk about was AE at the plate.

Are you serious? He even had one of the few hits.

[Buck Turgidson]

Hey Cat, also thought about ya last night (scary, huh) during AE's squeeze attempt. Did you hear the "SQUEEZE" yelled out when the runner broke, see the catcher jump out of his crouch & the pitcher gun a shoulder-high fastball? They were looking for it.

Good scouting & execution by the Reds. Contrast with the Stros inability to execute a rundown & field a sac bunt. Poor fundamentals piss me off to no end.

[MadMax]

Are you serious? He even had one of the few hits.

yep. justice talked about him not getting the bunt down and leaving a guy on 3B. never mind that the top of the lineup didn't drive anyone in. the guy in the 8 hole didn't, and that's your problem. :rolleyes:

[Buck Turgidson]

yep. justice talked about him not getting the bunt down
You're ****ting me, right?

[MadMax]

You're ****ting me, right?

i'm being dead serious. i listened this morning for a long time because i was trapped in my car, unable to get to work and unable to get back home due to street flooding.

justice said, "gotta get that bunt down" at least 3x. no mention of the fact that no one else drove in runs, either. including lance in a PH role.

[Buck Turgidson]

justice said, "gotta get that bunt down" at least 3x.
Then Richard Justice doesn't know a damn thing about how to play baseball.

The rest of AE's at-bat wasn't good, though. His bobble in the 7th didn't help either. But pinning that loss on any one player is ridiculous.

[Hakeem's Dream]

I think we need Lamb at first from now on. I love Biggio but I am beginning to wonder if he's getting tired. He's not the Biggio of yesteryear. I am going to have to go with Burke on 2nd. I like Huff on 3rd. I will miss Mo but I think he would be happy in Cali. I think Willy T should play center, Berkman should play RF and Bruntlett in LF. I feel so weird saying all of this but it's true. I wouldn't mind seeing Scott in LF either. Whoever is a faster runner in the outfield and on base.

[leroy420]

Want an all-out offensive lineup?

C: Munson
1B: Berkman
2B: Lamb
SS: Burke
3B: Huff
LF: Palmeiro
CF: Wilson
RF: Scott

We'd still lose, but boy howdy, we'd lose differently.

You surely don't mean Orlando Palmeiro. You're talking about Rafael, right? Because Orlando is probably the worst offensive option we have right now. Not only does he not hit for power, have any speed, or play especially well on defense, he's in a terrible slump. If this lineup were anywhere near possible, I'd have Bruntlett in at CF and keep Wilson in LF.

IMO, Palmeiro should be released when Morgan is back. Keep Luke up here. He's simply the better option.

[NJRocket]

Then Richard Justice doesn't know a damn thing about how to play baseball.

The rest of AE's at-bat wasn't good, though. His bobble in the 7th didn't help either. But pinning that loss on any one player is ridiculous.

Especially when AE was one of the leadoff doubles that got stranded

[Buck Turgidson]

IMO, Palmeiro should be released when Morgan is back. Keep Luke up here. He's simply the better option.
Agreed. Hate that they gave him a 2-year deal, but that shouldn't be a hinderance to making a move. He was great last year, but has been next to worthless this one.

[The Cat]

And he had a chance to do that. Popped up, like everybody else.

He could have just as easily torn his groin as hit a homer, who the hell knows? We *do* know that the guy he would have replaced had 2 of their 6 hits. You're acting like this is some no-brainer that Berkman plays. Nobody else, on the broadcast or in print, seems to feel that way. Nor does Berkman.

"You don't want it to be a long, drawn out process, and the next thing you know, you have to go on the [disabled list]," Berkman said.

Also...OP's had all of 2 ABs against lhp this season, Bruntlett's had about 40, and is hitting .380 against them. '03-05 OPS vs LHP: OP - .444 Bruntlett - .808

Stros had their chances to win, poor fundamentals & a bit of luck put the kaibosh on that. Trying to pin this loss on Garner is a bit silly, dontchathink?

Seriously Buck, do you really expect a player, broadcaster or writer to call out Phil Garner? They all have legit reasons to follow the company line. I really doubt Lance is going to come out and blast his own manager in the press... that's simply not how things work in this clubhouse. Neither will the local media, or they risk losing sources. That's not how this town's media works. New York, yes, Houston, no.

As for the Bruntlett/Palmeiro OPS numbers, I understand that Bruntlett is typically a better option against LHP. But many of those statistics were from platoon starts against mediocre, run of the mill lefties with Wandy Rodriguez-like stuff. It is my opinion that against elite pitchers, Palmeiro's approach and understanding of the strike zone gives us as good a chance as anyone on this team to reach base, even if it's against a left-hander. Upon further reflection, however, I do realize that it is very speculative on my part, so I apologize for being as hard on Garner as I was for that particular move (but not sitting Berkman).

As for Lance popping up, that was one at-bat. He should've had four. Yes, I recognize that Lamb had two hits. I also recognize that a home run would've significantly altered the course and tone of the game, and we had our best hitter and one of the elite power threats in the game on the bench for a game that he himself said he was fit to play. Given how important it was, that irks me.

However, I'll put it behind me and cheer them on tonight as much as ever. Hopefully this is the turnaround and we still take this series.

[liamrock]

Looks like Berkman is on the shelf again tonight.....per Garner's conversation with Charlie Palillo.

[The Cat]

You surely don't mean Orlando Palmeiro. You're talking about Rafael, right? Because Orlando is probably the worst offensive option we have right now. Not only does he not hit for power, have any speed, or play especially well on defense, he's in a terrible slump. If this lineup were anywhere near possible, I'd have Bruntlett in at CF and keep Wilson in LF.

IMO, Palmeiro should be released when Morgan is back. Keep Luke up here. He's simply the better option.

Keep Luke and Palmeiro both... demote Willy.

Palmeiro's not really in a slump. It's simply the nature of a contact spray hitter. With non-power hitters, there will be some years where those hard-hit balls find gaps, and others where they're sprayed right at fielders. There's no home run threat to be the equalizer. I don't see Palmeiro as being in a slump or hitting any different than he did a year ago... it's just a little worse luck. It's the nature of his type of hitter.

Releasing Palmeiro would be a terrible, terrible mistake, imo. He gives you more quality at-bats than almost anyone on the team. He can work counts, foul off bad pitches and often gets walks in situations where he has no business drawing them. And for a team that struggles so mightily to drive in runners from third with one out, Palmeiro's role is even more important. It's imperative given the nature of our hitters that we have a bat on the bench who can be relied upon to consistently make contact and come up with a sacrifice fly when the situation dictates it.

You can't judge every player by numbers. Baseball's a flukish game like that, especially when you're a pinch-hitter with an incredibly small sample size. Sometimes you simply have to watch the quality of the at-bats, and Palmeiro gives us more than any player on this roster. Combine that with our desperate need for contact hitters (runner on third, 1 out situations), and he's a huge asset to this bench.

[Hakeem's Dream]

Keep Luke and Palmeiro both... demote Willy.

Palmeiro's not really in a slump. It's simply the nature of a contact spray hitter. With non-power hitters, there will be some years where those hard-hit balls find gaps, and others where they're sprayed right at fielders. There's no home run threat to be the equalizer. I don't see Palmeiro as being in a slump or hitting any different than he did a year ago... it's just a little worse luck. It's the nature of his type of hitter.

Releasing Palmeiro would be a terrible, terrible mistake, imo. He gives you more quality at-bats than almost anyone on the team. He can work counts, foul off bad pitches and often gets walks in situations where he has no business drawing them. And for a team that struggles so mightily to drive in runners from third with one out, Palmeiro's role is even more important. It's imperative given the nature of our hitters that we have a bat on the bench who can be relied upon to consistently make contact and come up with a sacrifice fly when the situation dictates it.

You can't judge every player by numbers. Baseball's a flukish game like that, especially when you're a pinch-hitter with an incredibly small sample size. Sometimes you simply have to watch the quality of the at-bats, and Palmeiro gives us more than any player on this roster. Combine that with our desperate need for contact hitters (runner on third, 1 out situations), and he's a huge asset to this bench.
Why Willy? He's one of our speedy guys and he plays as good of CF as anybody else, imo.

[Buck Turgidson]

Keep Luke and Palmeiro both... demote Willy.
Forgot about Willy. Good post.

[RocketManJosh]

I think tonight and tomorrow night are as close to "must win" as it gets ... we absolutely cannot afford to lose this series. Andy better bring it tonight

[liamrock]

Some highlights from Palillo's interview with Garner

- Wants to play it cautious with Berkman...he's gonna see how he looks during BP and make the call.

- He thinks it's gonna take 90 wins to win the Wild Card....Stros would have to go 43-19.....lol

- Reiterated that they were not gonna mortgage the future (Pence, Hirsch) for a couple of months of production (Soriano, Carlos Lee)

- Said that whatever reports have surfaced are probably not true....

- Agrees that the team needs a significant offensive addition...not just a journeyman bat....

Significant bats that are out there.....

Soriano/Abreu/Tejada/Pat Burrell/Carlos Lee

then some under the radar guys

Carl Crawford (dreaming)
Javy Lopez...an obvious upgrade offensively at catcher

Sellers would seem to be D-Rays/Phillies/Nationals/Orioles/D-Backs (maybe Luis Gonzalez or Shawn Green)/Pirates/Mariners (Raul Ibanez)/Royals

[The Cat]

Hey Cat, also thought about ya last night (scary, huh) during AE's squeeze attempt. Did you hear the "SQUEEZE" yelled out when the runner broke, see the catcher jump out of his crouch & the pitcher gun a shoulder-high fastball? They were looking for it.

Good scouting & execution by the Reds. Contrast with the Stros inability to execute a rundown & field a sac bunt. Poor fundamentals piss me off to no end.

Sorry Buck, I scanned the thread earlier and missed this post. I appreciate the thoughts. ;) I saw it, and I understand what you were getting at. But that was a situation where it was easy to gun the shoulder-high fastball, because it was a 0-1 count. That wasn't exactly a count where the squeeze is easy to execute. I'm not one of these people who thinks a squeeze is automatic... I know it's complex and a lot goes into it.

My only frustration is in situations like the Cubs game last Thursday where Adam's ahead in the count (2-0) then and Garner still doesn't put it down. At that point, the pitcher is much more focused on throwing a strike and is prone to missing calls because of that focus. And, even if it does work out for the defense... Adam's a quality enough bunter that he can still make contact and foul it and keep the at-bat going.

Garner really surprised me last night making the call in a 0-1 situation. I'm proud of him for that; it took guts. And I hope I'm not implying that it's impossible for the defense to stop... certainly, it isn't. But I think the odds really turn against the defense if the count is significantly in the batter's favor, and that's what irked me the most about the failed attempt last Thursday (as well as a few other times this season).

[The Cat]

Why Willy? He's one of our speedy guys and he plays as good of CF as anybody else, imo.

What good is a speed guy if he has no instincts and very little ability to steal bases?

Bruntlett plays good CF defense. Not great by any stretch, but good. And while Willy is a solid late inning defensive replacement, one out of Willy, Palmeiro and Scott will have to go down... and I just feel that Willy's defense is less important than the roles Palmeiro and Scott play/will play.

[Uprising]

Does orlando palmiero have a terrible glove? How come he never plays positions?

He is a great contact hitter. One of the best on our team.

[rocketfat]

Does orlando palmiero have a terrible glove? How come he never plays positions?

He is a great contact hitter. One of the best on our team.


oh, no doubt dude. palmiero is the man. if only garner would play him we'd be battling neck and neck with the cardinals right now!

here's to orlando palmier....baseball's best kept secret!

[The Cat]

Speaking of Palmeiro, apparently he's on bereavement leave from the team. Jason Lane is back from AAA.

[MadMax]

Speaking of Palmeiro, apparently he's on bereavement leave from the team. Jason Lane is back from AAA.

his father died

[Uprising]

am i still the only person on this board that understands that craig biggio is one of the worst players in the league? do him and ausmus have ANY pride whatsoever?

Yep...Biggio sucks! :D :D

[rocketfat]

Yep...Biggio sucks! :D :D


there's the hit that secures him the starting job through 2008!

[TMac#1]

they're really pounding pettitte. every ball is being smashed. If he gives up a second run, this game is over. :(

[TMac640]

there's the hit that secures him the starting job through 2008!

How is it that you haven't been banned yet? lol

[gwayneco]

THE BOOK says the Astros win probablity is 45.8%.

[TMac#1]

GAME OVER. :mad: :mad:

[gwayneco]

THE BOOK says the Astros win probalilty is now 29.3%

[Uprising]

they're really pounding pettitte. every ball is being smashed. If he gives up a second run, this game is over. :(

How about a 4th? :(

[The Cat]

Thank you Aubrey Huff... what an acquisition you've been. :rolleyes:

[rocketfat]

How is it that you haven't been banned yet? lol


why? because i'm realistic and not a blinded homer?

[TMac640]

why? because i'm realistic and not a blinded homer?

all you do is hurl insults at anyone that disagrees with you... how's that being realistic?

[WhoMikeJames]

Can someone give me an explanation of what happend to go from 2-1 to 4-1 i really don't get it.

[sammy]

Pettite is just flat out terrible - close to 36 million dollars for Pettite and Bagwell....2 guys that havent done anything for us

[rocketfat]

all you do is hurl insults at anyone that disagrees with you... how's that being realistic?


where was the insult that i just made?
you take offense at me insulting craig biggio? lol

[gwayneco]

THE BOOK says the Astros win probability is now 22.8%.

[DaDakota]

This year is not last year, this team just doesn't have that drive to win.

Wake me up in August if we get to .500.

DD

[ruddy]

Pettite sucks!!! what a waste of time and money!!!!!

[Major]

THE BOOK says the Astros win probability is now 22.8%.

You may want to get a new book if it said the Astros chances of winning went down from 29% when all that happened was getting out of the inning without allowing any more runs. :confused:

[The Cat]

Can someone give me an explanation of what happend to go from 2-1 to 4-1 i really don't get it.

Runners on first and second, none out. Bloop single into right. The runner on second (Dunn) isn't sure if it'll drop, so he holds. Scott throws to third, and has Dunn out by a mile. The throw is perfect. Huff just decides not to touch it and it goes out of play. That allows two runs to score and places the hitter on second base. So, instead of having a 2-1 game with a runner on 2nd and 1st and 1 out, we have a 4-1 game with a runner on 2nd and 0 out. All thanks to our great acquisition.

And naturally, Huff leads off the bottom of the inning with one of the ugliest at-bats I've seen all year with a K. Come back Morgan... :(

[Rox Addict]

This year is not last year, this team just doesn't have that drive to win.

Wake me up in August if we get to .500.

DD
Dadakota,
I think I might jump aboard with you and if the Stros get their heads out of there asses by August wake me up too !!

And why did I tune in tonight to watch this game ? :mad:

[gwayneco]

You may want to get a new book if it said the Astros chances of winning went down from 29% when all that happened was getting out of the inning without allowing any more runs. :confused:

It was 29% at 2-1 and went down to 22.8% at the end of the top of the 4th.

[ruddy]

I would be happy if Pettite retires right now!!!! what you think guys?

[Rox Addict]

Runners on first and second, none out. Bloop single into right. The runner on second (Dunn) isn't sure if it'll drop, so he holds. Scott throws to third, and has Dunn out by a mile. The throw is perfect. Huff just decides not to touch it and it goes out of play. That allows two runs to score and places the hitter on second base. So, instead of having a 2-1 game with a runner on 2nd and 1st and 1 out, we have a 4-1 game with a runner on 2nd and 0 out. All thanks to our great acquisition.

And naturally, Huff leads off the bottom of the inning with one of the ugliest at-bats I've seen all year with a K. Come back Morgan... :(
Its not Huffs fault !!!! Any player that comes to the Astros will automatically start playing like a little leauger...No I'm serious its some kind of hex or mojo...
I think Garner really is cursed.... :rolleyes:

[Uprising]

Dang, Rich has a HR, single and now a standing Triple! :eek:

[WhoMikeJames]

Hooray for 1 out TRIPLE!!

LOL Andy sucks... Thats just horrible

[Burzmali]

oh, no doubt dude. palmiero is the man. if only garner would play him we'd be battling neck and neck with the cardinals right now!

here's to orlando palmier....baseball's best kept secret!

Instead of just bashing all of the players, why don't you explain what you would rather have happen with regards to the lineup.

[gwayneco]

THE BOOK says the Astros win probablity is 14.4%

[TMac640]

Dang, Rich has a HR, single and now a standing Triple! :eek:

has anyone actually achieved a "sitting" triple?

[WhoMikeJames]

When its the top of the inning all i hear on the tv is single, single, single, double, triple, line drive, home run, error.

[Major]

It was 29% at 2-1 and went down to 22.8% at the end of the top of the 4th.

Ah - gotcha. I thought you had posted the 40% thing at 2-1 and 29% after it went from 2-1 to 4-1. My bad. I am a bit surprised going from 2-1 to 4-1 only drops it form 29 to 23% though!

[ruddy]

Why is Pettite out there yet? Man, this is painful....

[Uprising]

has anyone actually achieved a "sitting" triple?


I can't tell if you're being sarcastic or not. I referred to standing because he didn't have to slide.

As for the game. Springer is up and tossing after that RBI double by Dunn. ugh.

[gwayneco]

THE BOOK says the Astros win probablity is 10.5%.

[Clutch]

THE BOOK says the Astros win probablity is 10.5%.

Isn't that about our team batting average? Yahtzee! I'm feeling a win coming on!

[Rox Addict]

I would be happy if Pettite retires right now!!!! what you think guys?
Good ponit...Okay everyone lets look at the bright side. Roger, Andy, Bagwell, maybe Ensberg, will not be back next year. Do you know thats about half our payroll if not more. So we can go after the Sorianos, Tejadas, Dontrell, Big Free Agents. We then bring up guys like Hirsch and Sampson....The bright Side is that we can go after some big names next year. If Biggio plays at least as good as he has this year we can live with that if everyone around him is better. We can't have Everette and Ausmus back though because they have BA lower than most pitchers..We'll be fine not just this year...The Rockets are getting closer to their season and they'll be fun to watch, even the Texans so Screw the Astros because at this point they will eventually drop to the bottom of the division as the Cubs are even sneaking up on them..........

[rikesh316]

Astros don't re-sign Petittie. He is done.

[sammy]

Why is Pettite out there yet? Man, this is painful....

Pettite was great last yr but how many times are we gonna go through this....he is sucking it up hardcore

[gwayneco]

Ah - gotcha. I thought you had posted the 40% thing at 2-1 and 29% after it went from 2-1 to 4-1. My bad. I am a bit surprised going from 2-1 to 4-1 only drops it form 29 to 23% though!

I think I read the wrong column. Oh well, the Astros win probablity is about to be "turn out the lights."

[rikesh316]

WTF isn't Hirsh up yet? He has like 40 scoreless innings in a row at RR. Backe sucked in his rehab starts which should have tipped the Astros off that he wasn't ready. Buchoultz doesn't have the mental makeup yet. Gives up too many big innings.

[gwayneco]

THE BOOK says... 18.4%.

[WhoMikeJames]

*Prays for Willy to get a hit*

[Uprising]

Here is our chance! 2 on...NO OUTS!!! :eek:

Andy Pettite is done.

WIlly Pinch hit?! :eek:

[Uprising]

Now if we don't score a few runs here, we REALY suck.

Bases loaded NO OUT! :eek: :D

[WhoMikeJames]

BASESLOADED YOU KNOW WHAT THIS MEANS! Choke... or a grandslam from Berkman would be nice.

[Uprising]

there's the hit that secures him the starting job through 2008!


Look, there's another hit that is going to secure him a starting job.

RBI single! :D :D :p

[TMac#1]

Chris Burke..think back to NLDS game 5....you can help save this season

[Uprising]

HOLY CRAP! Who is this team?!!!!

5-4 now and 0 outs!!!! :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

[TMac#1]

Maybe the light turned on??? :confused:

Lets go Big Puma!! Give us the lead

[WhoMikeJames]

BERKMAN SAVES THE DAY :D :D :D :D :p :p :p

[Uprising]

CHOOOOOOOOOO CHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!

HR BERKMAN!!!! :eek: :eek: :eek: :D

[rocketfat]

god bless Big P.

[gwayneco]

THE BOOK says Astros Win probability is 80.6!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[TMac#1]

THATS A F.......N BOMB. JESUS CHRIST. 45O FT?

[WhoMikeJames]

THE BOOK says Astros Win probability is 80.6!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Hahaha

[ruddy]

Yesss!!!!!! Lance the man.

[Rox Addict]

THE BOOK says... 18.4%.
what are our winning percentages now ? :D

[Uprising]

WHOOOO!!!!!!!

Man this is why I love Baseball!!! 6 runs, 0 outs still.

452 feet is the HR by Lance! :eek:

:D :D :D

[The Cat]

Wow.

That's the kind of inning that can turn around a season.

Let's go bullpen.

[wrath_of_khan]

I really think Berkman is the most clutch Astro of all time.

That was literally a season-saving HR right there...

EDIT: Dude has 91 freaking RBI! :eek:

[BALLhog 247 365]

i really think this homerun is the turning point of the season

[WhoMikeJames]

Anyone else think that this inning is the start of a historic run?