Garner is the one to blame!!

[ruddy]

Hi people, I know that all of you will burn me for this, but belieme, this is necessary. I think it's time to jump on Garner, we had lost some games this season, and he's the one to blame. I'll start with Lidge.

1-The Lidge decline came from last year playoff, began with Pujols hr and follow in the Ws, where he blew or/and lost some of those 4 games. Then now in the regular season Lidge has record of 0-3 and 4 or 5 bs, Maybe there is at least 5 or 7 L to blame on Lidge, so why he insists with this? he don't care if Lidge keeps on with his frustration or whatever it is?

2-Garner's move of Right/left batter against left pitcher. I don't have to say much about this because all of us knows about this issue of Garner benching Lamb in favor of taveras or bruntlett, just because the pitcher is L. This is just Ridiculous!!!!!!!

3-Today situation where Garner didn't try to get munson to 3rd , with Marlins up by 1 run. . 0 out Munson at 2nd and Bruntlett batting. Bruntlett wasn't trying to bunt it!!!!!!! can you belive it? This is just unacceptable, there is more things but thats too much to tell. people do not pay too much attention to this things but those small details can make the diference. We would be over the .500 and atop of the wild card, just think about it.

[Rox Addict]

Hi people, I know that all of you will burn me for this, but belieme, this is necessary. I think it's time to jump on Garner, we had lost some games this season, and he's the one to blame. I'll start with Lidge.

1-The Lidge decline came from last year playoff, began with Pujols hr and follow in the Ws, where he blew or/and lost some of those 4 games. Then now in the regular season Lidge has record of 0-3 and 4 or 5 bs, Maybe there is at least 5 or 7 L to blame on Lidge, so why he insists with this? he don't care if Lidge keeps on with his frustration or whatever it is?

2-Garner's move of Right/left batter against left pitcher. I don't have to say much about this because all of us knows about this issue of Garner benching Lamb in favor of taveras or bruntlett, just because the pitcher is L. This is just Ridiculous!!!!!!!

3-Today situation where Garner didn't try to get munson to 3rd , with Marlins up by 1 run. . 0 out Munson at 2nd and Bruntlett batting. Bruntlett wasn't trying to bunt it!!!!!!! can you belive it? This is just unacceptable, there is more things but thats too much to tell. people do not pay too much attention to this things but those small details can make the diference. We would be over the .500 and atop of the wild card, just think about it.

read my quote under the Astros -vs-Marlins thread. I just said everything you posted and couldn't agree more...

[sammy]

Hi people, I know that all of you will burn me for this, but belieme, this is necessary. I think it's time to jump on Garner, we had lost some games this season, and he's the one to blame. I'll start with Lidge.

1-The Lidge decline came from last year playoff, began with Pujols hr and follow in the Ws, where he blew or/and lost some of those 4 games. Then now in the regular season Lidge has record of 0-3 and 4 or 5 bs, Maybe there is at least 5 or 7 L to blame on Lidge, so why he insists with this? he don't care if Lidge keeps on with his frustration or whatever it is?

2-Garner's move of Right/left batter against left pitcher. I don't have to say much about this because all of us knows about this issue of Garner benching Lamb in favor of taveras or bruntlett, just because the pitcher is L. This is just Ridiculous!!!!!!!

3-Today situation where Garner didn't try to get munson to 3rd , with Marlins up by 1 run. . 0 out Munson at 2nd and Bruntlett batting. Bruntlett wasn't trying to bunt it!!!!!!! can you belive it? This is just unacceptable, there is more things but thats too much to tell. people do not pay too much attention to this things but those small details can make the diference. We would be over the .500 and atop of the wild card, just think about it.

Ive felt for a very long time that Garner isnt a great manager. I felt his moves were the reason we didnt beat St Louis 2 seasons ago (putting in losers like harville and miceli) ...i guess his "gut feeling" was WAY OFF

As far as this yr....i feel like he has done a bad job...for example, it seemed like he has put Lidge into pressure situations when it was almost expected that he was gonna blow the save....i understand that he is our closer and he needs to be out there but is it against the rule to change it up like he changes the line-up everyday? Another thing that drove me crazy was when he kept sending Gallo out there when he couldnt get a left hander out if his life depended on it. Also, I agree that Lamb should be used everyday even against left handers....its clear he is our second best hitter.

Our bp is mad shaky so why go to them so confidently and so often? Even Clemens made a comment about this after he was pulled (in a quality start with a low pitch count) about the fact he was taken out. Listen to your HOF pitcher !

Garner's "gut feeling" is driving me crazy.

[Aceshigh7]

I agree that Garner has made some really questionable moves, but I don't blame him for having Harville & Micelli in during the St. Louis series. We literally had nobody else to use. I mean, Lidge was already pitching about 3 innings a game because our bullpen sucked so bad.

[Blake]

I fully support Phil, but this whole benching Lamb vs. lefties BS is REALLY pissing me off.

[gwayneco]

Surely it must be

BushHitlerRoveCheneyRumsfeldRicePerleWolfowitzHalliburtonCarlyle's fault.

[candlegreen]

Hi people, I know that all of you will burn me for this, but belieme, this is necessary. I think it's time to jump on Garner, we had lost some games this season, and he's the one to blame. I'll start with Lidge.

1-The Lidge decline came from last year playoff, began with Pujols hr and follow in the Ws, where he blew or/and lost some of those 4 games. Then now in the regular season Lidge has record of 0-3 and 4 or 5 bs, Maybe there is at least 5 or 7 L to blame on Lidge, so why he insists with this? he don't care if Lidge keeps on with his frustration or whatever it is?

2-Garner's move of Right/left batter against left pitcher. I don't have to say much about this because all of us knows about this issue of Garner benching Lamb in favor of taveras or bruntlett, just because the pitcher is L. This is just Ridiculous!!!!!!!

3-Today situation where Garner didn't try to get munson to 3rd , with Marlins up by 1 run. . 0 out Munson at 2nd and Bruntlett batting. Bruntlett wasn't trying to bunt it!!!!!!! can you belive it? This is just unacceptable, there is more things but thats too much to tell. people do not pay too much attention to this things but those small details can make the diference. We would be over the .500 and atop of the wild card, just think about it.


1. So... what to do if NOT Lidge? I agree that he's responsible for these losses, but stuff-wise, and experience-wise, I don't think the Astros could win without Lidge. He's just trying to roll the dice and hope that Lidge breaks through because he's that important to the Astros. Qualls/ Wheeler is just as hard to depend on this year.

2. For the most part, I agree. Garner seems to manage with his gut feeling. So, is having Lamb playing first and Berkman at RF worth having Lamb hitting against lefties? The game is not all about offense, and quite honestly, yesterday's 12 run burst proves that the Astros COULD play some offense. You have Buchholtz on the mound. Do you want to kill his confidence by giving up some unearned runs? It's just a decision, and some will backfire.

3. Here's the part where there are so many things that could come to play. In this situation, I agree that we could have moved him to 3rd. My guess is that if we do move him to 3rd, you end up having Everett bat, and allowing the opposition to take Buchholtz out of the game by not pitching to Everett. It was still in the 6th inning where 1 run really should've have been the difference. I think in that scenario, he's trying to get an inning going by batting Bruntlett, who has decent contact for the most part, and having Everett utilize his speed in a bunt situation. Also, Buchholtz was at 90 pitches at that point, so I'm not sure if Garner still wanted another inning out of him. We lost the game because Wandy failed as a long relief, then we allowed the floodgates to open with runs in every inning for awhile. If we're playing for 1 point, the results might have been different.

I can agree or disagree with Garner all I want, but the fact is, he goes with his emotions and his gut instincts to manage, and it's gotten us farther than we've ever gotten so far. Some moves has paid off this season, but of course, that's mute when they just lost a game. People want to blame him for stuff that he chanced on and backfired. It's almost the same as the JVG threads and how he always want to do stuff so fundamentally and not change things a bit. Garner is doing that, and sometimes, it backfires.... So now we want someone who does the "obvious" all the time? Teams will struggle, teams will lose games. In fact, 8 teams a year makes it to the playoffs in the Major Leagues. Please stop blaming every nonsuccessful PORTIONS of a season on owner, manager, GM, player, mascot, dugout telephone, player's wives, the numbers on the uniforms....

[Groogrux]

Surely it must be

BushHitlerRoveCheneyRumsfeldRicePerleWolfowitzHalliburtonCarlyle's fault.

Keep that **** out of here. It's already getting bad enough without tired political sarcasm from someone who deems those who disagree with him as traitors.

[Harrisment]

Hi people, I know that all of you will burn me for this, but belieme, this is necessary.

Don't worry man, I totally belieme you.

[kaleidosky]

long

Glad you responded with something. I started responding 10 mins after the thread was started, but my post was getting so stupid and sarcastic that I just killed it. Didn't feel like explaining...don't like having to rationalize things that I don't think need to be.

Chalk me up for mostly agreeing w/candlegreen

[msn]

Keep that **** out of here.
Heh. I thought it was funny.

[ima_drummer2k]

I can't believe Phil Garner gave up that home run yesterday...on his first pitch!! Plus, he went 0-4 at the plate.

Fire Phil Garner!!!!111

:mad: :mad: :amd:

[candlegreen]

Glad you responded with something. I started responding 10 mins after the thread was started, but my post was getting so stupid and sarcastic that I just killed it. Didn't feel like explaining...don't like having to rationalize things that I don't think need to be.

Chalk me up for mostly agreeing w/candlegreen


funny.... throughout that post, I don't recall that one word(long) you quoted me saying :D

[TMac640]

Keep that **** out of here. It's already getting bad enough without tired political sarcasm from someone who deems those who disagree with him as traitors.


eh wasn't that bad, just thought it was an intriguing post from someone that doesn't know about baseball and should stick to D&D. :)

[JunkyardDwg]

While I think some losses can be attributed to managing, it's pretty damn silly to go blaming any one individual for the state of things.

Lest you forget, he is the most successful postseason manager this club has ever had; the same guy whose taken the team deep into the playoffs the first two years he's been manager. If the Astros fail to make the postseason this year should we just dump him? C'mon now. I may not agree with every decision Garner makes, but I bet ya every single other fan with every other team disagrees with their manager on occassion too. In fact between Garner, Everett, Ensberg, Asumus, Biggio, Lidge, the rest of the bullpen...ah hell lets just say everyone but Berkman and Huff (who hasn't been here long enough but will get his due I'm sure), this finger pointing is getting rather tiring.

[imoffg33]

ya i blame garner for our completely inept lack of hitting the baseball and our terrible bullpen. get real

[Hakeem's Dream]

It's Phil's fault now? Why can't people admit the fault of their individual favorite player instead of scapegoating our skipper. Geeze, get real.

[Buck Turgidson]

Starter lost control of an inning. Marlins caught everything the Stros hit. Stros bullpen didn't give them a chance to comeback. Long road trip = everybody has to pitch in, and several Stros didn't do a great job of that yesterday. And I don't know if anybody noticed, but the Marlins have a whole bunch of good young hitters.

Take a day off, get right, and kick the **** outta the cubs.

[Joe Joe]

It is Timmy P's fault. Players win games. GMs lose games by choosing the wrong players.

[ruddy]

Don't worry man, I totally belieme you.
What's up suc***, are you perfect?

[ruddy]

I didn't write about firing him, actually I like a lot what Phil brings to this team, I just think that he should change some things that are not working with our team.
While I think some losses can be attributed to managing, it's pretty damn silly to go blaming any one individual for the state of things.

Lest you forget, he is the most successful postseason manager this club has ever had; the same guy whose taken the team deep into the playoffs the first two years he's been manager. If the Astros fail to make the postseason this year should we just dump him? C'mon now. I may not agree with every decision Garner makes, but I bet ya every single other fan with every other team disagrees with their manager on occassion too. In fact between Garner, Everett, Ensberg, Asumus, Biggio, Lidge, the rest of the bullpen...ah hell lets just say everyone but Berkman and Huff (who hasn't been here long enough but will get his due I'm sure), this finger pointing is getting rather tiring.

[JunkyardDwg]

I didn't write about firing him, actually I like a lot what Phil brings to this team, I just think that he should change some things that are not working with our team.

Well that I absolutely agree with; enough of these Left/Righty matchups that are in no shape or form favorable to us.