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Peyton Manning: CHOKER or NOT

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout' started by Rocket River, Jan 16, 2006.

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Is Peyton Manning a Choker

  1. YES

    79 vote(s)
    52.3%
  2. NO

    32 vote(s)
    21.2%
  3. He still has time. . I'm gonna hold judgement

    40 vote(s)
    26.5%
  1. Rocket River

    Rocket River Member

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    IMO
    He is officially a CHOKER !!!

    Rocket River
    :mad:
     
  2. bigtexxx

    bigtexxx Contributing Member

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    great thread
     
  3. david_rocket

    david_rocket Member

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    I dont like Peyton, and I liked the colts lost, but the OL was bad, and the kicker did choke, but Peyton dont choke. thats my two cents.
     
  4. JumpMan

    JumpMan Contributing Member
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    No, because it's almost impossible to win a Super Bowl with an offense heavy team, you have to have at least a very good defense to win one and the Colts don't have one. Yes, because the Colts are supposed to win with offense, they spend most of their cap space on offense, they can't expect the defense to pull out the tough games for them when they can't score more than 21 points.

    He's screwed, he wants to win on his terms, with his arm and with offense, there's no way he's happy if they have to let go of Reggie Wayne and Edgerin James this offseason to sign an elite defensive player or two. He's not even happy letting the running game shine, only 13 carries for Edge this weekend, and instead of dinking and dunking to better field goal position, he wanted to go for it all with two bombs. He's a glory hound and probably a huge ******* behind the cameras.
     
  5. KingCheetah

    KingCheetah Contributing Member

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    Way too soon to call him an 'official' choker, but after last game we can talk a little smack.

    ;)
     
  6. pradaxpimp

    pradaxpimp Contributing Member

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    IMO, ur completely off base. The beginning of the season, people wanted to stop the pass and they dropped like 8 back in coverage, and all they did was run the ball.

    If you watched the game, they tried to establish the run, but The steelers have the 3rd best running defense and they definitely showed up for the game. They were forced to throw because they had to come from behind and they were down big. They didn't have the time for edge to rush this weekend, and when they did they stopped him. What else are they suppose to do, keep pounding away for 3 and outs.
     
  7. JumpMan

    JumpMan Contributing Member
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    I remember that, and I posted that I thought he did a good job, and was sacrificing his stats for the team, but I wondered if he would do the same in the playoffs. He didn't. On most of their offensive series they didn't run on first down, it was almost always a pass, James started up slowly, but eventually he got it going, and Manning still didn't give him the ball. Most of the three and outs you're talking about happened because Manning didn't complete his passes on 1st down, I remember noticing that, I'm almost sure that happened most of the time, look it up. How do you excuse his bombs at the end of the game? Another 5 yards and that Vanderjagt kick probably doesn't miss, he makes 95% of his kicks 40 yards and in, IMO he went for the glory there and a less selfish QB would have made sure they at least get in better field goal position.
     
  8. TMac640

    TMac640 Contributing Member

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    [​IMG]

    hands down the best picture of all time
     
  9. Rocketman95

    Rocketman95 Hangout Boy

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    No. Remember, he told us it was his offensive line.
     
  10. Beck

    Beck Contributing Member

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    Manning hasn't been great in the playoffs, but he has lost to the Patriots the last two years, and Sunday the Steelers defense was great. They found ways to get pressure on him, and we able to stick with the receivers long enough for the pass rush to get to Manning.
     
  11. insane man

    insane man Member

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    the defense only gave up 21 points.
     
  12. Beck

    Beck Contributing Member

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    and the Steelers were averaging over 29 points per game in their previous 6 games.

    The defense gave up the first 2 drives, and then made some adjustments to slow down the Steelers. In the second half, its tough to analyze since the Steelers pretty much sat on the ball and ran the clock out.
     
  13. DonnyMost

    DonnyMost be kind. be brave.
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    Teams win games.

    Teams lose games.
     
  14. KingCheetah

    KingCheetah Contributing Member

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    The Colts have one of the top defenses in the league.
    _______________

    Dungy Finally Has a Defense to Match the Colts' Offense

    ...

    In his fourth season with the Colts, Coach Tony Dungy has finally built a defense in the image of his Buccaneers teams from the late 1990's - quick, hard-hitting and strong in pass coverage.

    link
     
  15. BobFinn*

    BobFinn* Contributing Member

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    Peyton blows. 3-6 in career playoff games. Eli will have a more super bowl w
    wins than Peyton, when they are both done with the careers.

    Face it — Peyton can’t win the big one
    Colts QB always blows it because of questionable decisions, poor passion

    Brent Smith / Reuters

    [​IMG]
    Colts quarterback Peyton Manning sits on the bench. After losing to the Steelers on Sunday, it's clear that Manning can't win a game that matters, writes NBCSports.com's Bob Cook.


    If Peyton Manning is considered such a great decision-maker at quarterback, then how come he left Sunday’s playoff game on the lap of his idiot kicker?

    Because it’s the playoffs.

    It turns out Manning can’t only blame Tom Brady for his inability to win in the postseason, or at least against a team that puts up a rumor of a defense. As Sunday’s 21-18 loss to Pittsburgh proved, Manning just can’t put together a consistently good game when the season gets to one-and-done. This loss was the worst of them all — not only because it erases the glory of the Colts’ 13-0 start, but also because the Steelers (and the replay official) in the fourth quarter did about everything they could to give the game to Manning, and he wouldn’t take it.

    You might say, wasn’t it Manning who rallied the Colts to a near-victory? Wasn’t it Mike Vanderjagt — whom Manning called not only an “idiot kicker,” but also a “liquored-up” idiot kicker, at the 2003 Pro Bowl after Vanderjagt ripped Manning (and Colts coach Tony Dungy) as too unemotional — who missed a game-tying 46-yard field-goal with 21 seconds to go?

    Well, yes. But Manning, starting in college at Tennessee, has made a habit out of digging a huge hole early in big games, then rallying just enough to lose respectably and stay title-free.

    (It’s been often noted that Tennessee won a national title the year after he left, under the comparatively ordinary Tee Martin, who has played all of three NFL games.)

    And near game’s end against Pittsburgh, Manning, famous for getting the final say on play-calls at the line, made a dubious decision that nearly killed the Colts and also put Vanderjagt in the position of doing what only Adam Vinatieri seems able to do — make a 40-plus-yard field goal late in a tight game. (Ask Herman Edwards, Marv Levy and Marty Schottenheimer about that one.)

    This is a good time to point out that for all the abuse the Indianapolis defense has taken over the years, in the playoffs it generally improves while Manning struggles. Look at some playoff scores: a 19-16 home loss to Tennessee in 1999; a 23-17 loss at Miami in 2000; a 24-14 loss at New England in 2003, and a 20-3 loss at New England last year. The defense had its troubles, particularly in stopping the run, but all things considered, it at least kept the score low enough to give Manning some help, which he hasn’t taken.

    Manning is 3-6 in the playoffs; in the three wins, the Colts averaged nearly 43 points, and in the six losses, they averaged about 13. Manning makes it worse by not adjusting his play-calling to find ways to sustain long drives when it’s clear the defense is wheezing.

    Maybe part of Manning’s problem is that he seems to treat playoff games with the same intensity as regular-season games. He only brings the level of urgency in a win-or-out situation when it’s late — such as when he waved the punting unit off the field near the end of the third quarter on a fourth-and-2 in Colts territory. Manning completed a pass to Brandon Stokely to get the first down. Yet where was that fire earlier in the game?

    Maybe Vanderjagt is right that Manning — and Dungy — lack intensity. You mean Dungy really was going to punt on fourth-and-short, from anywhere, with his team down 21-3 late? (Lest you think I’m being heartless for going after Dungy and the Colts after the recent suicide of Dungy’s oldest son, I repeat: this tendency is not new.)

    Perhaps that lack of intensity explains why Manning fails against a defense with some level of talent.

    Or maybe it’s more of a lack of confidence, in himself, and his teammates.

    For all of Manning’s famed improvisational skills in play-calling before the snap, Manning loses all composure if the play doesn’t develop as planned after the snap. It’s not just that Manning is not very mobile.

    It’s that the offense is based on timing, and any disruption of timing sends Manning into a panic. It also turns him against his teammates.

    Rather than try to inspire his Colts when they’re behind, Manning tends to go into a shell and wonder why everybody else is screwing up.

    “I’m looking for a safe word here, I don’t want to be a bad teammate,” Manning told reporters after being asked about Indianapolis’ blown blocking assignments. “Pittsburgh gave us trouble and put us in some situations we’re not usually in.”

    Pittsburgh linebacker Joey Porter was right — the Colts are a finesse team, only able to win by trickery.

    Manning took his first snap Sunday with the Colts down 7-0, and he started pushing the panic button immediately. Manning chicken-danced his team to eight passing calls and only three runs. Sure, Edgerrin James ran for only five yards, but the passing plays weren’t any better. Manning, pressured relentlessly by the Pittsburgh line and some combination of blitzers, completed only two-of-six first-quarter passes for 37 yards, and was sacked twice for 17 yards.

    (Recall that Pittsburgh already lost 26-7 at Indianapolis in the regular season, so the Steelers knew they had better jump ahead early, or else Manning would settle into a groove.)

    Manning clanked three more passes in the second quarter before deciding maybe running might be worth a try. James ran seven times for 42 yards, the threat of his legs helping Manning go 6-for-6 for 49 yards, as the Colts drove from their own 2 for a nine-minute, thirty-second drive.

    Alas, a James Mungro touchdown run got called back because of left tackle Tarik Glenn’s false start penalty, and the drive stalled at the Steelers 2, forcing a Vanderjagt field goal with 1:20 left in the half.

    Manning started the third quarter like he started the first — he stunk.

    The Steelers’ final touchdown was set up by a “drive” that started at the Colts’ 9, and went clank, clank, sack, with the ensuing punt giving the Steelers only 30 yards to go to the end zone and take a 21-3 lead.

    Manning’s 50-yard pass-and-run to tight end Dallas Clark finished his “get-the-punt-team-off-the-field” drive to close the margin to 21-10.

    But cutting the deficit to 21-18 only came thanks to a dubious replay reversal of a Troy Palamolu interception. Getting into position for the field goal came only because the Colts’ Gary Brackett forced a Jerome Bettis fumble near the goal line with 1:20 to go, a fumble cornerback Nick Harper returned to the Indianapolis 42. Manning was getting gold and frankincense, with myrrh was on the way, yet he wasn’t willing to accept his heavenly gifts.

    With 31 seconds left, Manning had the Colts on the Pittsburgh 28, second down and two yards to go, with two timeouts. Manning’s pass to Reggie Wayne in the end zone was broken up. Not a terrible decision — go for a touchdown and see what happens.

    But on third-and-2, with 25 seconds left and two times out, Manning threw an out to Wayne that was nearly intercepted. The question is, why throw that pass? Manning could have run James out of the shotgun to pick up enough for the first down, particularly with Pittsburgh playing for a pass, then call a time out. The Colts could have run another play or two — maybe another crack at the end zone, or more James runs to make for a closer field goal, plays run to where Vanderjagt was most comfortable kicking.

    While Vanderjagt hadn’t missed a kick at home this year, his better days are behind him. Having James run might have seemed conservative, but the time for another pass play was after picking up the first down. At the least, that would have gotten the Colts closer to the goalpost. A 46-yard field goal is no chip shot. Especially not the way Vanderjagt pushed it.

    Vanderjagt legitimately should have walked off the field and kept on walking out of the RCA Dome, all the way to his native Canada, after missing a game-tying kick that badly. But the blame for the loss, again, falls firmly on Manning, who once again underperformed when the season was on the line.

    Maybe the Colts need to sign Tee Martin to finally get over the hump.


    http://msnbc.msn.com/id/10869075/
     
  16. Supermac34

    Supermac34 President, Von Wafer Fan Club

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    Early in his career Elway couldn't seem to win the big one. Then near the end he won.
     
  17. The Real Shady

    The Real Shady Contributing Member

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    Some players have the ability to raise their game in the big games. Some don't. It's obvious Peyton is the later. He was never able to win the big one in college either.

    Now on to a player who can raise his game.... Vincent Young. Get'er done Texans.
     
  18. JumpMan

    JumpMan Contributing Member
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    That's funny! Where's Ronde Barber? John Lynch? Warren Sapp? Donnie Abraham? Derrick Brooks? And all those other guys?
     
  19. Rocket River

    Rocket River Member

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    The defense gave up some bad 1st Quarter TDs
    then Buckled down HARD. The only other TD was on a shortened field
    THANKS to the Offense.

    I am hot tright now to be sure
    but
    Manning choked

    Rocket River
     
  20. BigSherv

    BigSherv Contributing Member

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    His O line is to blaim.
     

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